quote:

Originally posted by DArcy_Echols_Co:
Jeff all it takes is 156 hours and some parts.

quote:

Originally posted by DArcy_Echols_Co:
Jeff all it takes is 156 hours and some parts.

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Originally posted by DArcy_Echols_Co:
Jeff all it takes is 156 hours and some parts.

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Originally posted by CAS II:

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Originally posted by DArcy_Echols_Co:
Jeff all it takes is 156 hours and some parts.

Some quick arithmetic leaves me with the idea that you are charging less per hour than my electrician. And by a good margin. I doubt he has 10% of the investment in tools that you have.

Kind of pisses me off actually, as I'd much rather have a few of your rifles than a bunch of stinkin' wires that I can't even see.

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$14,000/156=$89.74 per hour.

40 hours per week times 50 weeks per year is $179,487 per year. I don't know a single electrician making 180K per year. I would have to look long and hard in this economy for an electrician making half that. 30% of that is more like it.

FYI the average Lawyer makes less then 50K per year.

It would be interesting to see each task, the benefit of each task, and the time it takes to complete them.

Just because something takes a long time doesn't mean it ads value. I'm sure I could polish the undercarriage of my truck with a q-tip and it would take lots of man hours to do it but it won't add any benefit or ad to it's resale value.

Doing the math of 40 hour work weeks with 2 weeks off per year there are 2000 work hours per year per man. With 154 hours per rifle one man could complete 13 rifles per year. My guess is that they turn out many more then 13 rifles per year and have more then a 1 man operation. I'd be willing to bet that there are employees performing much of those 154 hours while getting paid somewhere between $12.50 and $25.00 per hour.

Now they can sell their rifles for $14,000 so more power to them. Like anything in life the law of diminishing returns applys and it takes longer and longer to add less and less benefit.

Personally I'm not going to buy a Mercedes without Nav and leather and alloy wheels and I'm not going to by a $14,000 rifle without a fine wood stock, open sights, claw mounts, slow rust blue finish, square bridges and iron sights. Obviously someone is though.

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Originally posted by GeoffM24:

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Originally posted by CAS II:

quote:

Originally posted by DArcy_Echols_Co:
Jeff all it takes is 156 hours and some parts.

Some quick arithmetic leaves me with the idea that you are charging less per hour than my electrician. And by a good margin. I doubt he has 10% of the investment in tools that you have.

Kind of pisses me off actually, as I'd much rather have a few of your rifles than a bunch of stinkin' wires that I can't even see.

$14,000/156=$89.74 per hour.

40 hours per week times 50 weeks per year is $179,487 per year. I don't know a single electrician making 180K per year. I would have to look long and hard in this economy for an electrician making half that. 30% of that is more like it.

FYI the average Lawyer makes less then 50K per year.

It would be interesting to see each task, the benefit of each task, and the time it takes to complete them.

Just because something takes a long time doesn't mean it ads value. I'm sure I could polish the undercarriage of my truck with a q-tip and it would take lots of man hours to do it but it won't add any benefit or ad to it's resale value.

Doing the math of 40 hour work weeks with 2 weeks off per year there are 2000 work hours per year per man. With 154 hours per rifle one man could complete 13 rifles per year. My guess is that they turn out many more then 13 rifles per year and have more then a 1 man operation. I'd be willing to bet that there are employees performing much of those 154 hours while getting paid somewhere between $12.50 and $25.00 per hour.

Now they can sell their rifles for $14,000 so more power to them. Like anything in life the law of diminishing returns applys and it takes longer and longer to add less and less benefit.

Personally I'm not going to buy a Mercedes without Nav and leather and alloy wheels and I'm not going to by a $14,000 rifle without a fine wood stock, open sights, claw mounts, slow rust blue finish, square bridges and iron sights. Obviously someone is though.

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I'd be willing to bet that there are employees performing much of those 154 hours while getting paid somewhere between $12.50 and $25.00 per hour.

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Originally posted by XL Bar:

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I'd be willing to bet that there are employees performing much of those 154 hours while getting paid somewhere between $12.50 and $25.00 per hour.

I heard that D'Arcy has a bunch of illegal Mexicans doing most of his metalwork while he splits his free time between his chalet in the Swiss Alps and his place in the Bahamas.


Brian

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Originally posted by CAS II:

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Originally posted by XL Bar:

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I'd be willing to bet that there are employees performing much of those 154 hours while getting paid somewhere between $12.50 and $25.00 per hour.

I heard that D'Arcy has a bunch of illegal Mexicans doing most of his metalwork while he splits his free time between his chalet in the Swiss Alps and his place in the Bahamas.


