I was shooting a .223 with a heavy Krieger barrel in SS on a Sako action. Approximately 30 degrees. Ammo I have fired all summer with very good (under moa consistently) and the first group went into, if you can call it that, 4.3 inches. I assumed it was messed up ammo. Next group around 3". Then it started to group and I kept shooting, 10 shots into .9 inches. the barrel was a bit warm by now but not hot.

I switched rifles and it cooled off. next group was 2.2 inches and then when it warmed up it was 5 into .93". Let it cool again and 7 shots into 4.2", mmmmm the next 5 went into .59", warm barrel again. Cooled off and 5 into 3.5 inches and my last 3 shots into about .5". Out of Ammo. Maybe this rifle belongs in Texas, or Florida?

Jack what do you think. It has one of those gray stocks (H S precision).

Chic,

It sounds like the barrel needs some stress relief, OR you need to play with the torque on the action screws.

I have six or seven rifles with the H-S Precision stocks. The Remingtons are torqued to 65 in.-lbs. as per H-S Precision's recommendation, and those guns are 'stable' (i.e., no POI shifts when the barrel warms up).

George

George,
Krieger cryo's his barrels before they go out. And this rifle was shooting great one month ago (and 40 degrees warmer) going to go back today. See what happens

What powder where you useing Chic?
Ray

Sounds like a powder/Temp. problem. Not all powders will perform the same in cooler temps. Your rifle, after you shot it a while was probably warming up your ammo as it sat in the chamber before firing. Try an experiment with the same load. Go to the range on a similarly cold morning, but keep enough ammo for a group or two in your pocket to keep them warm. Shoot a group quickly before they cool down. See what happens. You probably just found the temp. limit of your powder to perform the same as usual. Some powders are worse than others at this. I used to use 4064 in my .308 hunting rifle. But, by the time hunting season came around the loads I carefully worked up when it was warmer would not group. I have since switched to Varget, and the problem was solved....ol blue

The ammo I was using when it did this was Coyote remanufactured stuff. I used a different ammo yesterday with 2230 but the barrel was warmed up so I have introduced another variable. When I chamber a round, it stays in there for a very short time before I shoot and I can not imagine any heat transfer in that short a time. The mysery continues.

Try VV133, Benchmark, or Varget. All three of these powders can be good in .223 and are pretty temp. insensitive. I would try 133 & B-mark for the lighter bullets and slower twists, Varget for the faster twist and heavier bullets....ol blue

If it was random spread, not vertically strung I'm betting on stress, external or internal. But of course the powder is the place to start.

When I saw this thread's title I thought maybe someone at the range had a prettier stock than Chic's.

(Gray stock? I see they did...)

Chic,
Where do you shoot? Fancher or #2 canyon.

Dan, I shoot up at # 2 Canyon.

I just got back from there and it did it again. Temperature was near the same but a bit warmer. It seemed to take a bit before it warmed up but it started with some a 1.6" group, then a 2.8, then it started to group after throwing too shots to the right (the last 3 were .38"). I let the barrel cool and had some ammo in my pocket warming up. It made no difference, shot like crap again. Once it warmed up it shot .61 and .66". I tried some other reloads with 2230 and it did not help, the cold barrel still shot poorly. When it did warm up, the first 4 shots went into .43" ....... and the fifth was 1.3" away from that group. GRRRRRRRRRRRRR. I can't stand success.

Steve, you have that nailed. All of the stocks would have been better looking than this one

Why don't you tell HS precision your problem and see what they say. OR get another stock and try it. I suspect somethings going on with the bedding.

I wonder if when the action is cold it is shrinking and pulling off of its bedding?

Kristofer

KBguns, I am thinking the same thing.

Chic,
Just for giggles have you trid W 748?
Have tried most of them (powders) but keep coming back to W 748.
I use Rem. 7 1/2 primers up to 27 grains. After that it's Win mag. sm. rifle. Get great accuracy/velocity . It is a little dirty but cleans easy.
IMR 3031 works good also but quit using it years ago because it didn't meter worth a @#%*

I think Ol Blue is on the right track. I have two rifles that are instrumented with strain gauges, and I can definitely state that even if you "single shot" each round, and fire as quickly as you can after chambering the round, barrel temperature has a very strong effect on muzzle velocity.

If barrel temp has a strong effect on MV, then it also has to be so that barrel temp affects the bullet's transit time down the barrel, and hence the place in the "barrel whip" cycle that the bullet exits.

Dan,
I haven't tried that powder but it seems to be more of a case of barrel temperature. I shot cold ammo the other day with the barrel heated in the car with the heater and they shot great. this is a very heavy barrel so I can't imagine that much barrel vibration doing it. I am going to try to do one thing at a time when I get back from hunting in Idaho and see if I can figure out what it was. I would hate to do two things and have it disappear and never know what it was.

Iron castings are often stress relieved by hanging them up and beating them with wooden mallets. Perhaps you should try this with your rifle. I think I would remove the scope first. Regards, Bill.