both of these barrels have a good reputation. is there any definable difference in quality between the two?

i am intending to re-barrel a Winchester Model 70. i have decided to use one of these two barrels and i just wondered if anyone had a strong opinion for either one.

quote:

Originally posted by bill smith:
both of these barrels have a good reputation. is there any definable difference in quality between the two?

i am intending to re-barrel a Winchester Model 70. i have decided to use one of these two barrels and i just wondered if anyone had a strong opinion for either one.

You are looking to solicit strong opinion from this site? Oh brother!

Both are equally good barrels. My suggestion would be to toss a coin. Heads, Shilen... Tails, Shilen!

Often the strongest opinions come from those least qualified to give them.

I guess that I am not qualified then. Of those 2 I would only consider a Kreiger. They are good as they can get and Woody?? No comment.
Butch

The Krieger is a "Tier One" barrel - i.e. one of the absolute top barrels (perhaps together with Hart and Shilen) - simply based on their presence in BR competitions. Then there are a whole bunch of barrels which are probably just as good, but for some reson or another are not used by the BR shooters quite as much - e.g. Bartlein, Rock, Obermeyer, Lilja - what not. (We may argue endlessly which manufacturer belongs in which tier...).

Then there are what one could call the "Tier Three" barrels - barrels which are rarely used in BR - barrels such as LW, Douglas, PacNor etc. Also excellent barrels. In fact depending on your application, it is quite possible you'd never be able to tell the difference between a Tier One and a Tier Three barrel...

I don't personally own LW barrels, but I have a few Kriegers. They are some of the best shooting and easiest to clean (SS) barrels I own.

Good luck with whatever you choose.

- mike

JMHO
Krieger is definately a top level barrel like Rock, Kosyshyn, Shilen and a few others.

L-W is good but not in that same league.

You won't see many LW barrels at a benchrest match. You'll see plenty of Kriegers. That said, unless you're building a BR rifle, it'll be difficult to see much difference between them in real world usage.

Krieger

quote:

Originally posted by Fjold:
JMHO
Krieger is definately a top level barrel like Rock, Kosyshyn, Shilen and a few others.

L-W is good but not in that same league.

Craig Kostyshyn no longer makes barrels.

I have Krieger,Lilja and Obermeyer barrels and don't think I have ever even seen a Walther so I couldn't say.

I hear a lot of opinion about barrels...I agree with Forrest. Used Douglas for years...they all shot into an inch (3 shots) The absolutely most accurate barel I ever installed was a Shilen on a M-98 in 6mm Rem...in about 1975.

I tend to use Kreiger, but Lilja can take a back seat to no one...Never installed one that did not shoot incredibly well. Never had a problem with ANY barrel except one Kreiger...which they promptly replaced.

I can't prove it, but I think that most of the accuracy gains the past 20 years or so has been caused by the precision reached in components...comments please!

I have used them all. Years ago I started out useing Douglas because I am one. Used to be Asst VP of Clan Douglas Society of NA. They just weren't delivering the accuracy my customers were looking for. Regretably I switched & chose Shilen & they were better but I found in machining them that the properties of the steel seemed to vary quite often. Some were harder some were softer. I have had excellent results with LW barrels. Personally I like their LW50 SS. Extremely accurate barrels & super easy to clean. I built two 6.5x284s on M700 actions one had a Kreiger barrel & the other a LW. Both had 28" tubes & chambers cut with the same reamer. Both these guns shot tit for tat & cut groups at 700 yds
that folks wouldn't believe.

quote:

Originally posted by pointblank:

quote:

Originally posted by Fjold:
JMHO
Krieger is definately a top level barrel like Rock, Kosyshyn, Shilen and a few others.

L-W is good but not in that same league.

Craig Kostyshyn no longer makes barrels.

Well damn! I wanted to try one.

The $200 long chambered Lothar Walther 6.5x55 on my second project--unbelievable, huh?--has won best group in the Hunter Class at our club's 200 yard range two years in a row.

I'd use more, but we're buying Bartleins now.

