Rifle operates fine and mabey this is nothing at all to worry about...

I just recently got a pair of GO and NO-GO
headspace guages
and I was sitting here "playing" with my strangely very accurate Remington Model74

And just on a wild impulse Decided to drop the NO guage into the chamber, to my suprise
the action closed on it. granted I have to either press fairly hard on the bolt handle
OR allow the rifle to slam closed on the guage, but it did close....

I find this odd more than disturbing because I've found many batches of factory ammo that this rifle will not close on.. though generally because of case base dimensions

I MUST use a Special Small base (slightly smaller than a normal SB sizing die
and originally made by RCBS specifically for browning BAR owners) sizing die to produce ammunition that won't cause this rifle to jam.
so even virgin brass must be XSB sized for the rifle to close.

No force on earth will allow me to close the
bolt on my Rem700 over this NO-Go guage so I'm wondering just how tight it's supposed to be...

FWIW this is a "+.007" Forster headspace guage
marked 2.0547.

This rifle to date has digested <400rounds of "reasonably" loaded (49gr of IMR4064) 165gr Nosler BT handloads (the ONLY load I shoot in it).

This is not a situation that worries me, but it is one that is a cause to ask questions...

I DO have my dies set to just "kiss" the shoulder of the cases and my handloaded ammunition for this specific rifle is actually harder to close the bolt on than this headspace guage is...

AllanD

I don’t think “slamming†the bolt home on a head space gauge is exactly the way it’s supposed to be used for accurate readings!

Yup, the quickest way to damage a chamber is by forcing a headspace gauge.

Did you actually look to see if the locking lugs were fully engaged? There is enough slack in the operating handle on these guns to where the operating handle will move fully forward without the lugs being fully engaged.

Look up through the mag well and note the position of the lugs on an empty chamber. "GENTLY" place the headspace gauge under the extractor and guide it into the chamber as the bolt closes. Don't force anything. Now look again at the lugs and see if they look like they did when the chamber was empty.

The reality of the situation is that you hand load for the rifle and feed it properly sized cartridges that have minimal headspace; esentially treating it like a wildcat. While a factory round my have excessive headspace and could cause problems your reloads don't. So only shoot your reloads.
If you sell the gun make sure it gets fixed or goes to a hand loader that understands what this rifle needs for care and feeding.
Not a problem based on your explination or your expirence.

Oh yeah, and what Rick and Malm said about the no-go gage is dead on (as expected ), (like they need me to conferm it )

In my own defence, did you ever try to close the bolt on a remington auto-shucker gently?

that operating handle is a bit hard to hold on to.

the guage was all the way into the chamber, allowing it a "half travel slam" is the only way to get the extractor to slip over the rim of the guage and the action to approach closed

The bolt most definatly did rotate into battery...

I think the bulk of the issue is that I'm working with
an "undersized" guage, it is a Forster NoGo.

But just to be sure I'm going to burn up some
factory ammo just to carefully measure the fired cases.

I bought this rifle new and there is no visible wear on the locking lugs or on the recesses on the barrel exension, so if the chamber is a bit long it was made that way....

and I really hope I didn't just snargle the chamber
at the junctionof the shoulder and neck
by slamming the guage into the chamber, but...

Someone asked me if I discard cases when they require their fifth trimming? I'm lucky if by the time I've resized
them five times I haven't lost two thirds of them...

Like I said, it's interesting, but not a situation I'm particularly worried about.

AD

quote:

Originally posted by Allan DeGroot:
I DO have my dies set to just "kiss" the shoulder of the cases and my handloaded ammunition for this specific rifle is actually harder to close the bolt on than this headspace guage is...

AllanD

As long as you follow the above plan you should be fine. If you develope concerns about it, let a gunsmith have a look at it...

Lets see now; You are using a precision gage in a manner not recomended and get results you don't agree with. Then you state the gage is wrong. I don't know how to easily head space youe Auto, but if the brass isn't stretching, and the primers look good enjoy!.
Good luck!

I suspect the chamber is a touch "long",
but I KNOW the chamber is "narrow".

So the brass simply can't be forced to the shoulder because the case head dimensions conflict....

Like I said previously, the rifle will refuse to close on most of the factory commercial ammunition I've ever tried in it, but will usually close on US produced military ammo.

If the action is allowed to slam on commercial ammunition it'll usually close, but in most cases it's very difficult to open the action by hand and the round must be shot out, or a block of wood used to drive the bolt open
(it's possible to pull it open by hand with force, but I tend to cut my index finger on the corner of the slot in the windage screw on the redfield scope base).

I suppose I should send it back to remington, but I also think that's something I probably should have done 20 years ago....

Basically what I suspect is wrong here is that the chamber was cut with a roughing reamer until it would close on Go guage that was slightly fatter than mine.

I'll admit it bothers me that is isn't "right"
if you know what I mean....

Anyone have any ideas on a specific person I should contact at remington?

I also wonder what it's going to cost unless they decide it's an issue that's their fault...

AllanD

If it’s a .308 you should be aware that military 7.62mm ammo and commercial .308 ammo ARE NOT the exact same size, and will headspace a bit differently.

quote:

Originally posted by Allan DeGroot:
I suspect the chamber is a touch "long",
but I KNOW the chamber is "narrow".

So the brass simply can't be forced to the shoulder because the case head dimensions conflict....

Like I said previously, the rifle will refuse to close on most of the factory commercial ammunition I've ever tried in it, but will usually close on US produced military ammo.

If the action is allowed to slam on commercial ammunition it'll usually close, but in most cases it's very difficult to open the action by hand and the round must be shot out, or a block of wood used to drive the bolt open
(it's possible to pull it open by hand with force, but I tend to cut my index finger on the corner of the slot in the windage screw on the redfield scope base).

I suppose I should send it back to remington, but I also think that's something I probably should have done 20 years ago....

Basically what I suspect is wrong here is that the chamber was cut with a roughing reamer until it would close on Go guage that was slightly fatter than mine.

I'll admit it bothers me that is isn't "right"
if you know what I mean....

Anyone have any ideas on a specific person I should contact at remington?

I also wonder what it's going to cost unless they decide it's an issue that's their fault...

AllanD

You can save yourself all this torture by taking it to a gunsmith and letting him check the headspace and/or cast the chamber. It will probably be cheaper and less frustrating than trying to deal with the company over a 20 year old gun.

FWIW I use small base dies with all my semi-auto's. Not because the chambers are narrow, but because they feed better! Good luck.