Folks, I'm a suspicious sort by nature but this seems out of whack on a good day. "marknlinda" are/is a new poster that has posted the SAKO blow-up question on 5 different forums without answering s single question put to them/it. Does anyone else smell a class-action attorney fishing for clients?



edited to fix crappy typing...

Something!

It do seem a bunch weird.

Very good call tiggertate!
You picked up on incongruous behavior, both over time, and across various forums.

Perhaps Saeed or Don can check this out. I'm not sure of anything in the AR charter that encourages parasites to come in here to obtain information to be used to harm our chosen hobby/sport/way of life.

I don't care for the way that Berretta normally conducts customer service, but it appears they are recalling, inspecting and dealing with these concerns in an appropriate and timely manner.

I propose that we not share information with this entity.
As tigger has noted, they have told us nothing about themselves, we have no history with them, and they are focused on an unfortunate incident (unfortunate for the rifle, no one was injured ).

I hope this is not too presumptuous, but I would like to declare a code red < !--color--> Ambulance Chaser Alert. Please inform our fellow hobbyists who hang out on those no-name brand-x forums.

Thank you,
and God bless however came up with daylight savings time; the extra hour of sleep surely felt good this morning.

JCN

In fact, you're right. I would seek counsel IF I were injured and IF I knew there had been genuine negligence. I know this because I've had the opportunity and chose not to pusure it because the two IFs were missing.

I have nothing against plaintiff's lawyers; just the crappy kind that go on fishing trips for cases.



Just had to add that for you to say I would be first in line is line is pretty damn presumptious, not to mention aggressive. Did I strike a nerve?

Blue, Blue, Blue. Why did you say that? C'mon fer cripes sake. You need a change of scene buddy. Why I'll bet you $100.00(U.S.) that most of the people on the forum and here is Y'town never sued anybody. Pack your bags and get away from the cretins...

Blue, better yet, just pack your bags and go away. You're showing quite a bit different side than when you were trying to be elected as something. Have you been in touch with them yet? So you could "pool" your hits? Or are you trying to get on the Vioxx gravy train?

I for one have always enjoyed posting back and forth with Blue. He is one of the more gentlemanly posters on this forum and I wish we had more like him. Even if he is a fucking lawyer.... ......DJ

Lawyer, NO I'm NOT. I'm FIREFIGHTER that helps people and the enviornment. And was meerly trying to seek help and possibly prevent others from the same mishap that I had.
You want to check it out? I'll be happy to give you the phone number to the Fire station, let me know. In America we a innocent untill proven guilty.
LAST TIME I CHECKED IT WAS STILL AMERICA THAT I FOUGHT FOR AND LIVE IN. I sent Pictures to MR. John Carlie Noak and have asked Saeed if he would like to post my pictures for all to see.
Im real so you Please try to be. I had no Idea that this site exsisted untill the other day when a local gunsmith told me about it. He happened to be there when I had my accident. So I'm sorry if I'm new to this site.
Thanks Mark

Mark,
If you email me the photos I can get them posted on here. Truly hope your injuries heal properly and sorry to hear it happened. That sako that was on that web site was scary.

When I first saw this thread I was thinking that it was likely a lawyer drumming up business. I was WRONG. Mark contacted me on my home e-mail, I did a quick background check, and discovered that he is not a lawyer. Don't get me wrong, my girlfriend is a lawyer, and I enjoy laying down the law.



Look at these pictures, and tell me if they look eerily familiar.



I for one am not going to run out and buy a FinnLight (or FinnLite, whatever the heck it is called). Actually I couldn't if I wanted to. They have all been pulled from the shelves.



Mark was very badly injured. The details are not for me to divulge, but think about how you hold a rifle, and what might happen if it blew apart on you.























Just like the pictures that were posted on this forum a few weeks ago, the barrel is neatly split into three pieces. The cartridge case has opened into a tri leaflet pattern that corresponds to the barrel pattern. The Receiver split along the seam from the investment casting.



The fired cartridge was one with mild pressure, well within SAAMI/CIP specifications. The bore was not plugged.



