OK folks.....
I have read countless rants about the need for a "proper bedding job". I agree completely that in the hands of capable people, the stuff from the factory can be improved greatly.

Now show us a proper bedding job. I have read a couple hundred opinions that all vary to some extent, but no one has provided pictures of the finished product. I know I probably couldn't pick out a really good bed job at first glance, because I haven't seen enough of them to know.

Can someone show us non-gunsmith types what we should be willing to pay for?

Thanks,

atlasmlc--

A properly bedded rifle will have NO stress or strain on the action in any direction when the tang screws are properly tightened. That's it.

With a freefloated barrel all you have to do is loosen a tang screw and see if the action moves in reference to the stock.

With bedded barrels it's much tougher to determine and to attain.

atlasmlc,

I will take some of this from another post I just made.

Think of your rifle's action as a table with uneven legs. Thus if you lean on it in different postions the table moves about.

Will we class the floor as your rifle's stock.

Basically with bedding you build up the parts of the floor with epoxy resin so that the table will now remain stable irrespective of what part of the table you lean on or how heavy you lean on the table.

If I bed a M70 the "parts of the floor" that I build up with epoxy are the tang, that is the area around the rear action screw and also the part of the stock that is around the front of the action and under the front of the action.

Appearance does not mean much. You can have a great looking bedding job that is a work of art but is still a crappy bedding job.

Most of the variations you read about on forums and gun magazines are to do with the mechanics of actually doing the bedding.

Mike

Thanks for the insight. I'll take one of my rifles apart and take another look. If I remember correctly, one of them had just a little glass at the rear of the lug between the barrell and action (I'm guessing that is called the "front lug"), and that's all. No bedding of any kind near the action.

I'll use your table leg image and check it closely.

Thanks,
Mike

atlasmlc,

That is called the recoil lug and prevents the action from moving back in the stock. In the table and floor analogy that is the part of the table we have pressed up against the wall.

The bedding goes between the recoil lug and the stock and also on the flat section of stock between the recoil lug and the cutout for the magazine. It also extends up to the top of the stock.

Some people put masking tape on the bottom, sides and front of the recoil lug, so that the bedding compound only contacts the rear of the recoil lug. On a Model 70 you completely free float the barrel. You can either put some masking tape around the first inch or so of barrel or just grind out the epoxy when finished.

Some people also have the bedding along the sides of the action. I don't do that prefer to have clearance on the sides of the action.

Mike

[ 08-29-2002, 02:34: Message edited by: Mike375 ]

One of my rifles is a win70 with one of those winchester plastic stocks. Geez!! You talk about not bedding a rifle!! That thing has nothing in it at all. This is not one of the aluminum blocked ones, its just plastic everywhere. I am surprised it shoots the groups it does in the shape it is in. Guess I'll have to see just how much those groups can tighten up with a real bed job.

atlasmlc,

I posted on another thread that my experience has been that with top class barreled actions in calibers from 270 Win to 416 Remington that the "rubber" type stocks are the best for accuracy, followed by wood and then fiberglas.

With all three types of stocks, they were bedded correctly

With Aluminium bedding blocks.........they need bedding as well.

Coming back to the "rubber" stock for a moment, I think that it definitely allows a barreled action to shoot well even if the fit between action and stock is not good.

Mike

[ 08-29-2002, 11:19: Message edited by: Mike375 ]

I don't know if you would classify this stock as a "rubber" type stock. It is a winchester factory stock on their el cheapo "wally world" guns. I saw one just like it a few days ago. The fore end of the stock hits the barrel kinda cockeyed on one side. I will have to remove some material to get the barrel free-floated. I suspect that I cant do anything to hurt this setup. The only real concern I have is how much bedding to use. With the web-type reinforcement throughout the stock, there's lots of "pockets". I figure that it'll take quite a bit of bedding in some areas, but I'm not sure about how aggressive to go with it. Should I do this in stages? If so, what would be the initial area. Or would that just create "cold joints" that I would not want to deal with?
It seems like everytime I work out an answer 5 more questions pop up. Thanks for your help so far.

