Gentlemen

I have been out looking for some nice Walnut (Juglans Regia)for gunstocks.

What are the hints about makeing a good buy. Who to trust and how much to pay.

There are manny sellers out there some are honnest other not soo honnest

Were does the price for excibition grade start

/ JOHAN

[ 04-08-2003, 12:31: Message edited by: JOHAN ]

I expect to be receiving some very nice French Walnut and I have not seen French Walnut for about 30 years, but I found some quite by accident....

All the blanks I have and have access to are laid out perfectly, and have a world of color, even in my lower grades....cost is $800. to $2500.

I only have about 5 blanks, and access to 25...They are 20 plus year old blanks. Very dry and harder than Woodpecker lips.

Atkinson

I see, what colors are they in? I prefer very yellow wood that has alot of black stripes and smoke pattern "burl" in them.

Have you ever used the california grown wood?

Are you sure that they are French? Some claims that most French wood has been exported from California to France and then back again

Ray
I thought some of the finest walnut came out of North Africa. I seem to remember a tale in one of the gun mags how Holland and Holland would buy walnut from all over but was especially focused on walnut from the Atlas mountains, etc, in N.Africa.
Jim

Johan:

Considering your location, look at Turkish blanks. The problem will be finding a supplier in Europe that doesn't try to rip your heart out.

JOHAN--

Here's one of the world's very best gunmakers that sells wood.

He sells NOTHING that's unsuitable for stocks......that's unique in the wood business where the best looking wood is sometimes totally unsuitable for the job. (take a look at Weatherbys)

Steve Heilmann site

JBelk

True, I have seen wood that been very nice, but the structure is wrong and it would have been a very weak stock.

Some blanks are contaning old nails, bark pockets, musket balls or bugs. It's nothing you would like to pay for

Are there any other reliable wood sellers in USA. Please state your favorite tope five. Still, were does the price starts for excibition grade

Gatorgordo,
Very true, I guess it best to get the closest to the root
There must be some good honnest dealers in Europe, but were??

Wood from NZ, Australia, Spain and Italy is often very nice, but not soo common in Sweden.
/ JOHAN

[ 04-08-2003, 22:13: Message edited by: JOHAN ]

Johan,
If you want a yellow/cream background and black marble cake then you want California English Walnut...that is its color....

French is orange-ish and black.

Turkish is a wonderfull wood but tends to be darker and brown..

All three are the same thin shelled waltnut tree and the name is derived from where they are grown and the color is from the mineral in that area...

The grain and marble cake etc. is determined by the severity of the conditions under which the wood is grown...A thin shell tree raised on the bank of a canal is not fit for a gunstock, a treee grown on the side of a glacier with temp changes from below zero at night to 120 degress during the day or even severe seasonal changes will make the best of gunstocks if properly cut..

To my mind marble cake is clown wood and does not exhibit proper grain structure for a gun stock...I prefer a more stable grain that has parrelle lines running from the toe up thourgh the wrist and then straight to the forend..I like the thin black streaking lines with a cream/orange or brown matrix...The blacker the stock the better, or the redder the better, either one...it should be hard as steel...I could go on forever on this subject but I won't.

JOHAN---

I don't buy wood unless I can fondle and slobber over it in person. I've bought from Ed Preslick for years but he doesn't have a web site. I traded for a few from Swede Swensen, but he's dead now. I know the Dressels and know they have good wood. Steve Heilmann is the only guy I'd trust to send me exactly what I wanted if I were buying by long distance.

"Exhibition Grade" wood means different things to different people. My favorite wood.......wood that I spend green dollars on, is hardly ever more than $500.

I'd rather have one blank of a really tight and solid, perfect quarter sawn, French/English/Circassian, with fiddleback, than I would two of the squirrely marblecake blanks selling for three times more.

So, "Exhibition Grade" starts at about $200 for me.

Another option would be Paradox - sometimes called Bastone walnut. It is lighter in color and makes a beautiful gunstock.

Johan,
You might want to browse the wood on dressels site here . It will give you some ideas as far as wood and types of wood. Bastogne and paradox is the same thing. I can't remember why Paul (Dressel) said he made the distinction. You will notice that as far as color a lot if it looks very similar. There is a lot of yellowish turkish with black streaks and there is dark chocolate colored
california English. The best piece of wood I have ever worked was a piece of Circassian that was honey colored. The second best was another piece of turkish I am working on now. It looks like marbled chocolate.

The best wood grows in harsh dry climates and is 100's of years old. The growth rings are very tight and close together and it is very dense. The wood in Turkey is sold out on auctions to cutters who have to guard it with their lives. A neighbor of mine goes each year on a buying trip and buys direct.

