High number Rock Island 1903 as a sporter

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26 March 2004, 17:24

358OWNER

High number Rock Island 1903 as a sporter

Hello guys,
This is my first time on this forum and I am wondering if anyone can give me any pointers on my new project. I recently ran across a high number Rock Island 1903 receiver that has been drilled and tapped for a scope. I also own a sporterized low number Springfield 1903 (ser#18626) that I am told is not safe to shoot due to the early practice of over heat treating, even though my uncle hunted with it for many years. My plan is to rob the useable parts from the Springfield, fit them to the Rock Island receiver, re-finish the stock, re-barrel, and re-blue. I am a CNC machinis by trade and have access to all the machine tools necessary to do the job, but have never fitted a barrel before. Are there any good books available on this subject that will give me the required dimensions? Also, I am debating between Pac-Nor, Douglas, and Shilen barrel blanks. Which do you suggest?

26 March 2004, 19:11

Dago Red

What do you need the parts from the springfield for? What is the eventual goal?

27 March 2004, 14:31

358OWNER

The Rock Island receiver and my recently inherited (un-shootable) Springfield are both the same 1903 design, making all of the components of the Springfield useable towards the goal of creating a custom sporterized 30-06 rifle with extreme shootability.

27 March 2004, 14:40

jeffeosso

number 1 thing to do with a springfield... heavier lock spring... the locktime is LONG on that

i've got springfields in 257 roberts, 30-06, 300win, and 358 win.... they are are great guns to have and hold.

jeffe

27 March 2004, 15:17

358OWNER

Who makes a heavier lock spring for the 1903?

27 March 2004, 16:46

jeffeosso

wolf springs...
www.midwayusa.com is one place
jeffe

27 March 2004, 19:03

Dago Red

Cool, that is what i was trying to figure out, if you were going for custom or going for original. I don't know what parts you might need to replace on your R.I. that would take it further for the goal. I have three springfields, well, two 03's and one 03a3. They are fun, here is a little list of things to consider on having the gun rebuilt:

change the safety, this will at least have to be changed to the 2 position Mark II type to clear a scope, but the Mod. 70 types are not that much money (I think 95 for the two position one from Wisner)

Drill and tap for scope
change bolt handle for scope clearance
if you have an 03 then you have the nice milled bottom metal, some people like to add extended release buttons or a lever release. You can get custom hinged floorplate, but are looking at some bucks there.

if you don't like the military trigger you are looking at a Timney, canjar or the likes.

did you say what you plan on rechambering it to? or are you going to stick with 06? what about a 35 whelen?

Barrel wise I have not used them all, but will tell you that I have a couple of douglas and they are good, and I have never heard anything bad about them.

Red

27 March 2004, 21:04

<Guest>

this might be close to what you want it to end up looking like

http://www.hallowellco.com/jim_cloward_custom_1903_springfi.htm

28 March 2004, 08:26

358OWNER

Hey Dago Red,
Actually, some of the work that you have mentioned has already been done to the Springfield. The bolt has been polished and a new sporterized bolt handle added on. Whoever did the work,(probably a long time ago) did an excellent job. And the safety is definately not original, I believe it is aftermarket and it will clear a scope nicely. As for caliber, I am a big fan of the 30-06sprg. but the 338-06A-Square is a damn fine cartridge too. I have been handloading for quite some time so wildcats are also a consideration.
Too many options to choose from!

28 March 2004, 11:50

Wstrnhuntr

Quote:

this might be close to what you want it to end up looking like

http://www.hallowellco.com/jim_cloward_custom_1903_springfi.htm

Thats a nice Springfield. Im kind of torn between 30-06, 35 Whelen and a 338-06. Mine still wears the old 2 groove bbl, it is pretty accurate still but its tired enough that velocities are nessecarily low. Im kind of leaning toward making it a Whelen.

I think mine might have been one of the 1903 match rifles as it is equipped with a Lyman or willams reciever sight. It was modified for a scope before I got it.

Maybe I should just see how some 220 grn RN's kissing the lands shoot in it and keep it as original as possible. What do you's think?

29 March 2004, 01:30

jeffeosso

try the 220 with rl22... it's in the speer book...

unless it's a rebarrel, are all 2 grooves -a3s or higher, which is perfectly fine to shoot... and/or a high number 1903?

if you are torn between the 338-06 and the 35 whelen, and worried about pressure, then you have to do the 35... that way, if you ever wind up with factory ammo (federal) you'll know is lower pressure, as their factory 35 whelen matches my 358.. and my 358 is running a book load.

jeffe

29 March 2004, 05:43

Wstrnhuntr

Quote:

try the 220 with rl22... it's in the speer book...

