Just curious what you guys would do- I've always been a big fan of Maurice Ottmar's work, and by a combination of luck, serendipity, and saving pennies I've would up with two of his rifles. My intent was definitely to hunt with them, as I am not a fan of safe queens. Now that I have them (a 30-06 and a 404 Jeff, both based on a pre-64 action), I am having second thoughts about taking them in the field. They are both in perfect, pristine condition, and are veritable works of art. I tend to like tougher hunts, and it seems I always ding 'em up a bit. What say ye? Are Maurice's rifles art, investment, or intended to go to the top of a sheep mountain? One day I want to keep them-the next day I want to sell...

I am a hunter and shooter. I will not own a rifle that doesn't get shot.

All the rifles I build are intended as field pieces. But that doesn't stop me from trying to make them as aesthetically pleasing as I can.

If a scratch on the rifle(s) will bother you leave em at home. No shame in that. It's your hard earned cash.

It is a question, I have also pondered over, but I think the answer is fairly simple:

1. If it is an investment, don't hunt with them. I doubt Maurice's rifles would really be considered investments that are going to subtantially appreciate. For example I am not going to use a Loveless knife. Why should I? There are equally pretty and functional knives and his knives just keep going up.

2. Use common sense. Don't take them into the rain forest or drag over rocks.

3. So you get a few dings. A lot of people think that adds character and it is certainly memory marks.

4. You are only in this rodeo one time. What are you going to do, keep it pristine for the next guy to use?

Just my two cents.

I actually shoot better with a good looking gun. I see no reason to NOT hunt with any gun made. I collect nothing I don't use for the purpose it was built. I have several fine watches and wear all at one time or another. My favorite hunting shotgun is a Grade VI Browning 28ga Lightning.If it was built to shoot I SHOOT IT. On the other hand I don't throw ANY gun in the back of the truck and if I lay it on the ground it's generally on my coat. I see no reason in letting ANY gun become marked up or dinged thru inattention on my part. That's carelessness. Incidentally I use my Loveless, Randall and Joe Kious knives, I just don't let the skinners touch them.

Did you buy them for your enjoyment or someone elses?....................DJ

Rdelius

How dare you come on here and ask a question about Maurice Ottmar rilfes without showing us a good photo of them? Shame on you!!

I say hunt them. Let them fulfill the purpose for which they were created.

Regards, Wayne E.

I would absolutely hunt with it.

Greg Martin took Theodore Roosevelt's half million dollar Holland & Holland .500/.450 Royal double rifle to the wilds of Tanzania and used it on cape buffalo several years ago.

That set the standard, I think.

I have the perfect compromise,
Let me hunt with them...tj3006

The consensus seems that you should go hunt with it. I would ask that you think about the following. While they are technically your property, and you could light them on fire if you wish, in a sense they belong to all of us. Like the land we "own" we are only taking care of it for a while. All of us will be worm food someday, but the rifle will still be around. I think Ottmar may be the greatest gunmaker ever. He is gone, and will make no more examples of his craft.
If you owned the Mona Lisa would you hang it on the wall in a 1st grade classroom? I think some responsibility goes along with the privilege of owning such a work of art.
Would I hunt with it? Yes. I would take it on 1 or 2 deer hunts out of a stand and carry it in a soft case in and out of the stand. Would I take it on a "rougher hunt" as you described? Not if hell froze over. In any case, its yours, and do with it what you think is right.

Wes

I say you should use the rifles as they were built to be used. Maurice didn't make museum pieces, his rifles were built for the field (and I mean that in the most complimentary way). These rifles aren't fragile. Treat them with some care and respect and they'll last a whole lot longer than you will. They'll mean much more to you once you share some memorable hunting experiences with them.

Look at it this way, each of these rifles is worth about the same amount of money as the first year of depreciation on a nice new vehicle. Do you leave your vehicle in the garage out of fear that a little wear and tear with reduce its value? Not likely and the reality is that the vehicle is reduced in value to nearly nothing in 8 - 10 years. After 8 - 10 years of use, a good rifle is just getting broken in.

The best value you could possibly get out of those rifles would be to take good care of them while you wore them out.

Do you expect to leave this world one day looking and feeling the same as when you were much younger? Then why expect it from a basic material possession like a rifle. Its value is only perceived. Some see value in possesion,others in its use, some both.

I wouldn't hunt them in the Volcanic pile behind the house but I'd surley hunt them in places where I don't spend more time on my butt than I do my feet.