Brian

I've met Brian, who works with D'Arcy and he showed me some of his work including the bottom metal he made. If he works for $12.50 per hour I'll take 35 of him. He is one talented gentleman and excellent with the public (a VERY underrated skill with tremendous value to an employer).

quote:

Originally posted by GeoffM24:
Personally I'm not going to buy a Mercedes without Nav and leather and alloy wheels and I'm not going to by a $14,000 rifle without a fine wood stock, open sights, claw mounts, slow rust blue finish, square bridges and iron sights. Obviously someone is though.

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Originally posted by EDMHUNTER:
I copied this from somewhere.
1. The heart of our Legend Rifle begins with a current production, chrome-moly steel, Winchester Model 70 claw extractor action that has been extensively modified and refined.

2. The action is blueprinted by re-machining the recoil lug seats, recoil lugs, receiver face and bolt face. The recoil lugs and recoil seats are then lapped to assure the maximum amount of lug engagement. A select grade chrome-moly steel barrel is then fit and chambered to the action. Our chambering procedures assure that maximum accuracy potential of the barreled action is realized. The Standard Sporter Legend is available in the following calibers only; 7mm Remington Magnum, 300 H&H Magnum, 300 Winchester Magnum, 300 Weatherby Magnum, 338 Winchester Magnum and 340 Weatherby Magnum (see 300 and 340 Weatherby note below). All barrels incorporate our own barrel contour to further enhance the final balance of our rifles. The overall length of these barrels is 24” or 26” depending on the caliber

Note: 300, 340 and 375 Weatherby:
Please note that we use non-standard throat dimensions for the 300, 340 and 375 Weatherby chambering in our rifles. We use minimum throat length and an altered lead angle. These changes have allowed us to continually obtain excellent accuracy levels with these calibers. However, please note that we cannot recommend the use of all factory ammunition with this chamber configuration due to the possibility of increased pressure levels in temperature conditions above 75ºF. Consequently, these rifles are best utilized with precision hand loaded ammunition, specifically tailored for each individual rifle. Loading data can be provided with each rifle if requested. Our goal when developing loading data for this caliber is achievement of maximum accuracy and down-range energy consistent with safe velocity and pressure constraints. If you decide to purchase one of our rifles chambered for 300, 340 or 375 Weatherby, you must be willing to accept and use hand loaded ammunition to achieve the optimum in performance.

3. The underside of the action is re-machined to create a uniform bedding platform and to accept a proprietary D’Arcy Echols & Co. heat-treated, stainless steel magazine box and follower assembly. This unique design is cartridge specific and allows our magazine box to hold one additional magnum round, giving the shooter a total of five rounds instead of the usual four rounds. This feature alone is almost unheard of in any currently available factory or custom produced firearm. This magazine conversion is not a ‘Drop Box’ design.

4. The receiver’s feed-ramp and guide rails are then modified to assure reliable cartridge feeding. Our rifles have established a reputation for flawless reliability.

5. The ejection port is lengthened to 3.600 to permit ease in loading of the magazine. A spring steel extractor replaces the factory extractor and is fit properly to fully utilize the advantages of the claw extractor system. A Williams steel floor-plate and trigger bow is re-machined and cosmetically detailed before installation.

6. The trigger, ejector, and bolt stop are re-pinned to remove all undesirable looseness or play. The sear engagement surfaces are machined to guarantee a consistent, crisp trigger pull set at 3 ¼ lbs. The safety wing and bolt lock engagement is refined to ensure smooth and positive manipulation of the safety. The factory sleeved bolt handle is then pinned and soldered to the main bolt body to prevent any separation between the handle and bolt body while in use.

7. Years ago I developed my own scope mounting system which provides simplicity and great strength needed for reliability under heavy recoil and adverse hunting conditions. To achieve this goal the mount system is designed to accommodate the specific scope (of the customer’s choice), and the mounts are fitted to the rifle with great precision. The front and rear action rings are carefully ground to a precise profile, concentric to the centerline of the bore. Once these critical surfaces of the rings are ‘true’, we install our proprietary scope mounts. Our mounts are made of steel, and designed to provide maximum strength without excessive weight. As a final step to assure maximum strength of the entire scope mount system we carefully hand-fit each mount to its individual action ring.

The bottom half of the scope ring is machined as an integral part of the scope base. This unique arrangement provides several important advantages:
1. The mount does not overhang the ejection port
2. The scope can be mounted as close to the bore as possible
3. Eliminates the joint between the base and the ring which is a significant weakness of standard scope mount systems

We change the factory scope base holes to 8x40 and use five Torxâ head screws rather than the standard slotted or Allen head screws. This change adds integrity to the mounting system by providing an exceptionally strong joint between the scope base and the action ring. Our mounts are available in either 1” or 30 mm.

