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HUGE AZ Governor's Tag Elk
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Green scored 471 and change.

HUGE AZ Governor's Tag Elk


Tony Mandile

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Posts: 3146 | Location: Glendale, AZ | Registered: 28 July 2003Reply With Quote
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That was some unsavory business.
Wow, where do I start.

The talk of driving that animal off so nobody else could shoot it there i.m.h.o. is the very definition of harassing wildlife, which is against the law in Arizona.

Arizona Harrassment of Wildlife Statute

Just because you have pictures of an animal doesn't make it yours and entitle you to act like a jerk.

Having to sit and watch that animal die for several minutes while they had a clear shot at it, and could have finished it off but didnt because some asswipe in the background is telling the shooter (not hunter) dont shoot you dont want to hit the antlers...

Uh, barf. barf sickening.

Beautiful bull, and I appreciate the funds that will be rolled back into the management here in Arizona, but,
what a pathetic display by all involved.

thumbdown thumbdown


.
 
Posts: 2154 | Location: Arizona | Registered: 07 February 2010Reply With Quote
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Originally posted by Thomas "Ty" Beaham:
Beautiful bull, and I appreciate the funds that will be rolled back into the management here in Arizona, but,
what a pathetic display by all involved.


Agree. I posted this on another site: "Three cheers for the elk. What a huge bull."

As an aside, one of the 'guides' is a convicted poacher.


Tony Mandile

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Posts: 3146 | Location: Glendale, AZ | Registered: 28 July 2003Reply With Quote
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Tony Mandile

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Posts: 3146 | Location: Glendale, AZ | Registered: 28 July 2003Reply With Quote
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20 people at the kill site, I assume all took an active part in finding, watching, tracking this bull? pretty hard to watch.
 
Posts: 4958 | Registered: 30 July 2007Reply With Quote
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I thought it was a guided hunt, which makes it okay in my book...but... I had no idea that it was a military-type black-op mission with a whole squad of bounty hunters.

I'm taking my oldest daughter on a LQ elk hunt in Wyoming in a month. SHE AND I WILL HAVE A GREAT TIME whether she pulls the trigger or not.

Zeke
 
Posts: 1502 | Registered: 27 October 2011Reply With Quote
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The shooter was Jimmy John Liautaud, founder of Jimmy Johns fast-food franchise operation.


Tony Mandile

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Posts: 3146 | Location: Glendale, AZ | Registered: 28 July 2003Reply With Quote
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Ms AZW was at the auction (I was sick) when he bought that tag. Lots of things wrong with that hunt, but it raised a lot of money for AZ.

JJ has also taken a lot of grief from the anti-hunting crowd; perhaps it has impacted him financially as well.

As for Jed Larson being a poacher, hey, at least they didn't hire Larry Heathington or book through Blair.


Don't Ever Book a Hunt with Jeff Blair
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Posts: 7351 | Location: Arizona and off grid in CO | Registered: 28 July 2004Reply With Quote
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A lot of horn for sure a great elk.

Makes me wonder if the shooter could have done it on his own.

I guess if you can afford the governors tag you can afford to hire all the people to hunt and find a bull for you.
 
Posts: 16530 | Location: wis | Registered: 21 April 2001Reply With Quote
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Pity and sadness
Is that what is trophy worth now?
Sick...


" Until the day breaks and the nights shadows flee away " Big ivory for my pillow and 2.5% of Neanderthal DNA flowing thru my veins.
When I'm ready to go, pack a bag of gunpowder up my ass and strike a fire to my pecker, until I squeal like a boar.
Yours truly , Milan The Boarkiller - World according to Milan
PS I have big boar on my floor...but it ain't dead, just scared to move...
 
Posts: 11911 | Location: In mountains behind my house hunting or drinking beer in Blacksmith Brewery in Stevensville MT | Registered: 27 December 2012Reply With Quote
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Agreed, was sickened and disturbed by the way the bull went down. He's riding a horse so does he have something wrong that prevents him from getting closer? Terrible.
 
