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Allright.....I know this is NOT the reloading forum - but I KNOW that I will get better...."In the Bush and Up the Spout" info here that anywhere else. So........... here it is: Remember a few threads back about the "What range to sight the rifle in for Elephants"??? Don't start that again - BUT....after getting my .416 Rigby, absolutely through the same hole accurate @ 50 yards - I go to buy some more .416 400 GR, FB Banded Solids (Barnes) Notice the FB part. WELL.....THEY AIN'T MAKING THE DAMN THINGS ANYMORE!! What is this????? They are so accurate out of my old Ruger Mag it is scarry - Now they are not making them. Suggestions????? Back to the Round Nose Solids or What? Thanks guys! | ||
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First thing I would do is call Barnes. In the past when bullets have been discontinued they sometimes have some sitting on the self. I advise to anyone that shoots barnes in anything other than 30 caliber or 7mm in common weights to stock up. Barnes has for years been discontinuing things that seemed popular or that they offered for years. Now that they were bought out I see them streamlining their product line even more or only offering certain bullets in their loaded ammo line. | |||
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They discontinued the flatnose early this year. We were told at the shows you could special order them. Supposedly there were some feeding issues. I quit buying Barnes solids and switched to CEB. This is the links to CEB for the .416 Bullets. https://cuttingedgebullets.com...&key=DGBR_R03_BBW_13 | |||
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Just an " FYI ".. Lots of Bullet Testing going on over at the " Big Bore Forum : Terminal Bullet Performance " http://forums.accuratereloadin...3/m/2861098911/p/172 DEEP PENETRATION BULLETS: Cutting Edge Bullets .416 400 GR. DGBR R03 BBW#13 https://cuttingedgebullets.com...&key=DGBR_R03_BBW_13 PAPI | |||
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+1 for the CEB #13, an all brass, large flat nosed bullet. I'm shooting the 480gr. at an average 2173 from my .458Lott RSM and getting cloverleafs at 25 yards. I just came back from the range where I put 18 of them through my Lott for zero and checking feeding from the magazine. I polished the feed ramp and filed the right rail to get 100% feeding from a full magazine (the flat nose is so large that they tend to hang-up until everything is smoothed out). This will be my Ele load in 4.5 weeks. Mike ______________ DSC DRSS (again) SCI Life NRA Life Sables Life Mzuri IPHA "To be a Marine is enough." | |||
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Call them. I don't think they know how to use email. | |||
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Bean Counters are what is up at Barnes...Cut down on the sku's...make more money...make more profit... if you don't make bottom line we cut something else...CERBERUS captial managment. DRSS Member | |||
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Since CERBERUS took over their email goes to some central location and some idiots might answer. In the past I would get email replies within a day. I would get all my questions answered plus a ton more info. In the past if I load or bullet questions I would get a email from the head ballistics guy that would be several paragraphs if not pages long. Every possible bit of info that he would be provided as well as all the things that did'nt work. There would be nothing left to ask. Now you email for similar info your lucky to a get response. That response will be two sentences referring you to their manual. Even if you told them the info you want is not in the manual. Never has a big fan of Barnes. I like the bullet s but I could rarely find a rifle that shot them well. With the way things are going at Barnes now, I will only try their bullets as the last option. | |||
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You might wish to try some of the newer BT bullets. They might shoot just as well in your rifle. Also, if it is possible, try different seating depths. This does sometimes affect the accuracy of the load. | |||
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Thank you gentlemen for all the replies. Come Monday I will be 'ON THE PHONE' to them. I hope they have a box left. IF I have to I will mess with a new bullet....and seating depth....etc. etc. But Damn.......my present load and Barnes flat nose banded solid is absolutely shooting through the same hole!!!! ANYBODY GOT A BOX THEY WANT TO PART WITH??? | |||
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I have 10 bullets (400 Grain BBS) you are welcome to, if that helps. | |||
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If Cerberus does to Barnes what it did to Marlin, I'd find another bullet too. These equity partner groups are death on product quality. There is hope, even when your brain tells you there isn’t. – John Green, author | |||
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and THAT! is what is really up at Barnes Bullets! | |||
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Once the bean counters take over product quality, customer service, and niche products are all gone. They basically suck the personality right out of a company. Next thing you know Barnes bullets will be made out of plastic and built in produces in Vietnam.  | |||
