I was wanting to change my powder I have been using on my 28ga. loads. I've been using 800x. I was wondering what some of you 28 ga. shooters use.

Alliant Unique or Hodgdon Universal Clays.

I use Longshot.

If you were loading only 3/4 oz. target loads, I'd say that Alliant 20/28 or Hodgdon Universal would be the way to go.

But for flexibility from 3/4 through 7/8oz. loads, Hodgdon Longshot is probably a better choice.

quote:

Originally posted by DaMan:
If you were loading only 3/4 oz. target loads, I'd say that Alliant 20/28 or Hodgdon Universal would be the way to go.

But for flexibility from 3/4 through 7/8oz. loads, Hodgdon Longshot is probably a better choice.

Yep! For clay target loads I use Hodgdon Universal. It also works fine for hunting loads. For stouter hunting loads you might want to use Longshot. On the other hand, Longshot is sometimes called "Loudshot" because it generates a lot of muzzle blast.

Thanks everyone, I should have stated that I skeet shoot with my 28ga. and I load 3/4 oz. Ill try your suggestions. thanks

I shoot skeet and I use Universal Clays for both 28 and 20 ga. That's the main reason I use it!
Peter.

ok, Im going to try universal, I have a Mec Loader, what bushing do you use for this powder.I'm loading 3/4 oz load. thanks

Basfshmn, what hulls, wads, primers are you going to use and what velocity do you want?

The difference in charges needed in a large volume Cheddite hull and a small volume Win. AA can vary quite a bit.

I think one of these bushings will be what you need:

Mec Bushing # using Universal Clays
#15 – 12.2 gr.
#16 – 12.9 gr.
#17 – 13.5 gr.
#18 – 14.2 gr.
#19 – 14.8 gr.
#20 – 15.5 gr

For about $45 you can get an adjustable universal bar and baffle for your Mec.

I guess that would help if I gave all the info. I still have the old win AA Hulls and use waa28 pink wads with winchester primer, never give the velocity much thought lol. I had a universal bar and give it to my nephew, he was wanted it the first day I bought it. I have never wanted to change anything since I set up my loader 15 years ago.

quote:

Originally posted by DaMan:

For about $45 you can get an adjustable universal bar and baffle for your Mec.

That's correct.

But I got one of those once, and then returned it after using it for only a little bit.

I found that getting the adjustment right took a lot of work and weighing of powder charges and then making small adjustments over and over again, and then weighing each charge to see just what change I had achieved, until I got what I wanted.

It seemed/seems to me that having a set of bushings on hand allows you to make different powder changes much more quickly and positively, for about the same cost in equipment. (For changes in shot charge, you need to get different charge bars, but I prefer that too.)

quote:

Originally posted by Basfshmn:

I guess that would help if I gave all the info. I still have the old win AA Hulls and use waa28 pink wads with winchester primer...

For that combination you want 13.0 grains of Hodgdon Universal Clays; this will give you a nominal velocity of 1200 fps, which is the standard for skeet loads.

If you are using a progressive loader, those usually throw a charge that is slightly lighter than the charge listed in the Hodgdon loading manual for a given MEC powder bushing. But if you are using a single stage loader, those usually give you a charge that is slightly greater than what is listed for a given MEC bushing according to the Hodgdon manual.

I think you can be off by up to a half-grain in either direction without noticable effect.

My advice would be to get MEC bushing #16. I think it will get you nearest to what you want, regardless of which MEC loader you are using.

quote:

Originally posted by Basfshmn:
I guess that would help if I gave all the info. I still have the old win AA Hulls and use waa28 pink wads with winchester primer, never give the velocity much thought lol.

For skeet you'll want about 1200-1230 fps.

Here's a skeet load for the components you have.