Posts: 389 | Location: Murfreesboro Tennessee | Registered: 15 January 2005Reply With Quote
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Disgusting. JJ and this video could Be exhibit A of what’s wrong with hunting today.”Could I have another bullet....” WTF
 
Posts: 641 | Location: Wyoming | Registered: 04 April 2009Reply With Quote
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Amazing bull! Arizona certainly seems to have good habitat and good genetics
 
Posts: 703 | Location: England | Registered: 01 January 2010Reply With Quote
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Reminds me of the spider bull, shot in Utah. I guess if you have enough money and a army of guides/hunters to track and follow a animal, you can too shoot a world record bull elk.
https://animals.mom.com/inform...r-bull-elk-4744.html
There's more info on the spider bull if interested, search it.
 
Posts: 116 | Location: Colorado | Registered: 16 April 2019Reply With Quote
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Ridiculous. That is not hunting. Money bullshit.
 
Posts: 260 | Location: Clyde Park, MT | Registered: 29 December 2005Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Outdoor Writer:
The shooter was Jimmy John Liautaud, founder of Jimmy Johns fast-food franchise operation.


Tony, you nailed it when you said “shooter”. Jimmy John Liautaud is a shooter, but he Sure as hell is not a hunter. I have an acquaintance who has helped on a few of his ‘hunts’. They find a great animal, call him and he flies in, shoots the animal they take him to and then he’s gone, leaving them to take care of everything for him.
 
Posts: 3172 | Location: California | Registered: 01 January 2009Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by DLS:

Tony, you nailed it when you said “shooter”. Jimmy John Liautaud is a shooter, but he Sure as hell is not a hunter. I have an acquaintance who has helped on a few of his ‘hunts’. They find a great animal, call him and he flies in, shoots the animal they take him to and then he’s gone, leaving them to take care of everything for him.


What's even worse is someone who claims to be a great hunter AND shooter who turns out to be neither. Met one recently. Slob is too good of a term for them.


~Ann



 
Posts: 15749 | Location: The LOST Nation | Registered: 27 March 2001Reply With Quote
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But it wasn’t in a high fence area!
 
Posts: 860 | Location: Wichita Falls Texas | Registered: 25 February 2011Reply With Quote
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That riles me because it's not hunting in any manner. JJ couldn't and never could hold my jockstrap and I'm older than him and still hump them out.


Zim 2006
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Posts: 161 | Registered: 26 February 2013Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by DLS:
quote:
Originally posted by Outdoor Writer:
The shooter was Jimmy John Liautaud, founder of Jimmy Johns fast-food franchise operation.


Tony, you nailed it when you said “shooter”. Jimmy John Liautaud is a shooter, but he Sure as hell is not a hunter. I have an acquaintance who has helped on a few of his ‘hunts’. They find a great animal, call him and he flies in, shoots the animal they take him to and then he’s gone, leaving them to take care of everything for him.

Which, to be fair, he freely admits on camera.
Is it really all that different to, not all, but a great many African hunts, where PH, trackers and an army of support staff do the heavy lifting?
 
Posts: 703 | Location: England | Registered: 01 January 2010Reply With Quote
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Jabalihunter,

You make a great point. Many of these ethics are all a matter of degrees.

I took a 310 class bull elk in WY in 2015. 8 hour horseback ride in. "100% fair chase" I happen to spot the bull instead of the guide but it happen to walk into the opening. Could I have ever put all of the logistics together to get the camp set-up, likely find a bull without a lot of luck, etc? No way.

Now let's add a twist. What if the night before Day 1 of the hunt when we arrived in camp, the guide comes up to me and says "Hey, one of the other guides was scouting around yesterday and put really nice bull to bed about a mile and half from camp." Then the next morning, we ride to the spot and there is the bull in his bed and I nail him. He's turns out to be say a 350 bull.

If you simply consider the acts of the hunt is it any different?

So is it the acts of the hunt that bother us or the words spoken, personality of the hunter, and the money? such as:

1) The hundreds of thousands of dollars for the governor's tag?

2) The stupid comments of "Can I have another bullet"

3) The other guides comments of "You don't want risk hitting the horn" or words to that effect?

4) Is it the "negotiation" between the two hunters prior to the hunt about "don't scare it off, we will give you a replica set, you can film it"

The above items are all very distasteful but do the really change the substantive relationship in a guided hunt just because the individuals involved have "lousy personalities".


Mike



What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 100 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
 
Posts: 9317 | Location: Loving retirement in Boise, ID | Registered: 16 December 2003Reply With Quote
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To me, it is not #1 the actual money it's what comes with it 2,3,4 and a few more. I hope till I'm done hunting I never run into the situation the shed guy had being public land. A replica of the horns! That whole situation was strictly a pen and a checkbook. I wonder what those (helpers) really said when he wasn't around and had been paid?