You have good info above.
I have done bedding on several of these Winchester factory stocks they can be tuff to get the bedding to stick fast. You need to rough it up, and I dont mean with sand paper. I had best luck with Marine Tex (Brownells)Bed the recoil to contact to the rear, with clearance on the bottom front and sides, bed the flat of the receiver behind the lug and the tag. Dont forget several coats of a releasing agent, (I use paste wax). I like to bed the first 11/2" or so of the chamber portion of the barrel aswell, some do this some dont.

HBH

atlasmlc,

I am not familiar with that stock. It sounds from your description that the area behind the recoil lug has "pockets" If so, that will be OK.

This is basically how you go about it.

Firstly, you have to clear the barrel channel so that the barrel will have some clearance for free floating. On these plastic type stocks it is easier to scrape the material out than it is to grind or sand it out.

After you have done that wrap some masking tape around the barrel at the part of the barrel that is at the forend tip. This is to line up the barreled action in the stock. Actually, on some rifles you can use the masking tape to lift the barrel action up enough so as to reduce or even eliminate the amount of free floating needed by scraping, sanding etc. You may also find that the stock at the forend tip has a raised section that is meant to put pressure on the barrel when the rifle is assembled. If this is the case then you need to get rid of it.

At this stage you should be able to put the barreled action in the stock with the masking tape in place and you barrel will be clear of the stock and nicely centered.

I generally find it is better to bed with the scope mounted or at least a steel rod through the mounts. Otherwise the rifle can have a tendency top see saw because of the weight of barrel extending out past the masking tape.

You now need some bedding compound. I use Devcon Steel Plastic Putty. I think Brownells sell different compounds as well. Stick with the putty type compounds as the liquid ones are too hard to use.

Devcon also have a spray on release agent. Some shooters also use floor wax. The Devcon type product is best as it is a proper mould release but the liquid floor waxes will work OK.

You now need to drill some holes in the stock where the bedding will go. With these plastic stocks the bedding compound does not really stick to them the way it does to metal, wood or fiberglass. Make the holes at angles. Where you have webbing in the action area, drill some holes through the webbing.

Also check if the part of the stock where the recoil lug fits has a section of stock just in front of the recoil lug. If so, drill some holes through that section of the stock. This alows mechanical grip to take place. Also, there needs to be somewhere for the bedding compound to escape because if the recoil lug is a close fit it will be a bit like a piston going into a cylinder. So make sure a couple of the holes are at the bottom of the recess.

The next thing is the action screws. I have screws with no heads on them. If you can get some action screws from Brownells this will make things easier.

On later Model 70s, the rear action screw hole is a blind one. So you are going to need some sort of screw into this area before setting the barreled action into the stock for bedding. It is also easier if you have a headless screw for the front of the ation but you can get away with just screwing the action screw up into the action when the rifle is set into the bedding because the front screw hole is not blind. Just make sure you put some oil or similar inside the locking lug area because bedding compound will flow up into the action when you insert the front action screw.

Of course the screws also need release agent on them.

The next thing is some masking tape is needed on one part of the action with a Model 70. If you turn the barreled action upside down and look at the rear screw hole area you will see that a small block of metal extends down a bit, maybe .2" or so. You need to cut a thin strip of tape and place on the rear of this block and just so it overlaps a little bit onto the flat section. I would use two thicknesses. This to prevent the rear of this block acting as a recoil lug. In short, there must be clearance between the rear of this little block and the bedding compound.

The next thing to do is to get some vaseline or wax or similar and rub it around the insides of the cut away for the magazine. Also put some on the bottom of the stock where the floorplate goes. Also put some on the sides of the stock above the magazine well.

So at this stage you now have the following in place.

1) The barreled action with masking tape on the barrel lines up nicely in the stock with everything centered.

2) You have bedding compund and release agent.

3) You have the vaseline etc. on the areas of the stock where you don't want the bedding compund to stick.

4) You have some sort of headless screw for the rear of the action and preferably one for the front of the action.

I would also cover the checkering with masking tape.

It is also helpful if you can have some sort of a setup that will just let the rifle sit while the bedding compound sets. I simply use the rifle rest that I use on the becnch with sandbags in it and a couple of sandbags under the butt.

Make sure you have all this orgainsed before you start the actual bedding.

Once you are happy that everything is OK and that you have release agent on the action and screws, now mix the epoxy resin and hardner.