Old style Comp. Formed AA hull///3/4 Ounce///Universal Hodgdon 13.0/// Win. 209///WAA28///1,200///
Remarks: psi: 10,800

So Mec bushing #16 (12.9 gr Universal)

But beware..... they don't make the old style AA hulls or WAA28 wads anymore! So you're going to have to find a new load when you run out of your current stock.

Thats great guys, I have a #16 bushing and just bought some universal today. And they say you can't teach a old dog new tricks.lol

One more question: I know they have changed the hulls on the 28 gauge to the HS. will that change my powder charge when I have to change hulls. Its not that critical right now, I have 2000 once fired old hulls and the wads to make them. Thank you so much for your info. I have a single stage mec loader.

quote:

Originally posted by Basfshmn:

One more question: I know they have changed the hulls on the 28 gauge to the HS. will that change my powder charge when I have to change hulls.

The Hodgdon manual lists a load of 14.1 grains of Universal with the new Winchester 28 gauge HS hull and HS wad, Winchester 209 primer and 3/4 oz. of shot, to deliver 1200 fps with a pressure of 12,200 psi.

When you are ready to switch to the HS hulls check the Hodgdon website for the most current reloading data. You will also have to change the wads as there is a different wad designed for the HS hull.

quote:

Originally posted by Basfshmn:
One more question: I know they have changed the hulls on the 28 gauge to the HS. will that change my powder charge when I have to change hulls.

The powder charges recommended in the new 28AAHS generally run about a grain heavier for the same velocity as the older style 28 AAs.

Doc Eby's load is right on for the 28AAHS hull and wad combination (page 46 of the Hodgdon online PDF data manual).
WAA28HS Hull///3/4 oz.///Win. 209/// WAA28HS Wad///14.1 gr Universal/// 12,200 PSI

The Mec #18 bushing (14.2 gr Universal) should be OK for the load above.

Do you by chance have a powder measure for rifle/pistol reloading? If so, I'd throw the powder charges with that and just use the single stage Mec for the other operations.

A rifle/pistol powder measure throws the charges a LOT more accurately than the Mec bushings and won't slow you up that much in low volume loading.

quote:

Originally posted by DaMan:

Do you by chance have a powder measure for rifle/pistol reloading? If so, I'd throw the powder charges with that and just use the single stage Mec for the other operations.

A rifle/pistol powder measure throws the charges a LOT more accurately than the Mec bushings and won't slow you up that much in low volume loading.

I don't agree with that advice, although I admit I've never done it that way.

I also use a MEC single-stage loading machine, the older Versamec. I have the loading dies for 12, 20, and 28 gauges and .410 for it, and I use it to load all those gauges. It takes me about 15 minutes to convert it from one gauge to another.

The loading stage right in front of the machine is used for all three: powder, wad, and shot. Put the shell in place, lower the handle, push the bar one way and the powder is dropped. Then raise the handle, put a wad in place, and lower the handle to push the wad into the shell. Then, with the handle still down, push the bar the other way and the shot drops into the shell.

It's done almost faster than you can read this. Taking the shell out and using something else to do the powder charge would slow down the loading sequence considerably, for no advantage that I can see. Sure, the loads may vary by as much as 0.2 or maybe even 0.3 grain in powder charge from load to load, but who cares? These are shotgun loads, not precision rifle or pistol loads, and the variation is not noticeable in shooting the resulting shells.

Basf, I am not sure you are aware, but Universal is NOT the same as Universal Clays. FWIW, I use the exact same powder bushing for the old 28ga. hulls as the new HS hulls (different wads of course).
Peter.

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:
Basf, I am not sure you are aware, but Universal is NOT the same as Universal Clays.

A slight correction, Peter. "Universal Clays" and "Universal" are the same powder.

The original bottles were marked "Universal Clays", but folks were confusing this with Hodgdon "Clays" (which is a faster burning powder).

Old style bottle

New style bottle

28 ga. data on bottle

It's always best to refer to it simply as "Universal" to avoid confusion.

