just fore the sake of argument what is your preferred source of ignition in a traditional ML and why

I prefer a flintlock because it is more "primitive".

I like the flintlock because it's just more fun. If you can shoot one of those with the flash in front of your face and wait for the main charge to go off, you can shoot anything.

generally a flinter, because it demands more "stubborn & skill" to do right.

Rich
Got both, and I was just fondling a Bill Large breeched barrel I found.

Put me down in the "rock lock" column as well. Hunting with a flinter has given me even more respect for my forefathers...

Mark

I like to point out to people that in 30 years of ML hunting, the only misfires I've ever had were with "them new-fangled percussion guns"! A well-made flinter is both a joy to the eye and to the soul.

Tom

I'll be a dissenter, I prefer a percussion gun.

I'll admit it, I'm not good enough to shoot a flinchlock.

Have one, can't shoot it.

I've run percussion and 209s but these days my muzzleloaders are flintlocks

The key to shooting a fliint gun is:

1. Loading- do not expect hyper velocity-to omuch powder creates excessive fouling, which makes any ML a bear to reload and clean. 70 gr FFG in a 50 cal w/ round ball is about right, tweak for accuracy, not velocity!

2. Use real Flint, not cut agate. A good flint will self sharpen as it snpas and will last anywhere from 20-100 shots.

3. Use a thin lead sheet as a flint blanket between the jaws of the cock and flint-leather, commonly used, allows the flint to bounce, reducing constant contact with the frizzen, reducing sparking

4. Do not comnpress the load behind the ball-pour your charge, start a patched ball and carefuly seat the ball on the powder-when you hear/feel that crunching sound, stop! Mark your rod and load to that point with that chrage.... Although BP has its own oxygen source, a highly comprtessed charge is scientifically harder to ignite and burn uniformly and rapidly-kinda like a slow rocket motor vice a quick even burn-you want the latter. CAUTION: ALWAYS SEAT THE BALL ON TOP OF THE POWDER-an airspace void can cause high pressures...

5. Select a ball that fits fairly snugly- a 500 bore and a 490 ball is about right in a 50 cal- a 495 probably is too tight, and use only pure lead. Your patch should make up the difference and add about 10 thousandths, it is wise to use a felt lightly lubed over-powder wad too, helps cushion the ball and keep the bore lubed ahead of the fouling. Remenber, pressures in a BP gun rarely exceed 15K psi, pure lead is malleable at about ~13K psi- you want the charge to just compress the ball into the grooves uon ignition, the patch is insurance!

6. Prime with the same powder you charge with- FFG for most calibers. Try it. Prime your pan to about 1/3 full. The flash and "brisance" of the prime ignites the main, not a powder train. Your flash hole should not be covered with priming powder-remember-"flash" hole?

Overall, A well designed flintlock is as fast as a percission lock using caps, and usually more reliable as long as basic precautions are followed-especially in humid or wet conditions. Have fun!

I can only repeat what I was told growing up: "nipples belong on a woman's chest; not a man's rifle...". My grandfather was a wise old man.

Rich

From a person I know that has caplock guns but tries his best to never be seen in public with them. He has been shooting flint since the 60s.


Speaking as a person who has extensive experience with many different flintlocks, I have a few comments on the flint advice:

Powder charge is dependent on the purpose of the load. A target load for .50 would be 55 to 65 grs, depending on the twist. My Montana barrel needs more powder because of its slow, 72" twist. A deer load for same is 90 grs.

I have used sheet lead to hold flints but normally stick to leather.

Priming technique varies with the individual firearm. The size of the pan, position and size of the flash-hole influence this. I usually use about a pan full but I like my touch-hole higher than the powder.

Recent electronically timed experiments published in Muzzle Blasts show that cap ignition is actually faster than flint but the difference is not discernible to normal humans. My personal experience is that flint ignition is more dependable for one shot as in deer hunting. Caps are more dependable for a string of shots as in 1830 combat or target shooting. The current prevalent use of 209 primers which throw a stream of fire a foot long certainly changes the equation.

I use fine powder such as FFFFg for priming. Yes, you can prime with FFFg or FFg but finer is faster. The best priming powder I have used is Swiss FFFFg but to be fair Goex is about as good. Swiss is glazed. They also make a an unglazed powder called Null B which is popular but costs $26 per pound. The coarse powders may have a slight advantage in really damp contitions but require a greater shower of sparks. My goal is to live long enough to use up my present supply of priming powder at my current rate of consumption. That should take me to about 125.

NBB

Locals going after Roosevelt Elk in the coastal woods are hard core. They're flintlock in the snow with traditional garb -- buckskins and moccasins, possibles bag.

It's an aesthetics thing. I have a percussion lock Dickies, and Georgia Boot footwear. They just scoff!

Flinters all the way. They are more reliable than caps except in the rain. And what will you do if you lose your caps? That long flash channel on percussion guns gets clogged up pretty fast. I can always find a piece of rock that will spark. We were in the Daniel Boone National Forest in KY last year and the creek bed we walked down was literally full of flint.

I have both, and frankly dropping the hammer with a good-sparking flinter is a lot more fun.

I have percussion on my traditional and a modern inline.

Flint!

It's hard to find real flints, I can only find cut agate stones. I've never tried them so I don't know if they would even spark.
I found my flints did not last long maybe 8 shots then the edge was so smashed up it would barely make sparks.

I've shot a lot of flintlocks in the past, but being a southpaw shooter, I have a problem with burnt powder in my face! Getting a left hand flintlock isn't an option, so it's percussion caps for me!

Has anyone tried shooting doves with a flintlock shotgun?

A friend, an Australian expatriate and well-known engraver who had once worked at the Tower of London restoring firearms, had a matched pair of high-quality 14-gauge shotguns from the early 1800s. He wouldn't use anything else on birds. I used one of them to shoot doves with him several times before he died, but never shot as well as he did.

Oh, yes. I preferred flintlock rifles when I hunted deer and javelinas with black powder thirty years ago.

Bill Quimby

BRQ,

I take my Tulle out once a year for Turkey and with my brother and his 'Bess for geese opening day.

Rich

Percussion!!! (at least for shotguns)

I hae a pair of 11 bores that I regularly use to shoot doves...What a hoot!

Flinters are way cool, but I have not been able to locate a shotgun good enough for hunting.

JW

I use both and like both. The only thing I could never bring myself to use is an inline with a scope. I like flintlocks better, but my best shooting ML is percussion so I usually end up hunting with it.

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
I can only repeat what I was told growing up: "nipples belong on a woman's chest; not a man's rifle...". My grandfather was a wise old man.

Rich

Or baby bottles ! ! !

Organic, or nothing at all.


Rich

raised on the tit, weaned on a jug and a fist...

Real, English knapped flints are not hard to find at all. Track of the Wolf, and others, sell them by the ton, as they are still made the same way, in the same place that they have been made for a few centuries now; from the flint nodules in the chalk deposits from England and France. Usually, gray ones from England and (these are hard to get), amber from France.

The preferred source of ignition for traditional ml's is depending on what period you are striving for. As for me I prefer rocklocks over those dang fangled cap guns. We have monthly shoots that are great fun at different yardages at novelty targets and woods walks at steel plates. All freehand with flinters and round balls really improves your skills. We have inlines and cappers show sometimes and they get their azz's handed to them all in good fun.