www.hallowellco.com/holland%20375.htm

This is a 375 H&H made by Holland and Holland on a standard length DWM action. I don't see any metal removal from the front or rear action rings. If this is the case, how does this work?
Matt

Maybe it was never intended to eject live rounds. I realize this is a deficiency but you never know

In opening up a standard M98 action for a longer cartridge I don't think metal is removed from the front and rear rings, The magazine is lengthened and the feed ramp shortened i.e. metal removed from the rear of the bottom locking lug recess, and metal from the rear bottom of the action removed. The bolt throw is the same and has always been longer than required for the standard cartridge. Because the Mauser does not eject a case or cartridge until the bolt is almost at the rear stop the opening between the front and rear action ring is usually sufficient for the longer cartridges.
My own 404J is a classic example of an opened up standard M98.

By the pictures it looks as though the bolt comes back a bit further than standard. Draw a line straight up from the rear of the magazine floorplate and see what I mean. That is my guess anyhow.

I like the British proof marking: .375" Magnum '2.85'" 19 Tons

I'm sure the bolt comes back further. That is a given. I have looked at several standard action sporters opened up for magnum cartridges. There is almost always reliefe cuts in the front, rear, or both. This one is new to me. The trigger group and gaurd bow seem a bit farther back as well.

quote:

Originally posted by eagle27:
In opening up a standard M98 action for a longer cartridge I don't think metal is removed from the front and rear rings, .

I disagree. Here is a "classic" pre-war Jeffery 404. Clearly, the rear bridge has been milled back a looong way. I have looked at several other's magnum rifles where the front ring has some metal removed on the top of the front ring from 12 O'clock to 3 O'clock.

www.champlinarms.com/Default.a...StyleID=2&GunID=1904

quote:

Originally posted by ColoradoMatt:

quote:

Originally posted by eagle27:
In opening up a standard M98 action for a longer cartridge I don't think metal is removed from the front and rear rings, .

I disagree. Here is a "classic" pre-war Jeffery 404. Clearly, the rear bridge has been milled back a looong way. I have looked at several other's magnum rifles where the front ring has some metal removed on the top of the front ring from 12 O'clock to 3 O'clock.

www.champlinarms.com/Default.a...StyleID=2&GunID=1904

That's an interesting variation on the theme but I standby my observations based on my Mauser 404. Mine is the Oberndorf Type A standard action and still has the charger guides at the rear and the cross hatched pattern on top of the front receiver ring appears undisturbed i.e. it comes almost to the edge of the receiver where if any of this area had been ground away I would have expected to see the edge of the pattern taken off. The cross hatching has an engraved border and this is complete all the way round.
Another thing is that the extractor on my Mauser is full length so with the bolt closed the extractor is still in the front and rear guides with no gap.
The Jeffery Mauser is showing the extractor way out of the rear guide most of which is cut away. It is a bit ugly looking, I don't like extractors exposed like that. Possibility that Jeffery used a short extractor?

In terms of operation my Mauser feeds and extracts like a hot knife thru butter, I couldn't wish for better.

The 375 H & H works fine because the overall length is not that much. Remember that the bullet on the 375 doesn't extend too far.

What you will see on H & H rifles in 300 H & H is a milled "U" notch on the front receiver ring so that the thing can be....TOP LOADED!

I handled both a 375 by Holland's (these never need the "U") and a 300 by Holland's in April at Gavin Gardiner's this year as I was thinking of buying the 300. The 300 incedentally on a commercial FN action with no cut-out.s

I've also handled 375 rifles by Holland in Paris and again they work fine.

Both 375 and 300 load singly by putting the rounds in base first and then thumbing them back to the rear of the magazine.

The post from EAGLE pretty much sums up how it is. After all how else would the standard Mauser 98 action work with such as the 280 Remington which is also a pretty long round.

The work is underneath in the magazine well.

Standard German military spec for the overall length of ALL their 7.92mm x 57 rounds was 3.16"

There is certainly no using of two actions welded together.

Can't say how they did it. But as I remember it the opening for my 375 and 338 MKXs actions were the same. It would eject a loaded round just fine. You did need to insert the bullet slide forward a touch then swing the rear in and back. Have to go by memory because everthing is packed away.

quote:

ou did need to insert the bullet slide forward a touch then swing the rear in and back.

+1!

quote:

Originally posted by ColoradoMatt:
www.hallowellco.com/holland%20375.htm

This is a 375 H&H made by Holland and Holland on a standard length DWM action. I don't see any metal removal from the front or rear action rings. If this is the case, how does this work?
Matt

The internal magazine may be slanted to the rear like a Siamese Mauser. This allows each cartridge to be pushed to the rear as they are loaded; thus preventing belts from overlapping and causing rough feeding or jams. The rounds are slanted in the mag allowing them to fit in a shorter space. As others have pointed out, the .375 is not that long and will function with a few mag mods. With the existing charger guide cut out there is plenty of room.

Good question.

I note only that it seems to have a very deep and angled magazine box for a capacity of four cartridges.

Before buying that rifle, I would definitely want to see how it loads and ejects, and also run some rigorous feeding and function tests.

BTW, it's a great looking rifle, IMHO.

All Holland belted magnum rifles - with the exception of the 240 Apex - have a magazine capacity of four. Just the same as all Remington rifles using a belted magnum based on the 375 H & H parent have a capacity of three.

quote:

You did need to insert the bullet slide forward a touch then swing the rear in and back

last thing id want to be doing is trying to jiggle rounds into a DGR.

Magnum length M98 receivers were created for good reason.

quote:

Last thing id want to be doing is trying to jiggle rounds into a DGR.

In any rifle as far as I am concerned. After handling the 300 H & H at the auction - with a dummy cartridge - I also passed it by.

No problem with a 240 H & H however.

On some early 404s, they simply milled out the front of the magazine box which was just enough to accommodate the overall length: