quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
We missed seeing you this year Larry! Yes, and everyone thinks that we all must live in the hotels on the strip. Little do they know that we also have a couple of the largest master planned communities in the U.S., more churches and horses per capita than most places in the U.S., the 5th largest school district in the U.S., the largest man made lake in North America-Lake Mead, a ski and snowboard resort just 45 minutes away from the strip that sits on a nearly 12,000 foot mountain-Mount Charleston, the Las Vegas Motor Speedway, a ton of golf courses-including some TPC designated one, a major University-UNLV with a dental and law school and soon to be medical school campus in conjunction with UNR, the Desert Research Institute, Nellis Air Force Base with its annual Aviation Nation show, five major national parks within a days drive, the Red Rock National Conservation Area, Valley of Fire State Park, a major U.S. airport, some of the very finest restaurants that can be found in the U.S., over 40 million visitors/tourists a year, a buttload of major conventions, etc. etc. etc. And those are just starters. Out by my place it's like living in the country, with horse properties, an orchard with all kinds of fruits and big vegetable fields, and lots of quiet. Oh, and no hurricanes, tornados, state income tax, snow, extreme cold or significant humidity, and 300 or more days of sunshine.

quote:

We missed seeing you this year Larry! Yes, and everyone thinks that we all must live in the hotels on the strip. Little do they know that we also have a couple of the largest master planned communities in the U.S., more churches and horses per capita than most places in the U.S., the 5th largest school district in the U.S., the largest man made lake in North America-Lake Mead, a ski and snowboard resort just 45 minutes away from the strip that sits on a nearly 12,000 foot mountain-Mount Charleston, the Las Vegas Motor Speedway, a ton of golf courses-including some TPC designated one, a major University-UNLV with a dental and law school and soon to be medical school campus in conjunction with UNR, the Desert Research Institute, Nellis Air Force Base with its annual Aviation Nation show, five major national parks within a days drive, the Red Rock National Conservation Area, Valley of Fire State Park, a major U.S. airport, some of the very finest restaurants that can be found in the U.S., over 40 million visitors/tourists a year, a buttload of major conventions, etc. etc. etc. And those are just starters. Out by my place it's like living in the country, with horse properties, an orchard with all kinds of fruits and big vegetable fields, and lots of quiet. Oh, and no hurricanes, tornados, state income tax, snow, extreme cold or significant humidity, and 300 or more days of sunshine.

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Originally posted by Jaglav:
In addition to all the places Use Enough Gun mentioned something that might be of interest to a number of people is a tour of the Nevada Test Site.

The tours need to be set up well in advance and if you are not a U.S. citizen you have to jump through a few extra hoops although relatively minor (My wife who is Czech accompanied on one of the trips I made there). The Department of Energy normally schedules about one a month although groups can arrange their own tour.

The tours are an all day affair with a charter bus departure from the Atomic Testing Museum (Just off the Strip).

I've been to the Test Site a couple of times and it is a really fascinating place with an amazing history.

Perhaps a group for SCI attendees could be arranged for a Tuesday before the convention?

You can find more information at:

Nevada Test Site Tours

quote:

Originally posted by bwana cecil:

quote:

We missed seeing you this year Larry! Yes, and everyone thinks that we all must live in the hotels on the strip. Little do they know that we also have a couple of the largest master planned communities in the U.S., more churches and horses per capita than most places in the U.S., the 5th largest school district in the U.S., the largest man made lake in North America-Lake Mead, a ski and snowboard resort just 45 minutes away from the strip that sits on a nearly 12,000 foot mountain-Mount Charleston, the Las Vegas Motor Speedway, a ton of golf courses-including some TPC designated one, a major University-UNLV with a dental and law school and soon to be medical school campus in conjunction with UNR, the Desert Research Institute, Nellis Air Force Base with its annual Aviation Nation show, five major national parks within a days drive, the Red Rock National Conservation Area, Valley of Fire State Park, a major U.S. airport, some of the very finest restaurants that can be found in the U.S., over 40 million visitors/tourists a year, a buttload of major conventions, etc. etc. etc. And those are just starters. Out by my place it's like living in the country, with horse properties, an orchard with all kinds of fruits and big vegetable fields, and lots of quiet. Oh, and no hurricanes, tornados, state income tax, snow, extreme cold or significant humidity, and 300 or more days of sunshine.

I knew it was more than just the strip, but really had no clue about most of the other places of interest.
Never been to Vegas & gambling doesn't interest me, maybe I need to check it out for ALL the other things mentioned.

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Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
Frostbit: I don't ski, and don't care to, and really don't understand your comment,

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Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
Nice to know. (Even though I don't ski) Best to you and your lovely wife.

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Originally posted by D. Nelson:
My husband and I attended DSC for the first time this year. We are both Life Members of SCI have attended SCI Convention for the 25 years. We loved DSC and will not go back to SCI.

Best regards, D. Nelson

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Originally posted by 470EDDY:
I just Loved the $14 Beers in the adjoining bars and restaurants around Mandalay.....it is getting worse by the year....and the Exhibitors are getting more and more outspoken about the fees to be there.....remember guys....it all goes on our tabs when the day is done!!

Cheers,

quote:

Originally posted by Wendell Reich:
I am not going to turn this into a thread against SCI, because, for the most part, I like SCI, but the obvious needs to be said.