I believe they've earned a spot in the top tier of barrel cutters, judged by recent competition results.

flaco

It's all relative. I use mainly Krieger and Bartlien barrels because they are the most consistently accurate barrels I can get my hands on. Most of the barrels I chamber(benchrest) have to be capable of putting 5 shots inside .200" consistently. Now I chamber barrels for High Power and F-Class shooters as well and hunters too. I use some Shilen's for hunting rifles, because they are easy to get and are a little easier on the wallet. For most applications, sub-minute accuracy is all that's wanted, and most any of the custom barrel makers will supply that with regularity.

Duane, I agree that great components are a HUGE part of the accuracy equation. Just look at the sheer number of differnt powders and bullets that we are blessed with today. That being said, there is also a serious jump in the number of barrel makers these days over just a few years ago. More competition=better quality. Same holds true for scopes and action makers.

quote:

Originally posted by flaco:
The $200 long chambered Lothar Walther 6.5x55 on my second project--unbelievable, huh?--has won best group in the Hunter Class at our club's 200 yard range two years in a row.

I'd use more, but we're buying Bartleins now.

I believe they've earned a spot in the top tier of barrel cutters, judged by recent competition results.

flaco

I've got same Lothar-Walther barrel in a 9.3X62. The groups it shoots are simply amazing.

Terry

Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn't a lot of it have to do with the quality of the installation job as well? I have seen lawyers wearing $3000 suits that look like they were bought at a second hand store because of the quality of the tailoring. By the same token, I would imagine that a Smith could do a lousy job so that a Krieger barrel shot all over the place!

So true

I own two L-W .423 barrels. Both are great shooter and I think Wood and the guys over in Georgia make one heck of a nice product. Woody is a great guy to do business with. Just my opine! Now go buy the one you like!

I like Krieger. The idea that every grain of steel to machine the grooves was removed by hundreds of passes of the single-point cutter "sets well" in my mind. The quality indicative in that process just does it for me. Can I, as a novice shooter, tell if a barrel has been cut or buttoned when it comes to how the riflings were made? Probably not, but it's a psychological thing for me...

I never had a Krieger so I can't tell. However, I've had several Lothar Walther's so far and they performed most satisfactorily. The latest of them is a match S/S .308 bull barrel I put on a (shot-out .22-250) Ruger Mk II VT. It's presently my most accurate rifle, averaging < .5 MOA for 5 shots. Here it is, with the best 3 x 5-shot groups shot in a row at 100 m :

Have never owned either of the two barrels mentioned, so no comments from the peanut gallery.
I bought my first Douglas barrel in 1960 and my first Hart barrel in 1968. Douglas makes CM barrels, and I like sporters that are blued, so all of my blued sporters have Douglas barrels. My target rifles have Hart barrels as I don't care about the good looks a blued barrel has for them. I'll stick with these makers as they all have shot very well.
One thing I can say, and that is we are blessed with a whole lot of very good barrel makers today.

Don

I've owned three Kriegers and a Douglas premium grade.I honestly couldn't tell which barrels shot better of the two.I am not even sure they shoot better than the late factory Winchesters or Remingtons.I've shot some groups with the factory stuff that I never did with the custom barrels.I once was developping a load with the 300wm with two new,unfired rifles at the same time.One barreled with a Krieger and the other an out of the box Win.I loaded three rds each of various powders with the same 180TSX bullets and shot the groups with each on that same day. The Winchester proved much more accurate.I had a Remington VLS that would shoot one hole 5 shot groups week after week with the 168gr Hornady boat-tails,but could not shoot the 155 grainers as accurate as my Kriegers.

FWIW, I have used Hart, Shilen and PacNor all with equally fantastic results. I will probably have PacNor do all future projects. Great barrels and workmanship, all shooting sub MOA. All my rifles are sporters. Lou

They are both great barrel makers and you stand to get a great barrel from ANY of the known makers, just order one of their top end barrels if you are worried about it.

FYI, Lother Walther supplies the barrels for the German and Austrian olympic teams.
Does anyone want to say they are not good?