I stand corrected. I believe I meant to refer to "Universal Clays" and "Clays". I will double check.
Thanks, Peter.

thats ok Peter, I purchased the universal Clays and have already started shooting them. I have't really seen much different in using the 800x versus the universal clays. The Universal clays is more expensive than the 800x. I'll let ya know later how things are going.

I want to thank everyone for your input. Rick

quote:

Originally posted by Basfshmn:
The Universal clays is more expensive than the 800x.

Rick, ALL powders are more expensive than they used to be!

800X is also a pretty good 28 gauge powder.

But I think for 3/4 oz. target loads you'll find Universal more efficient and that it provides more consistant velocities.

Enjoy those old AA hulls and wads! I think they made a mistake when they changed to the new "HS" hulls.

New is not always better or more efficient.

you have made some very true statements DaMan, I quess everything changes over time.

Well, sooner or later you will have to switch to the HS hulls! I find them easy to resize and the new wads slide in very easily. However, the new wads are more expensive then their "old" counterparts.
Peter.

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:

Well, sooner or later you will have to switch to the HS hulls!

Unless you use the Remington STS ones, which may actually be better than Winchester hulls.

Brrrrrr shot skeet today, wow it was cold, but I have shot in worse. I've been collecting the new HS hulls got about 200 right now. So I'll be ready when I have to switch. I hate changing something that has worked for me, but I wanted to change powder and I'll have to change hulls eventually.
LE, the STS hulls are ok, but it seams I can get alot more reloads out of the winchesters.

quote:

Originally posted by Basfshmn:

LE, the STS hulls are ok, but it seams I can get alot more reloads out of the winchesters.

Go for whatever works better for you.

I haven't made up my mind yet which I prefer between Remington and the new Winchester. I do know that I don't like Federal hulls as much as the Remington and Winchester ones.

Yea Le I don't care to much for the Federal hulls either.

I shoot skeet almost exclusively with a 28. For handloads, I use Longshot, with AAHS hulls, AAHS wads and Winchester primers. All I shoot is 3/4 ounces of #9.

These loads were very well for my shooting.

I have nearly 3800 of the Win AA HS 28 ga hulls and they are hands down better than the Remington STS. I get from 2 to 2 1/2 times more reloads with the HS hulls than the Remington sts hulls. After 5 relaods the crimps are about gone on the STS.

When they first came out it was hard to find a powder that allowed a good crimp and it seemed the best one was Longshot. I was using either the PT 28 or the Claybuster clone of the Winchester at the time. The original HS hull was shorter than the old cf hulls and there was little hull above the shot to crimp.

Claybuster came out with their "A" wad and the height to the base of the shot was shorter and it worked great. They now have a "B" wad that has a slighter wider skirt to seal better.

I tried the 2028 powder and liked it fine but it got almost impossible to find last fall in big jugs. I still have some longshot left but I am going to use Unque when the longshot is gone. I can save $20 on a 8 pound keg by buying Unique and it is easier to get. As far as performance, I don't think I see much difference between them.

I have been using Fiocchi primers with my reloads.

quote:

but I am going to use Unique when the Longshot is gone. I can save $20 on a 8 pound keg by buying Unique and it is easier to get. As far as performance, I don't think I see much difference between them.

Yup.

The new Win 28 ga AAHS hull wins hands down for long life. I can easily get +10 Reloads from them. The Rem STS though a one piece designed hull only gives you about 5 - 6 reloads. The mouth turns brown and crispy and cracks at the folds very early on. I believe it is because Rem skives the mouths way too thin.

I have tried Universal, HS-6, Blue Dot, Longshot, 800X and have settled on 20/28 as my powder of choice. It's American made, uses less powder than some and is less costly. Unique is cheaper but I do not fine it as clean.

Like Customstox I like the Rem PT28 wad but the cost is outrageous. I have switched to the new "Revised" Red Duster wad it is molded very well and very slick.

That's what makes reloading fun, all the possibilities.