My brother's father-in-law has an old beat-up Remington 1917 Enfield 30-06 that could use a major work-over.
Is this a worth-while action for a custom rifle?
I don't read/hear much about this action, most are M98, M70, etc., so I have no idea as to it's worth as a custom rifle.
It appears to me the rear sight will need to be ground off, a better trigger installed, a new bolt handle installed, and a cock-on-open conversion. Is there anything else?
Is it worth the cost of custom work? ~~~Suluuq

Rusty,

I've been looking into this myself of late. I have concluded that, while it won't be cheap, it is a worthy project. This action is uniquely suited to BIG cartridges; are you planning on a re-barrel or just use the 30-06 barrel? Even if you do keep the barrel, you could always rechamber. My father has one with the original barrel, rechambered to 308 Norma magnum.

Do you know who made the action (Eddystone, Remington, or Winchester)?

Good luck,
Todd

Rusty,

It will be a fun project. A couple of things. If you rebarrel. The threads are square buttress threads, and you'll have to file the notch in the barrel for the extractor. There's no room for mistakes here.

The actions are pretty hard when drilling and tapping for scope mounts. I usually anneal the spots for the holes. You can modify the "banjo" type bolt release to a 98 type.

Coon

Gents,
My favorites.....the P-14,And the Model-17.
I currently have them in -06,.303,375 Taylor,.416 Rem Mag,458 American,,,,and soon in 35 Whelen and .500 A-Square. A finer rifle was never built IMHO. Then again I am certainly biased toward a rifle that has been there and come home again. No Wal-mart rifles in my hands.
45nut

Coon,

Could you elaborate on the bolt stop modification? I'll be doing it myself in a week or two.

Thank you,
Todd

A-square used these actions in the past, and they were remingtons mainstay (model 30) years ago. As for strength check out the videos of the t-rex on the video page.

Thanks for the responses. As of yet, I haven't aquired the rifle, but may do so. Its made by Remington, BTW.
I'd dump the barrel and stock, and keep the action. Not sure what sort of cartridge this one may become. Unsure if I'd get it, though. I've just purchased a new rifle last week, so money is tight at this point.
What sort of replacement parts are available, for the "gun tinkerer"?
What sort of cost would a gun smith charge to make it a decent shooter, ie how does it compare to a Mauser in cost? ~~~Suluuq

Rusty Gunn,

There are no pre-threaded barrels that I know of; a standard grade Pacnor threaded and long-chambered is about $240. Timney makes triggers, and lots of people make stocks. The trigger guard is usually straightened (front cut and rewelded), which isn't too costly if you find the right person; an H&H length mag box is $15 at Numrich. The hole in the rear bridge is usually plugged and welded up, then ground to either an M-98 or Rem 700 contour. The bolt and safety don't really need to be altered.

More expensive than a Mauser, then again, you can't build a 505 Gibbs on a 98.

Todd

[ 11-04-2002, 15:58: Message edited by: Todd Getzen ]

Rusty Gunn,

As you have been advised, the 1917 Rem.Enfield action has the capability of becoming a big bore thumper. It might NOT have a duck pond dugout under the rear sight spring. Rem. petitioned the Ordnance people to eliminate this extra operation,which wasn't put on to lighten up the rifle and my long time ago pipeline to Rem.told me that this was about 54,000 Sn range. Certainly when they got to 6 digits it was all but gone. The cut will sometimes show up in 1917 production because some un-numbered nit-picky rejects that were corrected eventually got back into the production stream once corrected. If it hasn't this "feature" it is valuable as an action to those who are looking to make it into a big bore classic. The last prices I was hearing in about 1996 were $ 250 range REAR SIGHT EARS STILL ON without the cut. This because you can square bridge it without welding on the bridge. To remove the barrel without wrecking the receiver for eveybody; Fine tip Oxy/ Acy torch. Shoe shine strip cloth polish receiver ring and barrel at the joint. Hard , noisy flame on torch. Walkit around circumfrence of THE BARREL -NOT RECEIVER RING about 3/16 " away from joint. Heat color of the steel you want is light blue into gray. Tempering color of the receiver was well beyond this. This relieves the crunched stress in the barrel steel and brings oil from the SQUARE threads up into the joint. Time about 2 minutes and It will take less time to remove than clamping in barrel vise and hooking up the wrench. There was a several page article on one into .416 Rigby, Completed by D'Arcy Echols Petersen's Hunting Mag. Dec (?) 1 st yr of publcn. Hey , Good luck!

Years ago, Rifle magazine showed some pictures of a 1917 action that had been busted into small pieces with a plastic mallet.

I swore off them for life.

You do what you want to.

I would be interested in that article, I'd think that most bolt guns over 50 caliber use an Enfield action.

Any hasty wartime rifle could be a mistake in production.Bad heat treating or a bad batch of steel or both .The steel is nickel alloyed.Two books are Hatcher's Notebook and Dunlap's Gunsmithing .

I was perhaps too terse.

We are all right. Yes, the Enfield action can be an extremely strong one is often used to build the real big thumpers. HOWEVER, there are some dangerously brittle ones out there. The folks who routinely build them into major calibers also routinely hardness test them and magnaflux them. If you need the big action enough to justify the trouble and expense, by all means do it.

BUT, I personally would not sink any money into an Enfield action that had not had that done. The fellow who started this thread was concerned about cost and showed no interest in elephant calibers. He'd be a lot better off with some other action.

The P-17 is very expensive to make a really nice rifle from, but sometimes worth it.