Zim 2006
Zim 2007
Namibia 2013
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Argentina 2019
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Posts: 161 | Registered: 26 February 2013Reply With Quote
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Beautiful bull, sad set of facts regarding its demise.
 
Posts: 15945 | Registered: 04 April 2005Reply With Quote
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Posts: 9153 | Location: Back in the Republic of Texas... time to secede!! | Registered: 12 February 2004Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by dogcat:
quote:
Originally posted by ronco:
Reminds me of the spider bull, shot in Utah. I guess if you have enough money and a army of guides/hunters to track and follow a animal, you can too shoot a world record bull elk.
https://animals.mom.com/inform...r-bull-elk-4744.html
There's more info on the spider bull if interested, search it.


Agree. That is what came to my mind. That Spider bull was scouted and tracked for weeks prior to getting killed. There was a "team" after it.



One big difference, and I speak from experience since I had an archery tag on Monroe in 2008 when the Spider Bull was being hunted and actually know the real story about how that bull eventually got killed.

The guys who hunted the Spider Bull, including the tag holder, hunted their asses off For nearly a month, before Denny Austad shot that great Bull. I was archery hunting on my own at the same time and in the same areas. I ran into Doyle Moss and Kalin Lemon on different occasions while they were looking for that bull. Those guys were a class act. They offered me assistance if I needed it, both with finding bulls and packing one out if I killed a bull. They hunted hard until they found the bull and killed it. They were also pretty candid that, even though they were working hard to kill that bull, that whoever managed to kill the Spider Bull would be one very fortunate hunter.

In contrast, Jimmy John flies in at the last day, gets his ass hauled up the mountain to where the guides/actual hunters have been keeping track of the bull. JJ shows up, shoots the bull and acts like an actual hunter. IMO, he’s not. He’s a shooter, not a hunter.

Big difference in how these two great bulls were killed.
 
Posts: 3172 | Location: California | Registered: 01 January 2009Reply With Quote
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Exactly! tu2 In my opinion, I do love his sandwiches, but not his hunting ethics! Mad
 
Posts: 15945 | Registered: 04 April 2005Reply With Quote
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Target shooting at elk is what it was. Ive never seen so many people involved in an elk hunt. Looked like a football scrimmage.


The danger of civilization, of course, is that you will piss away your life on nonsense
 
Posts: 761 | Location: Baltimore, MD | Registered: 22 July 2005Reply With Quote
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Maybe he's a professional boxer and that's his posse. The posse goes everywhere with you hoping for a piece of the action and limelight.


"Evil is powerless if the good are unafraid" -- Ronald Reagan

Want to make just about anything work better? Keep the government as far away from it as possible, then step back and behold the wonderment and goodness.
 
Posts: 2680 | Location: Austin, Texas | Registered: 05 April 2006Reply With Quote
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He'll probably get a SCI award.

Dave
 
Posts: 2053 | Location: Seattle Washington, USA | Registered: 19 January 2004Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by nopride2:
He'll probably get a SCI award.

Dave


Maybe there should be a new SCI award for most people in the posse?


"Evil is powerless if the good are unafraid" -- Ronald Reagan

Want to make just about anything work better? Keep the government as far away from it as possible, then step back and behold the wonderment and goodness.
 
Posts: 2680 | Location: Austin, Texas | Registered: 05 April 2006Reply With Quote
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A few years ago in Zimbabwe I was on a buffalo hunt. We found a really nice ele bull whose tusks had to be 80# or more. The PH had a hunter coming in from Mexico after our hunt was over, primarily for elephant. So after my buffalo was taken, we sort of wandered about enjoying the scenery, shooting some plains game, etc. However each day the PH would locate that bull to see if he was still on the concession. And each day he would mutter "Pedro, please hurry."

We left, Pedro arrived 3 or 4 days later, and they found and harvested the bull as soon as possible, which was day 1. Turned out to be 86# as I recall. Anyway, this fabulous trophy was located (by chance) ahead of time, relocated regularly (and very carefully) until the client arrived, and then harvested. Not quite analogous with the governor's hunt, but there are some similarities. And I certainly don't begrudge Pedro or the PH for doing this. Lots of dollars involved and they help all concerned. Might have been a more meaningful hunt for Pedro if he hunted hard for 13 days and covered 75 miles on foot (my experience), but that's a matter of degree, not substance.

