Hi- I am in the process of shortening a P 17 and barreling to 219 Don Wasp-- Any ideas as to
loading ramps,stiffening and bedding ??
No real reason for this project except the fun of it
ideas welcome thanks Sydney

P-17

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A P 17

Keith

Keith,
there's also no such thing as a 45 long colt .. let it go -- we don't welcome new members like that

Sydney,
i have nothing to offer on the conversion, would never have thought of that action, as i usually build big bores on them

quote:

Originally posted by Sydney:
Hi- I am in the process of shortening a P 17 and barreling to 219 Don Wasp-- Any ideas as to
loading ramps,stiffening and bedding ??
No real reason for this project except the fun of it
ideas welcome thanks Sydney

Sydney, the only Pattern rifle was the 1914(P14) Enfield for the British. The American version in '06 was called the Model 1917 Enfield. It is a touchy point with some folks.

Are you saying you plan to do a "Baby Enfield" M1917 conversion by shortening the action, bolt, etc.? That is a big undertaking and requires a good bit of metal removal and expert welding to look right. The only one I have ever seen is pictured in "Bolt Action Rifles" and was a single shot. If you want it magazine fed, you might want to start with a P14 and shorten it's magazine which is set up with ridges to guide and control a rimmed cartridge. You can also substitute the same in the M1917 with alterations. The action should be stiffened by the shortening and be more than adequate. Bedding the action and about 2 inches of the barrel with Acraglass should work. You might have to widen the ramp to let the .497 rim clear.

Another option that would require less work would be a Model 24/47 or M48 Yugo Mauser action. It is already an intermediate length and doesn't need x-treme machining. The bolt face would have to opened up and rails/ramp altered. You could line the mag with some slanted guide rails cut from surplus G3 mags to control the rounds. You might even be able to cut the sides from a P14 magazine and solder those in to do the same thing.

Hi-Hog Killer--my mistake--should read Model 1917 Enfield--Do you have anything of value to help with my project or just reaming a new member for fun--Thanks for the welcome
Sydney

Hi Bobster-Yes the baby was what i have in mind-
i am only interested in a singleshot and i have both loading and forming dies for the Don Wasp-Both the machining and welding are not a problem as i have a couple of talented friends
Any information would be appreciated
Thanks Sydney

quote:

Originally posted by Sydney:
Hi-Hog Killer--my mistake--should read Model 1917 Enfield--Do you have anything of value to help with my project or just reaming a new member for fun--Thanks for the welcome
Sydney

I see your origimal post as "Accurate" as talking atbout a P 98 Mauser. To my words mean things.

jeffe, 45 long colt is a wrong name for the 45 Colt round. At least it's Long Colt use came about during a time when the S&W Schofeild was in service along with the SAA Colt, and shot a shorter round than the Colt. The US army issued the S&W round to both troopers with the S&W and th SAA colt as it can be used in both firearms.

Keith

Keith,
you are correct, there was a 45 colt and a 45 schofield .. but there has never been a 45 long colt, EVER, though its stamped on barrels and brass ... just like a p1914 and m1917 .. never was a p17, but its as easy to compound as 45 long colt, and just as wrong ...

and don't get me started on people saying lemat rather than "lemay" or "minneax balls" rather than minNIE balls, it NEVER was minneax, the man's surname, while french, is MINNIE .. and the awesomeness of hearing saBOT" rather than sah-boeux

and how there's centrifical force -- never was ...

and how bullets have lift

and how MAX pressure has something to do with velocity

these are all misconceptions, .. let it go man

sydney - welcome to the forums - you've got quite a project in mind. as long as you want a single shot with a stiff action, make a plate with a tapered slot to act as a feed ramp and weld it(or silver solder) into the bottom of the action. this eliminated the rails and stiffens the action. the best bedding process i believe follows the bedding done to the national match garands/m-14's which point beds recoil areas and spot beds the longitudinal areas of the action. you're looking a quite a bit of machining, and watch the heat or you'll end up retreating the project

quote:

Originally posted by Sydney:
Hi- I am in the process of shortening a P 17 and barreling to 219 Don Wasp-- Any ideas as to
loading ramps,stiffening and bedding ??
No real reason for this project except the fun of it
ideas welcome thanks Sydney

Frank DeHaas made one, altho I think he may have use a Pattern 14 (is the Wasp a rimmed cartridge?)- anyway, if you search his books he may have some description of his efforts with it. His was a single shot, I believe. There is a photo of it in his book "Bolt Action Rifles".

HI- tin can--thanks for the reply--that was the article that got me started on this journey
I was hoping someone had done one and had some insight--thanks sydney

Some folks are smart enough to make a bad idea work.

Hi-butchloc--thanks for the reply--would you mind
expanding on the tapered slot feeding ramp idea for me??
Thanks sydney

DeHass did an article in an issue of 'Rifle'(?) magazine I believe on his conversion.
Probably in the 80's. Might be the article you're refering to but I thought I'd mention it.

Lots of pics and description of the process. Bolt shortening, home made jig for positioning/welding, ect.

I know I have it somewhere in the pile of important things to keep.

since the donaldson is a rimmed round the ramp must be deep enough so that the extractor catches the rim of the round. then the slot tapers up so at the end of the run the round is pointed into the chamber. kind of looks the the point on a wood pencil

Hi butchloc--I make a ramp from oak just to get
the idea--worked fine
Thanks for the help
sydney

quote:

I see your origimal post as "Accurate" as talking atbout a P 98 Mauser. To my me words mean things.

Spelling, etymology, usage at a given time in history, original pronunciation and meaning. Put in thirty years of study, and you get to be the boor bore of the party.

About 1940 the British got a lot of M1917's from the US. All through the British writings of the period they are called P17's. The caliber was often called .300 US. They painted red bands on them, and often had ".300" on the band or elsewhere to avoid ammunition confusion with the P14's. Even India ended up with some, and they were called P17's there, too.

As of yet, I haven't seen any British Army records to know if P17 was an official designation or just common usage.

So, maybe, a M1917, with a red band painted around it, and .300 written on it, with records of British service, could properly be called a P17.

Bruce

Sydney

Don't worry about it, no big deal. Welcome to a great Forum, Most of the Guys here are a wealth of knowledge and are willing to share. Good luck on your project, now be sure to post pic's of the work in progress.

Steve E.........