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How easy is swaging for PP bullets?
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Hi,

I am interested in starting to swage for some of my BPCR guns. I was thinking about starting with paper patched bullets. How hard is it to swage these?

Are the presses that corbins sells a good investment or would a swaging die that fit into a standard press be just as good?

Thanks,
Brett
 
Posts: 152 | Location: Alberta, Canada | Registered: 27 April 2002Reply With Quote
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I can't really comment on your question, but if you look at the RCE web site, you'll see he's really big in paper patched bullets, so your answers may be found there.

http://www.rceco.com


Hunting is Exciting! Bolt Actions are BORING!
Don't Mix the Two!
 
Posts: 190 | Location: Manotick, Ontario, Canada | Registered: 24 September 2000Reply With Quote
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Ypu ask how hard; I've never done it, but the idea is to use pure lead, so I can't imagine it is hard at all, using a swage press.
If you're looking at it as an investment, that makes it alot easier: no way.
;-)
A pot and electric burner, mold, ladle and wheel weights are much, much cheaper.
But, if you get the $250 press, and $300 dies and shoot 100 bullets a week, then in a year your bullets will cost you a little over 10 cents each. But that's alot of shooting. If it's more like 50 a month, then that's more like 19 cents each after five years. You see where I'm going. And that's assuming you don't get adicted and start buying new point forming dies, a core cutter, software to fool around with designs, etc., etc.!


Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.
 
Posts: 2000 | Location: Beaverton OR | Registered: 19 December 2002Reply With Quote
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Buy the $300 press and $150 dies, make 100 PP bullets a week, and when you're tird of that ( is that possible) sell the swaging gear on eBay for $500. What I'm saying is that if you take care of your tools, they will never loose value. That goes for casting stuff, too, but lately the aftrermarket demand for swaging supplies and tooling has really been up.
 
Posts: 10 | Location: No. Minnesota | Registered: 26 June 2005Reply With Quote
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Excellent point, Paul. Although it will lose value, not much.
A person looking to buy a $250 press would be happy to buy a caerfully used one for $200. The dies though, unless you have a very popular set (maybe ULD 308 or something) you might get half what you paid. Nonetheless, definitely offsets the value.
And the more people that buy the press, the more used ones will be out on the market later. I think more people would get into it, even as a hobby, if there were more used stuff available.
(But as you suggested, it may not be possible to ever get tired of it, thus explaining the dirth of used equipment. And we're back to: don't try to justify it financially!)


Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.
 
Posts: 2000 | Location: Beaverton OR | Registered: 19 December 2002Reply With Quote
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quote:
Bullet_Proof


Hi guy Big Grin

I don't know what more i can add to the post
If your looking to start swaging Paper Patched
bullet's then like everyone here has said try Richard Corbins 1-541-512-0440 or go to his web site ...I guess it really comes down to only a few factors.. but that can be gotten to later.

If you really want to do this then take the tiem and dont just rush into it ..call Richard Corbin on the phone and talk to him or email him ...

You asked if the press's "Corbin" sell's..
Thats Davied Corbin.... are a good investment
..There a darn good press no doughts about it but i just happen to like the Presses made by Richard Corbin .. and yes its worth the trouble to buy a swage press wrather then us a reloading press since the Wallnut hills swage press can be used a reloading press as well
if you buy the extra parts to make it so .

Martin

Richard Corbin owns RCE Co
 
Posts: 1557 | Location: Home of the original swage | Registered: 29 February 2004Reply With Quote
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Thanks for the replies guys.

I was thinking about going with the csp 2 press because I may want to start swaging bullets for the bigger guns like my 577 sniders and 500 expresses.

But I am short on funds now so this will be a long term project of mine.

Thanks again for the help.
Brett
 
Posts: 152 | Location: Alberta, Canada | Registered: 27 April 2002Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Bullet_Proof:
Thanks for the replies guys.

I was thinking about going with the csp 2 press because I may want to start swaging bullets for the bigger guns like my 577 sniders and 500 expresses.

But I am short on funds now so this will be a long term project of mine.

Thanks again for the help.
Brett


-------------------------------

Copied from Corbin's web site:

The CSP-2 Mega-Mite press weighs 80 pounds. It accepts Corbin type -H swaging and drawing dies in calibers .224 to .720 (12 gauge slugs), as well as 50 caliber 1.5 X 12 threaded reloading dies, and standard 7/8-14 threaded reloading dies (with the adapter bushing provided). The press comes with a reloading adapter kit, which screws into the ram, and converts it from a 1-inch X 12 thread to RCBS-type T-slot for shell holder buttons.

This is really misleading ..
Can the CSP-2 Mega-Mite press swage from .224 to .720 Diameter bullet's .. Yes ......BUT..
your going to play hell trying to swage any
" Jacketed " bullet bigger then .585 diameter
sure you can swage as big as .720 but only pure lead bullets with " Out " jackets.
There really is no diffrents between the WallNut Hills press and this press . The wallnut hills swage press will do everything the csp2 does the diffrents is the die size and
if you stop... and take a good look you will see the thread diameter of the CSP 2 dies and the Wallnut hills dies are close to the same although the dies are larger in diameter the way the CSP 2 is made it really lacks the funtionablity of the wallnut hills press .

If ... you really are thinking about buying a swage press be it from Corbin Or RCECo. Drop me a line via PM .. those that know me will tell you its worth the time to talk to me .
But it all up to you .. You won't be sorry you did .

Martin
 
Posts: 1557 | Location: Home of the original swage | Registered: 29 February 2004Reply With Quote
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The "investment" math is really complex, but it works out in the long run, I think.