Ill have to do that, I need to give the original bbl a fair chance before replacing it.

unless it's a rebarrel, are all 2 grooves -a3s or higher, which is perfectly fine to shoot... and/or a high number 1903?

jeffe

Mine is a high # '03 so Im not that concerned about pressure, just looking for suggestions. I think all three are great chamberings but I like my 8X57 enough that one of the larger calibers would round off my battery better than another 30 cal, which I already have two of besides the 30-06. Decisions, decisions..

29 March 2004, 07:35

Calif Hunter

29 March 2004, 11:20

Idared

But why did they take off the knob on that custom Springfield in the pictures? Now it just looks like any other rifle. In my opinion, (admittedly not worth much to anyone but me) that cocking piece/knob is part of the charm of a classic '03 sporter.

Calif Hunter

While I agree with you completely it is a simple fact that most gunsmiths hate the knob on the cocking piece and also the cutoff or bolt release on a Springfield and tend to want to make them appear as a Mauser if possible. I am really surprised that the knob was left on the one that the ACGG did awhile ago to honor the Springfield and Griffin & Howe.

Sad but true.

29 March 2004, 14:52

358OWNER

Wstrnhuntr
Well as far as cartridges go ballistically, the 338-06 has the whellan beat signfigantly in downrange performance and has a far better selection of bullets available. a 338. bullet has a higher B.C. than a .358 giving it flatter trajectory. I have a Savage Mod99 in .358 Win. It is an amazing cartridge that is just a hair inferior in down range performance to the Whelan, and I would consider it a 250yd gun max. The 338-06 has that beat. But then you have the nastalgia factor that for some of us means more. For me I think I will go with the good old 30-06. But all of the cartridges based on the -06 are tried and true.

29 March 2004, 22:34

vigillinus

358owner, make sure your Rock Island serial number is over 185,507. Also, look at the front edge of the receiver ring and see if it is stamped "NS" for nickel steel. Some of the high number RI receivers were NS, others were double heat treated. The DHTs are considered somewhat superior both in absolute strength and in smoothness, although the NS are perfectly safe. Also, make sure you get a late bolt, with a slightly swept back handle. Some of the straight up and down handle bolts are the old single heat treat and are not safe. Here again, look for "NS" stamped under the root of the handle. A straight handle with an NS is safe. The best, again, is a DHT bolt, one that has a swept back handle but no NS mark. In my personal opinion, which is not shared by everyone, only a complete DHT action is worth spending a lot of money on. Most shooters consider an NS action perfectly satisfactory.

30 March 2004, 02:47

JLHeard

Here is another example of what a 1903A3 can look like:

This is my .338 Win Mag with a Wenig stock.

30 March 2004, 04:52

Atkinson

Your Springfield is a low number gun, so I would not mess with it...They had some real problems with those guns way back before most of these guys were in Knee pants, and these things have a way of fading into the past until another one blows up..They were brittle and your best advised to shoot factory ammo in them today..nothing hot.

Your gun is fairly close to the change over number so you might have it checked out..If too hard then you could have it softened and then brought back up to specs..

The old Springfield surely is a lovely rifle and they are just slick as snot in the action...I always liked them..They make a fine 30-06.

Give D'Arcy Echols a call and he can steer you to the right folks to do this work and its not expensive...

30 March 2004, 17:04

358OWNER

Well, I took a look at my new Rock Island Receiver and it does not have a "NS" anywhere. The Serial # is 417534 which I believe was made in the closing days of the Rock Island Arsenal, the late thirties. As for the bolt, I am told that it is probably the original Bolt from the low number Springfield that has been sporterized. Is this going to be a problem? Hey Vigillinus, that is a beautiful 1903. I hope mine turns out as nice as that. What was involved in converting it into the much more powerful 338mag. I was lead to believe that I was limited to 30-06 based cartridges.

30 March 2004, 18:35

GrandView

Quote:

Originally posted by 358OWNER....
Well, I took a look at my new Rock Island Receiver and it does not have a "NS" anywhere. The Serial # is 417534....

Rock Island started making nickel steel receivers at SN# 319921...so yours is nickel steel.

Quote:

As for the bolt, I am told that it is probably the original Bolt from the low number Springfield that has been sporterized. Is this going to be a problem?

I'm having difficulty tracing the components of the two Springfields you've mentioned in this thread. However, if you indeed have an early bolt in the RI receiver, Yes....that is a problem. Find another NS or known safe bolt for that receiver.

GV

31 March 2004, 12:59

Idared

358owner, make sure your Rock Island serial number is over 185,507.

vigillinus

I am sure that you made a slip of the finger here, because I know you perhaps know more about these rifles than nigh unto anyone here. Didn't you mean 285,507 though?