When fully mixed, put some on the part of the stock where the rear of the action fits. After that is done, put some up in the front of the action and into the recess for the recoil lug.

When satisfied you have enough there, lower the barreld action into the stock. The headless screw in the rear hole will push its way through OK and the same for the front screw if you have one.

If you don't have a headless screw for the front, then simply screw the action screw in so as to push the bedding compound up and through the screw hole. Do not tighten the screw against the atock. The screw is just to keep the hole clear.

Note: You can block the action screw holes with tape, putty etc. but the big advantage of the headless screws is that they leave you scew holes ll nicely lined up and a drill will follow the holes.

Depending on the weather, it will take a bit of pushing down on the barreled action to settle everything down. Bedding compund will flow out the bottom and over the sides of the stock out and around the tang.

That is OK.

Now get some tissue paper and wipe off the compound that has flowed out. Do not worry about the bottom of the stock. You will have to wipe a few times as the stuff will creep up a few times as the barreled actions continues to settle. You will also need to make the tissue small so you can wipe right in between the action and stock.

After a few times the compound will stop coming up.

Now you wait until the epoxy is cured and do not touch the rifle while it is curing. You need to be careful about this because in the early stages of the curing the compound is soft enough that moving the rifle may move the barreled action but the compound is too firm for things to be repositioned.

So make sure that where you do the bedding is somewhere that you can leave the rifle undisturbed.

After the epoxy has cured, it is time to pull the rifle apart.

I simply put the barrel in the vice with the screws facing me. Break the crews loose and screw them out. They are fairly hard to unscrew as they cut a thread through the set compound.

You can now give the stock a whack on the back of the recoil pad, in other words, in a direction that trys to drive the stock forward.

Now grab the forend and butt and pull the stock off the barreled action. It can be quite hard and often needs a fair bit of a pull.

Once the rifle is apart, you need to drill out the screw holes so that there will be clearance around the screws.

The compound inside the magazine well will just break off.

If you did not have masking tape around the first couple of inches of barrel, then you need to grind the compund out so there is clearance. None of the barrel should be touching the beding compound.

We now come to assembly. Get yourself some fine enery paper and polish all the edges of the recoil lug. This prevents the recoil lug from scraping of any bedding compound when you assemble the rifle.

When you get the barrel action in, do up the front action screw very tight and then wait a couple of minutes and tighten it again.

Now put the rear action screw in and tighten it but not so hard. Now just nip up and back off the rear screw and check that the tang does not go up and down. If you put your finger across the tang and stock you should not feel any movement.

You are ready to go shooting.

When you shoot first up, check the front action screw. If you have done a good job the scew will turn in a bit more for a couple of shots and will then stay tight. If it does not stay tight you have bedding problems.

That is basically it.

Good luck.

Mike

[ 08-30-2002, 09:27: Message edited by: Mike375 ]

Mike375,
That is the most complete and easiest description of bedding a winchester that I have ever read. With these instructions, I'm anxious to give it a go, and confident that I can do this the right way. This will be printed and saved in my files for future reference. I'd encourage others to do the same.
Thanks a bunch.

atlasmlc,

The most important thing to watch for when fist bedding is to have everyhing lined up.

This is especially important on square sided actions like M70s. The reason for this is if you finish with things out of line, it can take quite a bit of time to grind out the bedding so as the action is free enough to allow everything to be repositioned.

One thing I forgot to mention is that if your M70 from "wally world" is the same as the standard M70, it will have a soft plastic type material in the recoil lug area of the stock as a very primitive form of bedding. This will usually just pull out and in fact sometimes it will come out when you first pull the rifle apart.

The material is often fairly thick in the amount of between the stock and rear of the recoil lug and so once you pull it out this will allow the barrled action to alter its position in the stock.

The are a couple ways to overcome this problem but the easiest for you will be to put a pin mark on the stock and a mark on the action when the plastic material is in the stock and you use these marks to make sure the barreled action postion is OK when you have put the barreled action into the stock with the bedding compound.

The main thing to remember with bedding is that as long as you have release agent where it should be, you can't really hurt anything.

At worst, you might have to rebed due to accuracy or bad postisioning of the action.

Mike