This was the Number Four ACGG gun by Ted Blackburn, Bob Emmons, and Sam Welch.

They take a tremendous amount of work.

Leftoverdj,

You are quite correct and your remark makes a lot of sense that way, especially because you paid attention to what the end-purpose of this gun is intended to be.

There is a "sporterized" (read butchered) M1917 in the local shop for $339. I think it is too high. What say you all?

Hobie,

WAY to high.

Todd

I think the owner is trying to double his money......

Leftoverdj

I believe that article in Rifle you are thinking of busted up a low number SPRINGFIELD with a small hammer , not a '17 Enfield .

Thanks. Although he is normally reasonable, I can't get a good explanation out of him on this one.

SD, while I sure can't remember the details of an article I read 20 years ago, I know they busted an Enfield. Think they busted both. The problem was the same in both cases, poor heat treating. Eddystone was notorious for it, but it happened other places too. Wartime production demands, inexperienced help, changing metallurgy, and heat treating by eye created major problems.

I had a '03 Springfield trigger guard fitted to a fine Rem. 1917. JW Van Patten of Pa. did the work, looks like the original holes were welded shut and just repositioned.This was a popular modification in the 50's and its in a few of the old time gunsmith books. Got rid of the pregnant look of the magazine but the action is too big for a nice trim sporter. Also used a cock on open conversion from Numrich Arms (GPC)and a timney trigger that were both drop in conversions. Its a fine old sporter with the finish and bedding work done by Jaeger of Pa. but has a god awful rollover stock with white line spacers and tropical hardwood tip and cap. Quite the style of the 60's.
Bob

Here's some of my anecdotal Enfield stories. All of my modified Enfields came from my same gunsmith in North Dakota. He's been doing this for years and is pretty much retired now.

He's had plenty of 338/416 Rigby's that shoot well and safely. I own one and it works. I don't recall hearing any stories of failures due to action problems. I think that if the action were to fail it would usually be seen upon rework with the various tasks associated. For example, taking a barrel off of an Enfield is WORK. If it's going to fail it will probably fail at that step.

An example of strength. He used to have a lot of people come into the shop for a variety of tasks, especially leading up to deer season when he'd clean/zero all rifles. He has a range right there with a reloading area that will do practically anything. Anyway, he's usually very careful and has had precious few mishaps through the years, but he inadvertently loaded up a rifle load with some shotgun powder. The story goes that everyone heard the big BOOM and when the dust settled he had destroyed the stock into splinters, I'm pretty sure the barrel was ruined, but the action took that pressure pulse without error.

The Eddystones are extremely hard metal that require special techniques such as annealing for drilling scope bases holes.

The Eddystones and Winchesters both have the hole in the rear action area. He actually mills a piece of metal to fit into this area within 1/1000 of an inch such that Loc-Tite will seal it well. This is important as the rear base for a scope is often mounted in this area. This is also why Remingtons are the preferred action of the three as they don't have this hole and the labor cost is therefore reduced.

Back in the 60's and 70's he did a lot of Benchrest shooting/competition and did pretty damned well using Enfield based rifles. They can be incredibly accurate if done well.

That square bridge sure looked nice. I wish mine had that touch.

Lastly, I always remember what he told me when I first met him and was on a steep learning curve (I wanted a Weatherby). He said, "I could use any action out there but I use the Enfield because it's the best."

I hope that helps.

Reed

My dad sporterized a 1917 Winchester action right after WWII. It's been a 50 year project rifle for our family. Neat old gun! Still the original .30-06 barrel, but new trigger, Dad's walnut stock, old Lyman sights, a newer 3x9 Leupold on Weaver bases. I just put a new recoil pad on it because the 1950 version had turned brittle. Surprisingly accurate, this rifle did NRA highpower work for Dad in the 1950's, I learned to shoot centerfire rifles with it in the 1960's and 1970's and now it's a treasured hunting rifle. My son looks forward to trying it "when I get a little bigger" he says...

Time to time I consider turning it into a big bore something or other, but it's pretty doggone nice just the way it is. Regards, Guy

So, what is a fair price for a M1917 action (even considering regional differences)? I know that some department stores (such as Roses) sold these for $50 or so about 10 years ago.

I've long heard that Remington actions were preferred due to the lack of "hole" on the top of the bridge. What other things peculiar to this action should one look for or avoid?

As previously posted, apparently Remington got rid of the hole in the receiver about at the 54,000 serial number range. The Winchester and Eddystone always have it, as far as I know. I seem to recall the "shattering receiver" article as well, and I believe it was a Springfield that was used. The P14, which was originally chambered for the 303 (well, originally for the 280 British experimental military cartridge, but the 1st world war put paid to that, the rifle is a British design), has a more opened up bolt face, suitable for larger calibers. In fact, using P14 bolts in P17's was one of the things A-square did on their big bores. The P14 magazine box is set up for rimmed cartridges though, so will need to be replaced (unless you want to use it for a rimmed cartridge, a 450/400 say). The bottom metal on either is pretty sad, and should be replaced or rebuilt. I've owned a lot of P14's and P17's over the years and the most I ever paid for one (that wasn't already a custom rifle) was $90 CDN, which is about $60 US. The barrel should have the shoulder cut away in a lathe to relieve the pressure before you remove it, so if someone has monkeyed with it before, there is a possibility of a twisted receiver. If you search the posts you'll find a lot of info on the 14/17 Enfields. They really are great rifles. - Dan

Dan,

Thanks.

Gents,
So enlighten me a bit and identify a Enfield marked "E R A" TIA 45nut