If anyone knows a good forensic metallurgist please send me some contact info. This is not going to be a class action bullshit thing. It is important to know what is causing these rifles to fail in this pattern.



If you own a FinnLite, please do not shoot it.



When Mark is up for visitors I'll let those guys who live close to him know so you can stop on by.



JCN



Here are those pictures from the first blow up we saw:

man, I sure do hope you are ok. THat looks terrible. If you have not done so already, find a lawyer. I know one (not a friend of mine, trust me) who has made millions suing gun manaufacturers. Drop an amail if you need to know his contact info.

If you have not talked to a lawyer, then do not mess with the rifle parts. Just let them lie where they are in your hosue now. Don't try to put the pieces against each other to see how they were fitting before it blew. Do not let the rifle leave your house until you have a lawyer. Do not let a "gunsmith", dealer, or Sako see or handle the rifle until you speak to a lawyer. If you have a lawyer and they did not tell you these same things, then it is likely time to look for a better lawyer.

Again, I sure do hope you are ok.

And all of what I wrote was assuming the correct cartridge was used, faactory ammo, no obstructions in the bore, etc.
Regardless of the circumstances, I sure do wish you a very speedy and full recovery

marknlinda, I hope you are OK after the failure of your rifle - it looks horrific!!

I'm deeply saddened by the 'witch hunt' that occured after one or two people decided that you were a lawyer touting for business, for a number of reasons, including (but not limited to...):

The speed with which certain people were prepared to condemn you, without ANY knowledge of you, or your background...

The speed with which other people took up the call... that is what saddened (frightened ) me most.

If they have any balls, which I doubt, they'll apologise publicly for their attack.

Who's got the balls?

Looking at these pictures something occurred to me:

There are regularly guys on this very site that post and boast with impunity, loads that clearly violate or simply push the limits of what is widely published for safety.

They will sometimes add some form of weak disclaimer saying something like: "this works for my 26 inch barrel but may not work for you"

The infamous 45-70 threads as well as some stuff posted on the 404 and 9.3 in particular were prone to these claims.

I have for instance not in one single "paper printed publication" seen that a 416 Rigby equated to the velocity levels of say the 416 Weatherby. Nor is the 404 ever elevated to a velocity status that it has been on this site by some members.

Loading manuals are vary careful in the way they word their articles and how they validate their printed loads!

Now what if any is the liability when it comes to such statements, should a rifle blow and someone be injured?

I mean this Sako did not just blow, this was a bomb !

If someone creates an impression over time that he/she is an expert in matters of reloading on this site and many follow and accept that perception;

and that person then posts a load that is clearly beyond the limits of norm;

and a gun blows does that person then assume liability under US law?

Frankly, I would rather you be an unhurt lawyer than a hurt shooter but I'll take your word at face value and offer an apology if you were offended.

Marknlinda, my deepest apologies. I was very quick off the trigger. Driven, perhaps, by the broad swarth of your post. Its very easy to be paranoid today, what with the aggressive lawyers and some level of folks thinking that a suit against a deep pockets corporation is akin to winning the lottery.
Have you contacted Sako? They may very well be wanting to meet with you to make a just settlement.

An update with a little info. I contacted Beretta this morning and spoke to a live human for about 20 seconds, and then he transferred me to the 'recall line' There was a voice message stating that any SAKO stainless rifle received by the customer after February,2004 was subject to the recall. The recording then requested that you leave them your serial numbers for any guns that you owned and that they would contact you telling you how to proceed.

Just an update, I thought all might want to know.



P.S. Just got off the phone with Cheryl from Beretta.(1:17 pm EST) She stated that none of my guns were on the recall list. They had tracked the problem down to a 'specific batch of raw material used in the barrels' on the guns that had problems. She stated that there were quite a few, but not a large number, ??? of guns with this problem. I spoke to JB at Accuflite which is where 3 of the 4 stainless guns I purchased were from. He told me that Beretta had called in September requesting the serial numbers of all of his recent SAKO deliveries, but without telling them why. This might support your position MarknLinda that they are handling this recall in a 'hush-hush' manner. JB at Accuflite was perturbed that they as a Dealer ( a large SAKO dealer) were not/had not been better informed by SAKO on this issue.