This is the only scope mount we have used that will prevent heavy 30 mm scopes from sliding in the rings under severe recoil generated by such calibers as the 458 Lott. Our scope mount system has a proven track record and is the only system we will install. The customer should be aware that no other commercially made scope base will fit our rifles and they cannot be replaced by any other factory scope mounts on the market.

8. The Legend rifle is fitted with a synthetic stock of my own design that stems from over two decades of Classic Rifle design and construction. It incorporates many-advanced accuracy enhancing features, allows the shooter to control heavy recoil and has the styling, feel and handling features of a best quality French walnut sporter. This stock design fills a void in the current inventory of commercially available synthetic sporter rifle stocks. Our stocks are manufactured by McMillan Fiberglass Stocks exclusively for D’Arcy Echols & Co. This Classic sporter style is available for both Left and Right-handed shooters. Either version features a straight comb (with no drop from comb nose to heel), contemporary style cheek piece, functional point-style checkering pattern, open grip, and cast “on” or “off” both at the toe and heel depending on if the rifle is made for a left or right hand shooter. A 1” red or black recoil pad is standard. The actions are pillar bedded and barrels are free floated. Length of pull is available from 13” to 15”. Factory trigger guard and floor plate screws are replaced with high quality heat-treated Allen key screws. All stocks (except for the Heavy Sporter Model) are fit with standard sling swivel studs. These stocks are available in the following colors only, Black, Brown, and Sage Green. The Sage Green being preferred by those who hunt in warmer climates.

9. All the appropriate metal is carefully hand polished and then caustic immersion blued.

10. Then one of the most critical phases in this rifle’s construction is under taken. The rifle is then test fired repeatedly at our range to confirm that feed, function, accuracy, scope viability and safety requirements are completely met. A variety of factory ammunition is used during testing to determine which ammunition delivers the best accuracy for that particular rifle. We have found that most of our customers are knowledgeable and experienced riflemen that want Precision Load Development for their rifle. We are pleased to develop such data when requested.

Standard Sporter Model in right or left hand configuration…………………………….………$14,000.00

Sales tax will be added for Utah residents.
Client is responsible for shipping and handling charges.
Optics are not included in the above price.

Heavy Sporter
This version is available in the following calibers only: 375 H&H Magnum, 375 Weatherby Magnum, 416 Remington Magnum and 458 Lott.

This version is identical to the Standard Legend Sporter but does require additional time and labor to insure that these rifles will feed perfectly with the larger caliber solid and soft point ammunition.

1. The front sling swivel base is mounted on the barrel.

2. The Heavy Sporter is equipped with either our scope mounts or our aperture sights, but not both. At this time I offer no provision for detachable scope mounts.

Scope Mounts
We use our proprietary scope mounts for all our Legend rifles. Please refer to item 7 in the description of the Standard Sporter Model.

Peep Sights
Even though the stock was primarily designed for scope use, I can provide this iron sight alternative that has been specifically designed for this model. This system incorporates a fiber optic bead-and-ramp front sight coupled with a receiver-mounted peep sight of my own design. This combination has an advantages over the traditional barrel mounted express sights by allowing the shooters eyes to acquire the target very rapidly, visually focus on the only the front bead and the target and has a much longer sight radius. This sight combination works extremely well in low light conditions are zeroed at 50 yards and are easily adjusted for both windage and elevation.

458 Lott. Please be aware that the 458 Lott is notorious for destroying variable power riflescopes regardless of size, weight, or manufacturer. Consequently I prefer to build the 458 Lott Heavy Sporter Model with our peep sights or a fixed power scope only.

Heavy Sporter Model, scoped or iron sight version, in left or right hand configuration….$14,000.00

Sales tax will be added for Utah residents.
Client is responsible for shipping and handling charges.
Optics are not included in the above price.
Accuracy and Reality

When I ship a rifle from our shop it has met my stringent accuracy requirements that are based on the type of hunting for which the rifle was designed. Practicality and intelligence dictates that a 458 Lott shooting the appropriate soft point and solid ammunition will not require the same level of accuracy that can be expected from a Long Range Sporter chambered for 300 Weatherby . When I put a rifle through it’s accuracy test I am often shooting bullets of known accuracy and construction checked on a Verne Junke machine. I use a 16X test scope of know reliability and repeatability. The majority of these accuracy trials are done with precision hand-loaded ammunition shot from a solid bench and under ideal range conditions. Consequently our range results may or may not always be duplicated exactly by the client. However, I will make the following guarantee:

I will supply you, the hunter, with a rifle that will maintain a consistent point of impact, with more accuracy than you can realistically utilize under field conditions.

Optics

To date I have installed and tested almost every make, model and manufacture of riflescope that would be applicable to the big game hunter today. In my experience there is no hands down winner when it comes to performance, longevity or reliability. It matters little if the manufacturer is domestic or foreign, 1” or 30mm, they all have their trade offs and potential for failure right out of the box. Unless we have good reason to object, we will install any scope the customer requests.