As far as Marble cake, it is slab sawn or close to it. As far as strength consider this. If a quater sawn blank fails through the wrist it will crack through the growth rings. You certainly don't want one that has grain running across the grip. A good quarter sawn blank has the grain flowing down the line of the grip making it stronger. A slab sawn blank is like a laminate, the plys are vertical and parallel to the centerline of the stock. They dont do laminates that way because they are weaker, it is because they are stonger. Look at a lot of big bores and they are often made from slab sawn wood. It can be fickle but so can quarter sawn wood. The marble cake you see is not the grain it is the mineral streaking in the wood. Go to Morris Hollowells site and check out the double rifles, you will see an equal mix of quarter sawn and slab sawn. Slab sawn can have bad grain layout if it is cross grained in a left to right direction or vice versa(lookind down), but it is obvious.

You also might want to check with a stockmaker closer to home and see where they buy it. My wood buying neighbor also buys some in Europe each year so it is available closer to home for you. I do not know what shipping would be on a blank. I do know they get mailed quite a bit oversees. I have an Aussie friend who was buying and shipping when he lived in Canada for a short time so it must be feasible as far as cost.

I have learned Jack's lesson about buying wood only after handling it the hard way. Got bit on EBAY by a blank that LOOKED good. So much for that.

[ 04-09-2003, 08:43: Message edited by: Customstox ]

Gentlemen

Thanks for you advices. I must admit that Walnut in yellow, orange with streaks or burl in black and brown is damn nice. The more you see the more confused you will be

Marble cake is nice but paying three time as much?, no thanks

Bastonge? The bastard wood? I rather go for the turkish or californian.

I have been visiting Dressels, Heilmann and a few other sites. I guess if you are lucky you can get very nice wood for 500$. Paul Dressel stated, from 500$ and up is were excibition grade starts, if you are lucky you can find a good piece for less.

Now, I have been flipping every stone and looked in every fox hole Sweden has to offer. No decent wood found
I guess Europe or USA are the places to look.

Has anyone dealed with Dakota, they have some pretty nice wood.

Customstox, on your website there is a tasty piece of wood. I think it's on your personal gun. What quality is it?, and how much did it?

/ JOHAN

[ 04-09-2003, 22:22: Message edited by: JOHAN ]

Johan, that piece of wood on the 7X57 at the top of the page cost me $250 if that is the one you are talking about. The one on my .280 Remington that I hunt with was $350 but both of those blanks were purchased some time ago. I am like Jack, the wood I like rarely costs me a bundle, it just strikes my fancy.

Bastogne is a better wood than the California English or Claro that it came from, don't discard it so quickly.

The following blank cost me $500 at this last years gun show in Reno. It is worth a lot more, at least to me.



The following quarter sawn blanks were purchased from Dressels for $450 and $500.

Don't discount that "bastard" walnut so quickly. Here is a link to a Encore stock that I had Bullberry make for me:
http://users.sisna.com/darty/encore_rifle.htm
Because the forearm would only work on the Bullberry / VVCG forearm system, I picked up some Bastogne off ebay for $15 that I made to work on factory barrels. This is how it came out, no stain or color:
http://users.sisna.com/darty/forearm.htm
I am interested in the opinions of JBelk or Customstox on this wood?

OldFart---

quote:

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I am interested in the opinions of JBelk or Customstox on this wood?

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bold font is mine.

Did Bulberry by any chance used to be Weatherby's wood buyer?

*I* wouldn't consider this a good use for that blank, but I'm pretty picky about layout.

The weakest part of the butt is also the smallest AND the portion most likely to take bending stress. It's not practical to reinforce it either.

I'm not an authority on Bastogne walnut, either.......but I'd call that Claro.

OldFart, it looks great. I imagine you are pretty happy and very proud of it.

Thanks for your opinions. It is a pretty chunk of wood, but I'm worried that it may be on the weak side, espically since there is not alot of grain running through it. But so far it seems to be holding up fine.

How is the strength of Broadleaf maple (the blondish stuff) and Myrtle? Thanks all.

Red

In addition to Dressel's & Preslik's, I've bought Turkish from Chiron (www.hunterbid.com), Bastogne & California English from Rimrock (www.mako.com/bastogne/rimrock.htm) and Heritage Walnut (www.heritagewalnut.com). You need to tell them just what you want, grain structure, layout, density, color, etc. they'll send pics and you can look on websites. They usually have big inventories. Also, look at the ads in Rifle Magazine.