DSC's show is approaching the size of SCI's. The quality is already there.

What will this scene look like 5 years from now? Will DSC show be bigger than SCI? Personally, I think so. Better. Definitely.

My opinion. Solely based on what I hear from exhibitors and attendees, and based on how the organizations price admission and how they treat the exhibitors.

In Dallas, we have a voice. SCI? We have a voice, but it is a whisper in a room of chest thumping SCI board members.

Who am I kidding. We have no voice with SCI. After the fiasco with SCI attempting to start a booking agency last year, the exhibitors had a chance to stand up and demand some changes. About half a dozen of us did, (Aaron Neilson who seemed to spearhead the effort and Jack Atcheson who did quite a bit and maybe a couple more who I can't remember, I stood up as well, but didn't put the effort and time in that these guys did).

In the end we accomplished nothing and SCI noticed. Now SCI knows where the bar is set and exactly how far they can push us. This did more damage to us as exhibitors than most of us realize. They have pushed us around as exhibitors for so many years. They act like the safari Mafia demanding donations or our booth space will be in jeopardy.

I know you attendees do not care to hear the bashing, but it will effect you because it will eventually effect the show.

SCI has the biggest and slightly best safari show in North America (I don't know about the European shows). And they will for a little while longer.

However, their actions toward the exhibitors are going to effect the quality of that show as more guys opt to go to DSC instead.

It used to be that the three shows were DSC, then Houston, then SCI on consecutive weekends.

Anyone notice how SCI pushed their show back farther away from DSC? Wonder why? I suspect to marginalize DSC, make exhibitors who can't afford to spend 5 weeks in the US choose between shows.

Well, some of them are choosing. They are choosing DSC.

There are some other changes that I have noticed the past few years. It's my "Scooters and strollers" Theory.

SCI is full of electric scooters for the older guys who just can't walk the floor. You just don't see that many at DSC>

DSC has more strollers than SCI. Many reasons for this, but the truth is that this is the new generation of hunters.

SCI's attendees are dying and becoming unable to hunt. DSC's are a new younger generation.

Think about that for a second.


I could be off base here, I could be partly right, or right on target. The next 5 years or so will tell.


I don't care for SCI's politics, I do wonder where the money goes, but the attendees like it, the exhibitors go because they make money there. Nobody forces anyone to go. But times, they are a changin'. The future of SCI's convention isn't as clear and certain as it once was.

Two reasons for this.
1. DSC's excellent job at promoting DSC and putting on a 1st class convention for the attendees and exhibitors.
2. SCI's refusal to notice DSC as a competitor. And don't for one second think that they don't view DSC as competition. We are talking big money here. If SCI want's to keep the "Top Dawg" position, they might want to rethink a few things.

Wow, this was much longer than I intended it to be.

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Originally posted by larryshores:
I know for fact that there were 391 OUTFITTERS on a waiting list to get into SCI. God knows how many non-outfitters. Sure sounds like DSC is killing SCI to me..

I think SCI is getting hammered here over some things they have ZERO control over like food and beverage prices, particularly away from the convention floor.

Do you really think there is some conspiracy on the dates?

I tend to agree with Wendell. The exhibitors had their chance and let it go right by them. That was a big mistake.

quote:

Instead of bitching about SCI here on AR hoping that it will catch the attention of SCI, maybe an organization of vendors/outfitters ought to fly to Tucson and meet with SCI officials and clear the air and request changes. It's that simple.

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Originally posted by 470EDDY:
It seems to me that the meteoric rise in hunt prices over the last few years is having a cooling affect on booking....even interest in looking.
It seems that many of the African Governments think that all hunters, Americans specifically, are a bottomless pit for money.....raising government fees without regard to affect on hunters acceptance. Doesn't work!!
When a Sheep hunt reaches the price of the average upscale car, SUV or Pickup....don't you think there is pushback?
Then there is the CHARTER add ons, RIDICULOUS!!!... and THEN the Dip,Pack, Doc, Freight Forwarders, Customs Brokers....and transport between each step added on....MORE PUSHBACK. Outfitters around the world are letting this HAPPEN, not managing this as in the past, and this is ADDING to the PUSHBACK...and if not disclosed and it comes as a surprise after the hunt....more fervor and anger...MORE PUSHBACK...and "I won't do that again!"
I CAN afford it, but I WON'T feed this greedy machine!!
Yes, the cost of SCI fees and donations also add to the costs to Outfitters....this goes on the tab in the end....it is counter productive.
Frankly, there is a point when wise hunters will seek other means to book their hunts, AND will avoid those who must exhibit to get their clients at SCI..."they are the expensive ones!!"....and maybe not the best in the business whose books are NOT full due to their reputation and results??
MAYBE WE HAVE REACHED THIS PLATEAU??
I know there are many who are Best in The Business, whose Books are FULL before coming to SCI....and are there only for Social purposes.
All of this contributes to attendance and buying...that's how I see it!!

quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
That is true. I drove by the ongoing Mandalay Convention Center expansion and construction every day. By the way, the SCI convention will likely never go back to Reno. Reno's Convention Authority and Airport Authority screwed themselves years ago by failing to make long term plans to expand the airport and the convention center and thus, lost SCI. It is old news.