Let's say when you finally decide to sell, the stuff will only bring 70% of what it sells for new AT THAT TIME on the retail market.

But, please note that almost every year the retail price goes up. As an example, I bought both .22 and 6 m/m Corbin bullet-making dies in the mid-'70's. Retail (on special offer, but not as low as wholesale price), was well under $100 total for the pair when I bought them. Today the prices are, I think, over $300 EACH. So, if I sold the pair for $200 each (slightly under 70% of current new value), I'd have $400 in my hand, and a LOT of almost free bullets shot over the intervening years.

Same goes with my RCBS A-3 press. And most of my other good quality loading tools.

To me that says, "Buy the good quality specialty stuff, use it carefully, and reap the profits on both ends."


My country gal's just a moonshiner's daughter, but I love her still.

 
Posts: 9685 | Location: Cave Creek 85331, USA | Registered: 17 August 2001Reply With Quote
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.02 worth, my understanding of it is that the Corbin equipment will handle 1:20 alloys ok, and they do a fine job as far as I can tell. I do not swage my own, but designed one for my .44 mag rifle. Dies are at Montana Precision Swaging, I let them handle the grunt work. Results are here

I shoot pure lead, a friend uses 1:20 from the same source in a .45-70. 510 grain RN...shoot very well...so do mine...about 1535 fps at the muzzle, the .45-70 at 1600 fps. Luck to you. If you want to talk to Russ at MPS send a PM for the phone number. He doesn't do Online...




If yuro'e corseseyd and dsyelixc can you siltl raed oaky?

 
Posts: 9647 | Location: Yankeetown, FL | Registered: 31 August 2002Reply With Quote
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This is the 510 grn Straight-sided paper patch bullet from montana Precision Swaging, shot into damp sand at about 50 yds, MV about 1600 fps, recoil stout, accuracy MOA.

 
Posts: 625 | Registered: 20 November 2002Reply With Quote
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That's groovey! clap Now y'all know why they call 'em Hindenbergs! rotflmo




If yuro'e corseseyd and dsyelixc can you siltl raed oaky?

 
Posts: 9647 | Location: Yankeetown, FL | Registered: 31 August 2002Reply With Quote
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Classify this in the "haven't done it, but have read of it" category...

Depending on what caliber you are shooting, hopefully it's .458 (ie 45-70), as this is what I have read...

You can buy a tapered reducing die and "swage" (not really swaging)/size down almost any cast .458-.460 lead bullet down to .452 diameter. Then you can put a paper patch on it.

I read this in Paul Mathew's "The Paper Jacket" book. Going from memory, I think he wrote that the cost of the reducing die was about 2/3 the cost of a regular swaging die-and you can use the reducing dies in a regular O-frame reloading press.

At least you can try this angle with a moderate capital outlay. I THINK the source of the dies was Dave Farmer-but don't hold me to it.

I wonder if a .452 sizing die from LEE Precision would do it too. I am referring to the sizing dies they market for their"tumble lube" system. Not sure you you could feed a .458" cast lead slug into it, but for the typical LEE price (probably about $20), it may be an interesting experiment to run.
 
Posts: 304 | Registered: 20 February 2005Reply With Quote
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I have seen the Swage-O-Matic presses for well under $100 on Ebay.

Swage-O-Matic
 
Posts: 1254 | Location: USA | Registered: 14 June 2005Reply With Quote
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This is really misleading ..
Can the CSP-2 Mega-Mite press swage from .224 to .720 Diameter bullet's .. Yes ......BUT..
your going to play hell trying to swage any
" Jacketed " bullet bigger then .585 diameter
sure you can swage as big as .720 but only pure lead bullets with " Out " jackets.
Martin[/QUOTE]

Actually, there is a photo of a .720 caliber jacketed rebated boattail bullet on the site under the "rebated boattail" discussions that was swaged in the CSP-2 Mega Mite, current model. The earlier models were only good for up to about 512 jacketed bullets (50 BMG), and because of that, they have been redesigned for more power. A longer handle option (same price as the roller side bar handle, so it can just be substituted at the same price) is now available that provides about 125% more leverage
than the earlier version. You can swage a .72 caliber jacketed bullet now without undue effort. The old one was running out of steam about the time you got to a lead 12 gauge slug, but the new one makes 1-inch Gatling slugs with lead or up to about .04 wall jackets using the long handle and pulling with some effort. The Hydro Press would be the easy way, of course, but the Mega Mite can do it with the recent improvements.
 
Posts: 10 | Location: Medford, Oregon | Registered: 29 September 2006Reply With Quote
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Great success with my new old
Swag-o-Matic set up for .45cal. If you told me how well it would work I would not have believed it. I picked up some lead rods and cut slugs off as long as I could to fit them into the Swago at full open. They formed a smooth pill with no gas check or 1/2 jacket. 384 gr. paper patched them up and gave them a tumble with in a plastic tub with some Lee liquid alox. Thumb seated them over 65 compressed grains of Goex topped with waffers cut from a coffee can lid and a sheet of bees wax. One raged hole with 3 ovals. two more very close nearby with ancient metal sights at 50 yards. (old eyes as well) I have a few issues to work on that may even improve performance. like sandbags and a stable rest. The Swago is a great new toy. Cost me about $75 so far with 4 sets of dies. (grin) but the bug has bitten me as I just bought some standard swaging dies on auction. JB

That is my ebay Swag-0 on the thread two panels up! Nasty looking isn't it.... but what a group!


aka JBMauser
 
Posts: 13 | Location: Virginia, USA | Registered: 11 September 2006Reply With Quote
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