As to the governor's hunt, clearly that's a shooter's "hunt" like a lot of long range shooting shows we see nowadays on TV. And so long as the industry benefits and the individuals don't cheat on the regulations, I can't condemn. Not all that excited for the hunter like I would be under other circumstances, but that's not condemning the "squad" involved.
 
Posts: 655 | Location: Kerrville, TX | Registered: 24 May 2002Reply With Quote
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Guys,

I realize this hunt may be distasteful to some but it is the way that a lot of monster trophies are killed. There are many wealthy hunters out there that are willing to pay whatever it takes to get their trophy. The guides and outfitters need to make money so they are happy to go along with this type of thing and I can't blame them. I just can't get panties in a wad over it. If a client came to me and said I will pay $100,000.00 for a wild 400 class elk I certainly would be making some phone calls.

Mark


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Posts: 11882 | Location: LAS VEGAS, NV USA | Registered: 04 August 2002Reply With Quote
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I saw this I believe it was A3 outfitters. They do a lot of Gov tags in AZ and yes they use an army. Same way with deer, sheep, antelope etc. Big money and fame involved. I kinda glossed over the details as they are all usually similar but this sound like I need to watch the video. Great elk in AZ for sure. If what I read here is true (i'll watch the vid) then it does not sound like much of a hunt but not unusual as far as these auction hunts go. I have seen/talked to guides in camp during and after auction hunts and some of the stuff you hear is crazy. But if yiou are rich hey why not I guess if thats your bag.....
 
Posts: 2485 | Registered: 31 December 2005Reply With Quote
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Wow. A3 really going for the cash not the ethics. Pretty embarrassing and I'd say a bit of a a stain on AZ hunting but not the first like this nor the last. Sure there will be some discussion in the az hunt community on this type of operationand the similar sheep hunts.

Anyone recall what unit this is? 23?
 
Posts: 2485 | Registered: 31 December 2005Reply With Quote
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Many people that score a governors tag by draw end up selling it for $$$$,
The guys who buys it will take bids for guides to put him on the best area for a big Bull.
I have seen (by video) herding by helicopter and blocking by a team of people in New Mexico while hunting in a preserve. That had to be a State Government bribe.
Funny what character $$$ brings out in all parties involved in garnering these tags..
BTW: Not all cases but....

EZ
 
Posts: 2382 | Location: Texas | Registered: 06 January 2009Reply With Quote
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I have a friend who’s an elk guide that spends an enormous amount of time scouting and paying his guides to scout and video elk. His outfit consistently produces big bulls for their clients. He knows and identifies every bull his clients take well ahead of the hunt mostly without his clients even knowing. He cringes every time a client shows up with a shiny new long range rig and brags about thousand yard shots. Needless to say, he and his guides do their fair share of tracking after the shot every year.

Does that make his clients any worse than JJ, the same, or better since I didn’t spend hundreds of thousands of dollars?


All We Know Is All We Are
 
Posts: 1076 | Location: E Central MO | Registered: 13 January 2014Reply With Quote
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If the hunts are anything like this one then the same
 
Posts: 2485 | Registered: 31 December 2005Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by TREE 'EM:
I have a friend who’s an elk guide that spends an enormous amount of time scouting and paying his guides to scout and video elk. His outfit consistently produces big bulls for their clients. He knows and identifies every bull his clients take well ahead of the hunt mostly without his clients even knowing. He cringes every time a client shows up with a shiny new long range rig and brags about thousand yard shots. Needless to say, he and his guides do their fair share of tracking after the shot every year.



More and more guides are saying you draw blood, your hunt is over.


Don't Ever Book a Hunt with Jeff Blair
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Posts: 7351 | Location: Arizona and off grid in CO | Registered: 28 July 2004Reply With Quote
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John,

As it should be!

Mark


MARK H. YOUNG
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7215 GREAT DOVER ST.
LAS VEGAS, NV 89166
Office 702-848-1693
Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156
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Posts: 11882 | Location: LAS VEGAS, NV USA | Registered: 04 August 2002Reply With Quote
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Personally, I’d rather miss a spike bull I found myself by hiking in for miles and got within 10-yards than do a “hunt” like that.


John Farner

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Posts: 2878 | Location: Corrales, NM, USA | Registered: 07 February 2001Reply With Quote
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