However

I will not be held responsible for any scope that fails and requires replacement at any time during the rifle’s construction or after the rifle’s delivery. This will include any scope purchased by us at the customer’s request or supplied to us by the customer. If a scope fails during any stage of the rifle’s construction, all additional expenses such as supplemental labor cost, range cost, ammunition expense, shipping, etc incurred as a result of the scope’s failure will be charged to the customer regardless. Please re-read the preceding statement.


Options Available

Load Development is available upon request. We only compile, test and then supply the load data. We do not supply or sell any ammunition. We can recommend companies that deal exclusively in loading custom ammunition for assembling the ammunition tailored to your rifle The cost for this service is dependent on the caliber, material cost, and the bench and range time required to complete the process. Load development cost begins at $ 1000.00 per load. Further information on this service can be addressed by calling us directly.

Custom Bottom Metal
We offer a custom straddle-guard floor-plate and trigger guard assembly that is a standard feature on our Classic rifles. Installing this unit into our fiberglass stock requires additional magazine box modifications, trigger width modifications and a surprising amount of hand fitting. Current cost for this upgrade is an additional $1200.00. Availability of these units is very, very limited.

Checkered Bolt Stop Release $125.00

Remove and replace the factory knurled bolt knob with a smooth bolt knob $400.00

Remove and replace the factory knurled bolt knob with a two-paneled checkered bolt knob $700.00
Fluted 26" Barrels, these chrome-moly barrels can be had up to 30 caliber and all have .700 muzzle diameter and 8 flutes $ 400.00

Placing an Order

Ordering a Legend rifle is simple. It can be done by letter, phone, E-mail, or in person. We encourage any prospective customer to visit our shop if possible. Here you can see the effort that is required to create one of our rifles. A $6000.00 deposit is required to confirm and schedule a project and acquire the raw materials, with the balance due prior to shipment. A current and signed Federal Firearms License is required from the dealer in your area who will be receiving shipment of the rifle. Rifles not claimed within 30 days of completion will be considered forfeited. Deposit will also be forfeited in cases where the rifle is unclaimed within the 30-day window. Any rifles ordered with non-standard upgrade options (Custom Floor-plate and Trigger guard, 30mm rings in non-standard dimension) or an unusually long or short length of pull that is returned for a refund will be subject to a refund that forfeits the cost of all option upgrades or non standard length of pull stock installed by request on that particular rifle.

Customer Supplied Actions: I have no problem using a customer-supplied action in the construction of a Legend. However there are two conditions that the client must understand and agree to. First the action supplied most meet our inspection standards. Not all actions are created equally. When an action is received it is carefully disassembled and gone over with a very fine toothcomb. If any action does not meet our standards the action is rejected and returned to the customer. Second, if for what ever reason the finished rifle does not meet the customers expectations and a full refund is requested we reserve the right to purchase the action from the customer for $600.00 to prevent from having to tear apart a perfectly good rifle and return that action to the original customer. The cost for all three Legend configurations will be at current market value less a credit of $ 600.00 that is deducted from the current list price for those supplying an action.

Example: Legend standard Sporter current list price $ 14,000.00

Credit adjustment for a customer supplied action - $ 600.00

Total base cost less optics, shipping, insurance, and test fire ammunition $ 13,400.00

Delivery at this time is approximately 12 to 16 months. Since you have read this brochure to this point you will have hopefully become aware that these Legends are not in any way a mass-produced rifle. Each individual rifle is being assembled with the utmost care and attention to detail. Unfortunately, unexpected delays are sometimes encountered, which are most often due to a particular rifle that is not performing as we think it should, thereby requiring additional time for diagnosis and correction. This is a rare occurrence, but should give the prospective client an idea of our dedication for excellence to each and every rifle that leaves our shop. Please feel free to contact our previous clients listed as references for further insight about our rifles.

For those prospective clients that are interested in supplying their own actions please contact us directly.

Brochure # 14 Dated 5/19/07 Prices subject to change without notice

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But then again I spend most of my time in the Caribbean and call into the plant only every other month or so to make sure the bread and water has been rationed properly.

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Originally posted by XL Bar:
You can get them in a standard. We just have to use a pre-64 action.

If it is a left hand standard we have to use the newer claw extractor left hand 70 and build a special magazine and follower.

Brian Bingham
D'Arcy Echols & Co.
Millville UT USA

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Originally posted by 458Win:
Here is a photo of an Echol's box for the pre-64 action - you can see how thick, and literally bullet proof it is when compared with the factory one on the left.


Oh, by the way, although it is hard to believe by anyone who knows him, D'Arcy can be quite considerate of his low paid, imported laborers and on occasion does allow them a small grog ration --- on his good days