Many of us were spring loaded toward the "Is there a lawyer behind this?" That viewpoint was not unreasonable, nor was it paranoid. We deal with trolls here on a daily basis. Mark had no history on this board. He was referred here by a gunsmith. He doesn't know how to post pictures. The pattern of his first post was consistent with what we feared. He persisted however, and got a hold of me. I was able to vet his story in about ten minutes. The system worked.
The main thing is for him to get on with healing.
JCN

ALF--Unfortunately, the answer is possibly. But liability would be unlikely. No one with half a brain should, or generally does, hold himself out on the internet or anywhere else as an expert on whom the whole wide world is entitled to rely without question.



I would argue that no reasonable person should be entitled to rely on any data, much less reloading data, gleaned from the internet. Reloading manual publishers are a different story, of course, and their manuals are rife with disclaimers.



Having said that, I should add that, of course, anyone can sue anyone over nearly any perceived wrong. But we can all take solace from the fact that not many internet posters are attractive defendants. Only big, heavily insured companies fill that bill, as a rule.



And please don't forget, everyone, that it's only a small fraction of the lawyers in this country--and these are the bottom of the barrel trial lawyers--that have given the rest of us a bad name by filing and pursuing frivolous litigation.



Trust me when I say that I detest trial lawyers who abuse the legal process as much as any non-lawyer possibly could. I don't like being tarred with brushes meant for them.



marknlinda, best wishes for your recovery. That is a scary looking rifle, and I do hope your injuries heal and you fully recover.

All i can say about the rifle is HOLY FFFFFF SSSSSSS

that looked like a fataliity to me.

Alf,
barnes publishes loads for the 416 rigby at/near/in weatherby

were these reloads?

jeffe

Blue, mrlexma, et al, this is the same story you hear from EVERY lawyer: "oh there are some rotten lawyers out there, but, of course, I'm not one of them. Trust me." If that is indeed the case, why don't you majority lawyers that are driven by love of truth and justice band together and clean house??? Before the general public grows so disgusted with you that they do it for you. Then, you can be assured the tar brush will be wide and indiscriminate.

That is a fair question. The trouble is that these sleazy types are not breaking the law or violating any ethical canon, by and large.



They stretch the "abuse of process" envelope near to bursting, but they generally stay on the "colorable claim" side of the line.



IMO, reforms are needed. For example, I like the British rule requiring that the loser pay the winner's legal fees and expenses. IMO, that would deter a lot of these frivolous and junk lawsuits. The "I spilled your take-out coffee all over my lap because I'm clumsy but anyway it was too hot." or the "You should pay my damages because a criminal misused your perfectly legal and non-defective firearm to hurt me." kind, for example.



I'm not a trial lawyer. But if I were, and if a potential client came to me with a claim like that, I would tell him or her to grow a brain, and a conscience too.



Unfortunately, many in our society, lawyers and non-lawyers alike, are malicious and will readily trump something up for the sake of financial gain. Or, they're misguided do-gooders who misuse our civil courts to achieve political ends.



What is legal isn't always morally right.

Well, since I started the thread I guesss I'll stay in for one more round...



An aquaintance of mine who happens to be a corporate lawyer explained it thusly:



In '63 there were fewer law students enroled statewide (all years combined) than there were in the in-commong 1st yr class that year (1993) in his school alone.



When way too many people flood an open market like lawyering it is inevitable that too much lawyering takes place relative to what society actually needs. One of those really strange situations where the supply side can dictate it's own demand, justified or not. Those who find themselves unable to find gainful employment in the real world often resort to bulls--t suits to pay the bills. And worst of all, those least competent to practice law fall back on politics to make a living. (Sums up the pool of likely elected officials, eh?)



That brings me back to the original post; in this environment it pays to be suspicious.



For that degree of suspiscion I offer no apology whatsoever. It's just a sign of the times.





opps... forgot one thing:

rugeruser, screw you and the kangaroo you hopped in on.

Blue, I agree completely that the trial attorney side of the law is a needed balance to negligence by any entity. I just think it is probably the least "just" part of the American legal system as it stands today.

.

Here are a few more pictures: