I understand that USFAR single actions are a little stronger than colts, primarily because they use slightly bigger cylinders and their is a few thousanths of an inch more metal between the chambers and bolt notches. The chambers are supposedly cut tight as well. Their The top straps are supposed to be a little beefier. I know that they are safe with the old stiff Keith loads in 44 special. I would like to get some informed opinions on what kind of pressures these pistols can take in 45 Colt? I don't want to turn mine into a Ruger, but I would like to find a good strong load with 300gr LBT WFN's for use on Elk in close quarters if the opportunity arises. Thanks for your comments.

I would not fire any loaded stiffer than the factory load in any Colt SAA or it's clones. Many of these come from Italy and other european countries.

The Ruger blackhawk will handle much stiffer loads and the difference is not a little.....that thing is built a lot stronger than the Colt and it's clones.

Freedom Arms is also strong enough to handle 40,000 PSI loads.

In general if you find that the same model gun is chambered for the 44 magnum it will also handle the hi pressure loads.

Consult loading manuals and see if they say their loads was fired in a particular gun.

Tho Ruger Vaqueros was designed for the hi pressure loads but I understand they have been downsized a bit and I don't know the status now. Just ask Ruger.

I had a west german revolver (Hi-Hunter) that I bought for $50 new and it was a 44 magnum. It ws built a lot heavier than the colt and clones. That said it destroyed the grips and sheared the screw in the case extractor on the barrel.

I fixed it but it wasn't ready for such recoil.

I can't attest to their strength but, they are not Italian made. These are made here in the US and are advertised to be exact replicas of the Colt Model P. I would expect that they are at least as strong as #rd generation Colt SAA's. These are not "cheap" clones of a Colt and they are much better finished although their prices don't reflect it.

Why not pose this question to the manufacturer and ask them. If anyone would know what a safe maximum pressure would likely be, they should. FWIW, and no offense meant to anyone, any place or anything, I wouldn't look to ANY internet forums for maximum load recommendations.

Matt,
I don't know if there is an answer out there to your question because I doubt that USFA has thought of hot-rodding their revolvers.

If you happen upon an elk in close quarters, say 50 yds. or less, I don't think that you would be undergunned with the standard 260 grs. at 8-900 fps. I know that LBT or Mountain Moulds will make a you an WFN in this weight range. Dave Scovill did a column a few years ago where he used a 270 gr. bullet that he designed for RCBS at original pressure specs. and was in the 8-900 fps velocity range. If I can find the article I can send you a copy.

Hogdon does have data for 300 gr. bullets at standard pressure as well. I beleive that they are in the 6-700 fps range.

Does USFAR have a web site? How much $$ are their 1873 colts?

I have a AWA Longhorn 5 1/2" barrel colt. I think its nicer than the uberti's etc. Hell of a lot slicker than a Ruger. My friends Vaquero is beafyer, but would need alot of custom work to even come close to my AWA. I was thinking of getting a ruger for heavy loads though.

Rick

quote:

I can't attest to their strength but, they are not Italian made.

You are correct and my apologies to imply that they were italian clones. I misread the question.

These are high quality revolvers.

I doubt that they are worthy of 40,000 PSI loads just the same. Ask the manufacturer is the best answer.

I have an old 1971 Iver Johnson 1873 Colt clone [Uberti] and a new Ruger Black Hawk.

The Ruger chamber walls are between .069" and .073" to the outside.
The Uberti chamber walls are between .059" and .063" to the outside.

The Ruger chamber walls are between .059" and .060" between chambers.
The Uberti chamber walls are between .046" and .047" between chambers.

The Ruger can take 30 kpsi per public loading information .
With a Ruger chamber inside diameter of .489" for the Uberti and .486", S = P[ID]/2thickness = 124ksi stress in the Ruger, which would require heat treatment of 4140 steel.


If the Italian steel were as good, the Uberti should be good for P = 2S[thickness] /ID = 2 124ksi [.046]/.486 = 23.5 kpsi.
I have been shooting 24 gr. H110 250 gr. XTP, 1.6", [measures 1215 fps with 4.5" barrel] which Quickload thinks is 28.693 kpsi chamber pressure.
But Quickload thinks it would only be 25.2 kpsi if it were W296.

In the Italian clone I have been shooting the 25 ~ 29 kpsi load for a few years now and it still locks up tight.

The new Ruger is kind of a piece of junk in comparison, but would seem ok if I didn't own the clone.

I shoot a LaserCast 300gr @900fps in my Cimarrons as a backup hunting gun. If I got my pants on, it's there. I'd expect you are safe to hit that number, expecially if you use a .452 bullet instead of the fat .454" version. In a Rugger I have pushed these 300gr TC bullets over 1200fps...but they are not much fun over 1000.

Rich