I have a left handed Zastava Mauser that I want to restock. If the wood were equal for grade and grain flow, which wood would be better (stonger?) for a 458 Win Mag:

California Claro walnut
English walnut,
Bastogne walnut,
American black walnut?

Is there any difference in weight of these woods (on the average)?

I am also thinking that I would like to add some weight to the gun so if all dimensions were equal, how much heavier would a laminated stock (Beech with 1/8" strips) be over an average walnut stock?



Thanks for any help.

Well Frank this is an opinion only - FWIW. The weight of wood can be all over the place. However if I was looking to add weight I would look at American Black Walnut on the other hand if lightness is the objective I would look at English Walnut. The others I'm not certain about but have been led to believe Claro "may" be somewhat brittle. In what ever you choose, they all make decent stocks, grain flow through the wrist would be the determining factor in my books. --- John303

English and Bastogne are in general a lot stronger than Claro or Black for a 458. Laminate will be heaiver than any regular walnut except for the very heaviest of blanks. Just be sure and use cross bolts on any of them. Mercury recoil reducers or lead shot are easy ways to add weight if you need it.

Depending on what you wish to have the stock look like in the final configuration, the wood you named have all been used for that caliber. Winchester used Black Walnut and Claro walnut. Weatherby has been using Claro Walnut for decades for their heavy caliber rifles with success/failures. Circaussian Walnut/English Walnut/French Walnut/Turkish Walnut all come from the same origin genius/species and are good stock materials. Bastogne Walnut is one of my favorite woods to work as it takes patience and perserverance to do a good job. Which ever wood you pick....make sure the layout of the wood is optimal for the caliber you are going to use. The harder you hunt the more picky you should be in wood selection. All gunstocks made out of wood are unique and have a personality of their own to work with. Some work very well and some are a pain in the rear. Pick your wood with a known stockmaker is my suggestion.

quote:

Originally posted by Dennis Earl Smith:
Which ever wood you pick....make sure the layout of the wood is optimal for the caliber you are going to use. The harder you hunt the more picky you should be in wood selection. All gunstocks made out of wood are unique and have a personality of their own to work with. Some work very well and some are a pain in the rear. Pick your wood with a known stockmaker is my suggestion.

Excellent advice from a master....deserving of a sticky.

quote:

SWD: be sure and use cross bolts on any of them. Mercury recoil reducers or lead shot are easy ways to add weight

Or attach a lug to the bottom of the barrel and bed it properly in the forearm. You can also glue steel bolts in the butt to add weight or improve weight distribution in hard kicking rifles, which I think work as well as expensive inertia tubes.

Generally, claro is much lighter and weaker than English or black walnut.

Bastogne is usually heavier than English or black. Some say that it is stronger....

Black and English are similar in weight and most people believe English is stronger. There is a test that the U.S. government did that shows that black walnut is stronger than English.

Personally I would not even think of putting claro on a 458. I would be happy to use any of the other three.

IMO one of the most important additions to any (properly inletted/bedded) 458WM stock is the crossbolt behind the magazine box. Regardless of the wood chosen and the blank's layout, the flex under recoil WILL usually cause the stock to split in this area first unless it's reinforced.

Weatherby uses auxiliary barrel-mounted recoil lugs in their forearms and yet Weatherbys have a well-deserved rep for splitting stocks under recoil. Think about that.

I repeat, IMO the crossbolt behind the magazine box is the single best additional protection against recoil splitting. Not to say that other installations aren't needed, NOT AT ALL, but rather to say that if only one additional item can be installed into an otherwiae properly bedded/inletted stock then it should be a crossbolt behind the magazine box. JMOFWIW.
Regards, Joe

Thank you gentlemen, the information is appreciated. I see that I have more issues to think through. It's good when the answers to a question leads you to more questions as it shows that you're learning something. My ignorance of wood is ony exceeded by my curiousity so I hope to cure the ignorance issue.

hi frank,
since you are getting a new stock made are you also getting a shroud type safety. if so you can get either an original military trigger installed or one of that style single stage trigger installed. that would allow a bunck of wood to be left behind the magazine box that is normally taken out for the larger boxier triggers.
max

quote:

Originally posted by max(hm2):
hi frank,
since you are getting a new stock made are you also getting a shroud type safety. if so you can get either an original military trigger installed or one of that style single stage trigger installed. that would allow a bunck of wood to be left behind the magazine box that is normally taken out for the larger boxier triggers.
max

Max, you know about Mausers than me (of course everyone knows more than me, since I'm left handed and this is my first one) but will a shroud type safety fit on a left handed rifle? I don't know if my rifle being left handed makes any difference. I don't know what kind of trigger is installed already but it feels nice.

I'm not Max but I'm a lefty with my share of Mausers. I have no trouble with original military style safeties or M70 types.

hi frank,
the trigger in it is a box type trigger with the side safety. it requires alot of wood be removed where the stock could use some strength..
the shroud type safety can be fitted to the left handed mauser actions.when kbi/daly was going out of business i bought a half dozen lh actions only. i bought new triggers for them and sent them off to gentry and had the shroud safety's installed. i sold all of them but one.
without doing alot of research i believe dayton traister and huber make an adjustable trigger about the size of the original military type trigger. the other option would be to find one of the old guys who used to alter the militarty triggers to single stage.

quote:

Originally posted by max(hm2):
hi frank,
the trigger in it is a box type trigger with the side safety. it requires alot of wood be removed where the stock could use some strength..
the shroud type safety can be fitted to the left handed mauser actions.when kbi/daly was going out of business i bought a half dozen lh actions only. i bought new triggers for them and sent them off to gentry and had the shroud safety's installed. i sold all of them but one.
without doing alot of research i believe dayton traister and huber make an adjustable trigger about the size of the original military type trigger. the other option would be to find one of the old guys who used to alter the militarty triggers to single stage.

Thanks for the info, Max.

More for me to think about.

Although my choice of wood today is Russian Cir. from Old World Walnut or Turkish walnut for any custom rifle. But, of the ones you named I would choose a piece of straight grained and properley laid out Bastogne or English. IMO full fiddle back with secondary straight grain properly laid out Bastogne is one of the strongest and heaviest of woods..Heavy wood is nice on the really big kickers and the 458 is getting right up there.

That said, I would use two cross bolts and glass bed the gun from tang to forend, leaving a 3/32 or less gap in the tang, use an extra lug on the barel. A screw and echon is optional to use with the barrel lug. Properly bedded and used as discussed here, then most well laid out woods you mention will work just fine.