U.S. SOCOM adopting the 6.5mm Creedmoor

10 June 2018, 19:52

Mike_Dettorre

And had they simply decided to spec'd out a new 308 round with modern propellants and modern designed high BC projectiles in 180/185 grain they would have achieved functional equivalent performance inside of 400 yards and about 90% of the performance inside of 1000 yards.

The 6.5 creed is really only superior outside 400 yards and you also have to ask if I am going to be shooting at 1000 would I really start with 6.5 creed and the answer is probably not.

http://www.bergerbullets.com/S...ipment-list-open.pdf

Mike

Legistine actu quod scripsi?

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.

What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.

11 June 2018, 08:16

Beretta682E

quote:
Originally posted by Mike_Dettorre:
And hand they simply decided to spec'd out a new 308 round with modern propellants and modern designed high BC projectiles in 180/185 grain they would have achieved functional equivalent performance inside of 400 yards and about 90% of the performance inside of 1000 yards.

The 6.5 creed is really only superior outside 400 yards and you also have to ask if I am going to be shooting at 1000 what I really start with 6.5 creed and the answer is probably not.

http://www.bergerbullets.com/S...ipment-list-open.pdf

I only shoot 110 to max 300 yards.

They both are the same to me.

I have a 6.5 in number 1 and accuracy is that of a hunting gun - kind of wasted in a 6.5. The blaser will be super accurate. Just another toy to play with but the 385 ruger grew on me so I am hoping the 6.5 grows on me.

Mike

Never mistake motion for action.

577 BME 3"500 KILL ALL 358 GREMLIN 404-375

*we band of 45-70ers* (Founder)
Single Shot Shooters Society S.S.S.S. (Founder)

Never mistake motion for action.

03 August 2018, 09:18

NormanConquest

True. A good case in point of over designing could be put to the Germans in war 2. They made the best weapons,planes,tanks,etc. But they made so many that were not interchangable in parts.We had a 1911 that although it rattled it always fired,noy like a Luger that was a premier of design but EVERYTHING had to be just right.I only mention this,even though I love the 6.5 projectile,I also know that too many calibres can cause a quartermasters nightmare + possible troubles for our troops. Having only .30 cal. + .22 cal seems enough diversity.

Never mistake motion for action.

Mike

Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer.

Never mistake motion for action.

02 November 2018, 19:40

RyanB

quote:
Originally posted by tiggertate:
To me, the funny thing about cartridge/caliber arguments in the context of modern combat is none of it has much to do with the outcome. Exterior ballistics is not a critical component of winning 99.9% of battles, much less wars. But over the billions of rounds involved it's possible that a 10% decrease in mass and 3% savings in powder might just pay for a complete re-invention of the small arms of the US military in a few decades.

Agree. Note though that in the context of SOF snipers the higher hot percentage with a better round might make a difference in some operations. Lower weight is also an operational improvement.

02 November 2018, 19:41

RyanB

quote:
Originally posted by Grizzly Adams:
quote:
Originally posted by dpcd:
The Combatant Commands can want and sometimes get, whatever they want but that doesn't mean the Army will adopt it.

Big thing about the military, you don't want a bunch of calibers in circulation. At some point, someone is going to get the wrong ammo, when they need it most, Fact of Life.

Grizz

Or look at it this way. If your precision weapons are in 6.5 no one can try to save a buck or a helicopter flight by telling you to delink machinegun ammo for it.