If you were to build a low cost permanently suppressed rifle what rifle/caliber would you chose given the following guidelines [by priority, top down]
1. Cheap (which means no AR uppers)
2. Fully suppressed/quiet (below speed of sound)
3. 200yds tops. Most likely 50-100yds.
4. Light/compact. Could even break down into a pack
Most likely have a picany rail mount on receiver with a good quality laser mounted there someplace.

Initially I thought 300Whisper or something based around the 223 ‘cause there must be heaps of cheap 223’s out there that are just waiting to be chopped. Problem with that is a pill selection. .338W might be better. 458 SOCOM would be great for projectile choice but brass is a pain etc. Maybe .45-70 as a start?

Simple enough?

I will start.

.308 Win. Baikal-single shot Rifle - rebarl'ed to .338 BR. Whisper with overbarrel can.

Might be better to answer that question if we knew what the target was.

This link might give you some answers
info

Deer. Red deer.
Before all you Americans jump down my neck. Its legal in NZ, sorry.

The link might be useful if I was a member of that forum. Cheers anyway.

The 300 Whisper was designed to do what you are describing. Build it on a cheap singleshot rifle or a TC Contender/Encore barrel.

Have shot plenty of deer with the .22 rimfire.

I had a suppressed .308 years ago when this 'game' was relatively new. Not an ideal cartridge for subsonic for obvious reasons.

Was heading towards .300 whisper. Its pretty proven now and quiet. I heard one once. The target getting hit was louder than the report from the rifle which was like a suppressed .22.
Have seen a .338 Whisper made form a Baikel (Russian) single shot which are about as cheap as you can get. Very short, compact break down rifle. Perfect platform for my use.

Seems every time you ask question re subsonic rifle people assume you are going to break a law someplace. Sorry things aren't as simple re the laws in the US and fitting can's to your rifle.

Will keep looking for info. Cheers.

I don't think anyone accused you of anything. You're are looking for something that doesn't exist and you seem rather curt with your response's. Best of luck to you. I'll offer no more "help".

Terry

When I used to import used .22s from Old Blighty, ever so often a crate of guns would arrive which had several Parker-Hale sound moderators tossed in the bottom of the crate.

They all sailed right through customs, which apparently had no idea what they were. Made me really nervous, as I did NOT want them under those circumstances. Matter of fact, I always told the shippers (located on Lamb's Conduit in London) to remove them before shipping. Apparently they never did understand that I meant for them to remove them AND not ship them.

Anyway, I discretely got rid of them to various law enforcement forensic labs if and when they showed up. Did learn afterward (through observation) that they were deadly on even large white-tail under some circumstances.

If I was to put up such a rig today, I'd go with something like the .300 Whisper, on a short action like a break-action or a falling block, with a longish barrel (at least 23" + can, and would mount a laser sight on it for some night work.

And, I'd want a can built exactly like the P-H's, which work by flexing (straightening) Bellevue or Belleville (sp?) kinked spring steel washers. No wipes to wear out, and really easy to clean. Just spin off the end cap, dump the washers and spacers into the dishwasher. Wash, rinse, dry, and put back in the can and screw the cap back on.

Have you considered the 45 ACP?

Same case head as a 30/06 or 308 and easy to get subsonic ammo. In fact you will have a hard time getting any supersonic ammo in this caliber (it is available here in the states, Corbin has a 165 grain supersonic load). Feeding may be a problem as you would probably need to use spacers in both the front and rear of the magazine to keep the cartridges in the correct location for proper release from the magazine. Use 185 grain JHP for a good short range expanding load, the 230 grain full-jacketed ball when you want deeper penetration. In a bolt action rifle you could load to a much higher pressure (look up 45 Super loads) and get that 230 grain bullet going 1100fps for maximum subsonic performance. The small case and large caliber means that you will have a relatively small amount of low pressure gas to go through the suppressor so it will be a VERY quiet combination even with a fairly small suppressor (2" diameter, 6" long).

quote:

Originally posted by AR15Hunter:
Have shot plenty of deer with the .22 rimfire.

Well then, there you go. How about a 2 litre pop bottle, duct tape and that .22 rimfire. Doesn't get any cheaper than that.

The Baikal singleshot is available in 7.62x39 ... I'd start with one of them rather than a 308Win. A 215gr Woodleigh would be near subsonic from it. Unsure whether the russians are using a .308" bore or .311" bore though in their rifles ... either way you have heavy bullet options.
Otherwise a pistol cartridge like a 44magnum in a single-shot H&R.
Cheers...
Con

i kinda think red deer is a bit big for shooting with a subsonic round. a few years back i shot a FN FAL 308 with a supressor that had 200 grain bullets loaded to about 1400 FPS. while the supersonic crack was sort of there, you noticed it if you were close to a tree or something hard, otherwise in an open field it was hardly noticable. I would think something on that order would be much better for red deer

Marlin Camp Carbine 45 ACP or Ruger 77/44. No reason to go with a 7.62 if you want to keep it subsonic. I push a 230 grain bullet at 1000 fps from my John's Guns Camp Carbine and it's a lot of fun.

If you by chance own a T/C single-shot already and you're allowed pistol cartridge carbines how about a Contender in 44 magnum or 45 Colt, or an Encore in 454 Casull or 500 S&W? If your total budget includes the new frame/rifle then the NEF Handirifle costs about as much as a T/C barrel's MSRP, at least here in the States. While it wouldn't be the cheapest solution Chisana's 77/44 idea has merit as well, so long as you're okay sticking with SAAMI spec cartridge dimensions.

I would get one of these fold down styled single barrel Berettas like in the link below

get one in cal 36 ie 410 and 444 Marlin, get it to shoot a what 350 grain cast slug subsonic and then hade it D&T and a full lenght moderator added för weight and balance.

/C


http://www.berettaweb.com/Beretta_Folding_Shotguns/Beretta_412_series.htm

45 acp works great or I have a 223 necked up to 338 250 gr x bullet 1000 fps straight bbl change from 223 on just about any rifle or bore out heavy bbl break open 223. reflex type can will be shortest 12 to 14 in bbl will give you full velocity that short it is easy to fold the stock end instead of bbl end. not sure the need for the takedown, if you already had the rifle a supressed bbl for a blaser would be perfect.

Speaking of the 45ACP. Have you seen the Lee Enfield conversions to 45ACP. I think it takes a 1911 magazine. Just add your can to it.

Rich

how about a 45-70 ruger #1 and a soda bottle filled w/ steel wool?

Check out as company called Armalon, they make gallery rifles in .45acp and .223 conversions on the SMLE/N"4 actions.