Gentlemen,
I'm curious as to the benefits of pillar bedding over regular bedding given the use of a stable synthetic stock(McMillan) and your choice of bedding material(steel bed, titanium devcon, etc). I've spoken with a number of custom riflesmiths and the question seems to be up in the air. I have heard more than one say that pillar bedding, given a McMillan stock, is a fad akin to the 11 degree target crown. Shooters want it because they've heard or read about it rather than any proven benefit. For the purposes of this question I'm referring to both Remington 700 and Winchester Classic actions and chamberings from a .22-250 to a .375 H&H. I would greatly appreciate your opinion. Regards, Matt.

[This message has been edited by Matt in Virginia (edited 11-01-2001).]

Matt,

It can have some application for Rem 700s and especially with some laminated stocks.

Rem 700s have a very small area of metal under the front screw and laminated stocks can easily compress in that direction.

Model 70s of course are different due to the very large area of metal under the font screw.

Mausers can gain becuase of the very small tang area.

Essentially, the pillar increases the area by being glued to the stock.

Mike

How can you piller bed a Mauser, there is no place to put the front piller, as it has already been done by design with a male recoil lug and a female piller on the bottom metal, secured by a screw.. The back screw has had a piller from its birth, to maintain the perfect angle and space between action and bottom metal.

I think on the Rem. 700, pillers are desirable with a plastic stock and are fine on a wood stock, but just glassing will also work on a wood stock, especially from a big game rifle standpoint...Pillers work, no doubt, but they do their best work on the benchrest guns and to a lesser extent on varmint rifles.....

------------------
Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

Ray,

But the rear pillar that comes with a mauser is not glued to the stock, is it?

Benchguns are not pillar bedded because they are glue ins.

Mike

Mike,
Thats correct but I see no advantage to gluing the piller in on the Mauser, but you could if you so desired....

As to the bench guns, some are not glued, in the light varmint class...

------------------
Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

Ray,

Out here they are all glue ins whether Sporter, Light Varmint or Heavy Varmint.

Normally bench guns can't be bedded because the stocks are hollow and you could not clamp the action and stock together as the stock would be crushed.

In fact I think glue ins first started back in the early 70s because of this when the hollow fiber glass stocks first came out and then of course it was realised that a glue in was the way to go for consistent accuracy.

There is no doubt in my mind that for long term trouble free accuracy a glue in will beat bedding.

Of course unfortunately unless you have a Rem 700 type action glue ins are problem for getting the trigger out.

I have Rem 700 375 glue in in a laminated stock and with Jewell trigger and if those boys with the Miller rifles on the H&H thread want to try them out for accuracy they might be in for a surprise

Of course we won't tell them that there is a second bolt with 30/06 bolt face and a PPC barrel which I can change on the spot

Mike

[This message has been edited by Mike375 (edited 11-02-2001).]

With a solid stock like the macMillan the pillars may be superfluous. Now when I speak of pillar bedding this also applies to those pillars cast of fibreglas as well as metal pillars. On wood stocks whether laminated or walnut it has always been my practice to drill out around the guard screws to 5/8 dia and cast a glass pillar. No point in doing this at the front of a mauser as Ray mentioned because it has been done. On a Mauser the pillar would be placed behind the lug with another in front.
Br rifles are usually glue ins because that is the easier way to make them work but more are more or less conventionally bedded now. Some are what I call semi glue ins where they are put in with a Loc-Tite and screws.
One thing about Metal pillars. It is my belief that a pillar that does not adhere to the stock is worse than none at all. Regards, Bill.

Bill,

Would agree that a pillar that is contacting both action and floorplate and is not glued in can become a bit like trying to lift yourself up by your own boot laces?

Mike

i use a combo of pillars and Marine-Tex for bedding the action.
the pillars only serve to give me repeatable torque setting for reassemble return to zero.

------------------
born on a mountain, raised in a cave, hunting and fishing is all i crave!

I think pillars are something that you decide on depending on the type of stock and use as previously mentioned. I think that the glued in benchrest stock is a product of a screw-up and a hell of a sales job!(just kidding)

Mike375 and Bill Leeper,
Give up on Ray Atkinson regarding pillar bedding. You are right. Ray just won't admit that he is wrong when it comes to the Mauser "spacers" being "pillar bedding." They have to be glued or molded integral to the stock. Not spacers or male parts dangling or bottoming out, wallowed into wood stocks.

Hey he is right about everything else, except the 2400 fps gospel. We can overlook these little foibles of his.

------------------
RAB

I will not comment on the pillar vs spacer controversy!
In most cases I am absolutely satisfied with glass pillars. I do like to use an aluminum pillar at the rear of mausers or prewar M70s due to the limited tang area. In this case I glue them into the stock. To do otherwise would be akin to trying to lift yourself up by your bootlaces! (picture me now ducking and running.) Regards, Bill.