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And then they will become more price competitive. The sad truth is that for everyone who complains that something costs too much, the next person complains that they are made in a developing nation and not the USA. It's a no win situation. (PS: I total agree about the bean counter thing affecting quality. /sigh. Happened in the company I work for. Thankfully new management came in and fired the bean counters!) Regards, Robert ****************************** H4350! It stays crunchy in milk longer! | |||
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No, not necessarily! Every instance I have seen when a company moves production from the US to an off-shore entity, quality suffers! | |||
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Thus price competitiveness is moot -ain't the same product anymore! | |||
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try the ceb as others have said and I think you will be pleased | |||
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Looks like there might be an opening for another high quality niche bullet maker opening up? I don't think Barnes was suffering financially when it was sold. There was nothing wrong with the Barnes product. The problem now is that as Jeff stated it ain't gonna be a Barnes bullet much longer. Look what happened to the Trophy Bonded line after it was sold out. they went from top notch bomb proof bullets to obscure bullets prone to failure in the course of one year. At what point do the bean counters realize that destroying your product to save money will eventually put you out of business? American auto manufacturers have playing on that yo yo cycle for years. Why not just build a quality product and stick with it? I guess I need to go get a Harvard MBA to learn the secrets of how to destroy a once good product or service in the name of proper business management?  | |||
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North Fork has the .416 FPS, but in either 370 or 430-grain weights. ------------------------------- Some Pictures from Namibia Some Pictures from Zimbabwe An Elephant Story | |||
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I was able to order the flat meplat 300 gr 375's directly from Barnes. It is my understanding that the flat meplat ones can only be ordered directly from Barnes, not dealers. Read the Barnes website. They imply that the round nosed solids are far better (they are clever in that "they" don't say this. They just quote others who do.) As you will recall, the predecessor to the flat based bullet was round nose. I assume that they made the switch to flat base only after they researched this. They sold these bullets for years and now we hear they are sh*t. If these bullets are so bad should they issue a recall for the flat bases??? This sounds to me as if lawyers have been involved. Are they worried about being sued over failure-to-feed issues? If the flat bases are so bad, why in hell did they switch from round noses to them and sell them for years? I guess this is good news for firms like NF and GS. | |||
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 i posted a about barnes bullet problems and you would have thought i called some peoples baby's ugly and retarded, now were finding out I was right  the baby is ugly and retarded | |||
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I was able to order the 400gr 416 BBS from Grafs. I don't know if these are the last ones, but they still had some in stock. | |||
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Brennan, If you are still having trouble getting what you need...call me on my cell buddy. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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   http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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 http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.html The New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List! Live Outside The Box of "Conventional Wisdom" I do Not Own Any Part of Any Bullet Company, I am not in the Employ Of Any Bullet Company. I do not represent, own stock, nor do I receive any proceeds, or monies from ANY BULLET COMPANY. I am not in the bullet business, and have no Bullets to sell to you, nor anyone else. | |||
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Barnes told my PH that they changed to round noses for "marketing reasons." I guess they look better. My PH also says that if a solid has a 30% flat meplat, it will penetrate at least 40% more. Further, any failures to feed are due, he says, to the front of the feed area getting dinged up. Both Barnes and North Fork flat meplat bullets feed with no problems in my .458 and .375. Indy Life is short. Hunt hard. | |||
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bcolyer,I have some left over from an April safari. If you cannot find any let me know, maybe I can help. They shoot one hole groups in my RSM too. Tom ...I say that hunters go into Paradise when they die, and live in this world more joyfully than any other men. -Edward, duke of York ". . . when a man has shot an elephant his life is full." ~John Alfred Jordan "The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest Rome become bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance." Cicero - 55 BC "The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." - Ayn Rand Cogito ergo venor- KPete “It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker, that we expect our dinner, but from their regard to their own self-interest. We address ourselves, not to their humanity but to their self-love, and never talk to them of our own necessities but of their advantages.” ― Adam Smith - “Wealth of Nations” | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting What the Heck is up at Barnes Bullets ??
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