THE ACCURATERELOADING.COM GUN COLLECTING FORUM


Moderators: Saeed
Go
New
Find
Notify
Tools
Reply
  
303 British With Some History?
 Login/Join
 
Administrator
posted
Gentlemen,

Someone brought this rifle in here yesterday. It looks brand new, and never been shot. But, as we examined it closely, I found the following as you can see from the photos.

The Arabic plate says it has been awarded to a shooter as a First Place Winner in small arms in the Army of the Sultane of Oman in 1995.











www.accuratereloading.com
Instagram : ganyana2000
 
Posts: 66930 | Location: Dubai, UAE | Registered: 08 January 1998Reply With Quote
Moderator
posted Hide Post


Good Luck with that one! Some things are not worth finding (headaches). The only thing that appears to be truly "new" is that Serial#. The "U.S. Property" photo looks like a Japanese casting from the 1950's. Big Grin

Here we go: Savage Enfield No.4 MKI .303

"During the course of World War II, the No. 4 rifle was further simplified for mass-production with the creation of the No. 4 Mk I* in 1942 which saw the bolt release catch removed in favour of a more simplified notch on the bolt track of rifle's receiver. It was produced only in North America, with Long Branch Arsenal in Canada and Savage-Stevens Firearms in the USA producing the No. 4 Mk I* rifle from their respective factories. On the other hand, the No.4 Mk I rifle was primarily produced in the United Kingdom."

"The No. 4 Mk 1 saw extensive use with the Irish Army in the post war period. It was replaced in regular service in the early 1960s by the FN FAL, when the need for a more modern rifle was realised during the Congo Crisis. Examples continued in use by the Army Reserve right up until 1990, and despite its shortcomings as a military weapon by that time, it was popular amongst those who used it."
 
Posts: 11017 | Registered: 14 December 2000Reply With Quote
One of Us
Picture of El Deguello
posted Hide Post
I agree that looks pretty crude. I do know that Savage made some No. 4's during WWII for Lend-Lease to Britain, and these were indeed stamped "U.S. Property". Naturally, the ones furnished to England had to have the Brits' proof testing and ordnance markings stamped on them before the Brits could issue them!!

I have no clue as to whether this is one of those, but I have never seen nor heard of a Japanese copy of a British Enfield. However, anything is possible!!


"Bitte, trinks du nicht das Wasser. Dahin haben die Kuhen gesheissen."
 
Posts: 4386 | Location: New Woodstock, Madison County, Central NY | Registered: 04 January 2005Reply With Quote
Moderator
posted Hide Post
Only joking as to the Japanese castings. Back in the fifties any poor castings one came across read "Made in Japan" on the underside (including my toy soldiers). Since that time and to their great credit, they have managed to reverse the irreversable, in terms of popular opinion of their production quality.
 
Posts: 11017 | Registered: 14 December 2000Reply With Quote
one of us
posted Hide Post
The rifle should have a square S on the left side of the butt socket,that was Savage's mark.It started out as a #4mk1* 1943-1945.If any were made in 42 they were Longbranch castings until Savage had there equipment ready.In 1952 it went through Fazakerley (F) ,for a Factory Thorough Repair (FTR)
Upgraded to #4mk2 standards (#4mk1/3) which included hanging the trigger on the action instead of the trigger guard.
Nice Shape

Rich
 
Posts: 227 | Location: West Central Sask | Registered: 16 December 2000Reply With Quote
one of us
posted Hide Post
Saeed,
You have not looked at many #4 rifles. Most were war time production and they are "rough as a cob" though I am pretty sure that you do not know the origin of that saying. Pull the hand guard off of a lot of them and the barrels looked like they were threaded on the outside. They must have been finish turned at about .030" feed per revolution.
I have one with about .030" mismatch where the two cuts did not blend at the location of the steady rest. That barrel would probably look like a jump rope running in a lathe.
 
Posts: 9207 | Registered: 22 November 2002Reply With Quote
one of us
posted Hide Post
I know an old lady that worked at Longbranch during WW2 .Her job was profiling rifle barrels.She says they were cut in one pass.Chips glowing red coming at you off the lathe.
 
Posts: 227 | Location: West Central Sask | Registered: 16 December 2000Reply With Quote
one of us
posted Hide Post
I bet she kept her mouth shut while doing that.
 
Posts: 9207 | Registered: 22 November 2002Reply With Quote
One of Us
posted Hide Post
Rifle is a Lend Lease Savage. Marked "US Property" as you can only lend what you own. The markings on the muzzle are British Proof done at Birmingham when the rifle was sold on by one of the companies that bought up military surplus arms and sold them to the civilian shooter in England. Probably Parker Hale or A J Parker. If you look here the letters in what appears to be an X will tell you when that was done. If it is an O on the right 1963.

http://www.hallowellco.com/proof_date_codes.htm

The electric pencil engraving indicates that the rifle underwent a re-work or FTR "Factory Thorough Repair" at a British Ordnance factory - Fazackerley near Liverpool, and was converted to having the trigger hung from the receiver itself rather than hung from the magazine housing as when it was made. This re-work was done in 1952.

If it were mine I'd lose the horrible brass plaque! The stock is beechwood. That was probably done at re-work as the normal Savage furniture was, of course, American walnut.

This is a gun that "deserves" cherising. It was once one of the "tools of liberty" from the "arsenal of democracy" that freed Europe from Hitler.
 
Posts: 6814 | Location: United Kingdom | Registered: 18 November 2007Reply With Quote
  Powered by Social Strata  
 


Copyright December 1997-2023 Accuratereloading.com


Visit our on-line store for AR Memorabilia