I say this about it, part of the beauty is what the craftsman made it, the other part is you using it for what they intended it to be used for. every honest ding is a chapter in its story bud.

Red

Yes I would hut with them.
Might not use them in bad weather, [but I have hunted my British doubles in severe rain and snow storms].
Would not hunt them on a horse or a snowmobile.

But I would hunt them.

I'll add this too, any weather or condition I won't take a rifle in (any rifle) is not somewhere I'd be hunting anyways If it's good enough for me it's good enough for my rifle, when I stay inside then it gets to too!

Red

Thanks for the comments! Will try to get some pix up tonight. I have to admit I was playing around with the '06 last night. Great balance, jumps to your shoulder like a well built SxS shotgun, shoots 165 gr Interbonds into teeny, tiny groups. I don't know what I'm balking about!! Maybe it's the Scoop Lake Outfitters bill that just came in! Damn, this is an expensive obsession...

quote:

Originally posted by ForrestB:
Maurice didn't make museum pieces,

Actually, he did. The only Ottmar rifle I have ever seen was in a museum. I'd hunt them though. And I sure would like to see a picture.
Brent

ditto to 22WRF. show us these rifles if you can. while i would be careful with them, i would not let them sit in the safe waiting to be sold from my estate.
james

Don't hunt with them. Put your price on them and if they sell don't look back or display them for your own enjoyment. Lots of damage can happen on hunts including lost in travel and theft.

If you married a beautiful girl, would you save her for the next guy?
Bfly

[/IMG]

My pics came out terrible. This picture is from Hallowell, from whom I purchased the rifle. This is the 30-06. The rifle now has Talley mounts instead of the Buehlers, and it has a 2.5-8x Leupy VX III on it. It weighs 8lbs 2 oz, but it feels lighter. [/IMG]

some reason the pics aren't showing for me, trying this in case nobody else can see it either.



Beautiful. I'd still hunt it

Red

I would probably hunt with it, but I fully understand that hunting with it will devalue it greatly. A lot would depend on your financial status.

That is a choice you must make, keep it new and perfect and it would be a good investment, better than stocks and bonds or whatever.

You can hunt with any old rifle. Food for thought.

rdelius,
I own one Ottmar rifle and a lot of memorabilia from his career. I use his checkering cradle to checker my stocks.

I have hunted with the rifle. One elk hunt and one trip to Africa. The African trip was harmless to it but the elk hunt left a few mars. I restored it and have not hunted with it since although I am not afraid to. The amount of devaluation of the rifle due to hunting, if any, will depend on how you care for it and if any wear is destructive and if it is restorable. These are not New In The Box kind of guns.

I am finishing his last rifle that he started before his health prevented him from continuing. A lot of his friends joined in the effort and it will be finished in the next few weeks. It will be raffled off shortly.

I hunt with this one.

Chic, I can't wait to see the pictures of that rifle finished! Count me in for a ticket


JohnAir, that's an amazing rifle. I don't see how you can keep one in that good a shape and hunt with it. Mine get more digs than that one just sitting in the safe


Terry

John,
I saw that rifle on a website for sale but can not remember which one. It is fantastic. Maurice did not do a lot of carving but typical of him, when he did do it, it was perfect. I love the touch of it on that stock.

Those pics where from before I bought it but it is in same condition except for 2 tiny dings that just indented the wood a bit, 1mm long each. I take more care with this rifle than with others and don´t take it on hunts that involve horses and such. It is a pleasure to hunt with though. It gives me a special feeling. It´s a pre 64 made in 55. I added fixed leaf express with gold line and white bead front and changed the bases to QD warnes.

Chic,
I hope to have one made by you some day.

I have a friend who hunts with me every year that knew Maurice. He told me that the name is pronounced Morris. He also told me of a spoof article they made up for a magazine that talked about the last black elk. They put horns on an Angus and took pictures. Seems Maurice had a sense of humor.

John, his name was pronounced Morris. Most folks at ths show pronounced it the other way. At one of the guild shows, Jack Belk was the master of ceremonies for the auction. In his usual banter he asked Maurice how to pronounce his name and he replied "any way you would like to pronounce it." Not accepting that Jack asked him what his mother would say when it was time to eat and he was out playing and he replied, "Son, dinner is ready!"

JohnAir,

I've got that photo around here somewhere.

Do you know Henry? Maurice and I collaborated on several guns of his. Mostly restoration of double rifles.

Scrollcutter,
I do indeed. He shot 2 stags with one of those doubles, a right and a left on 2 fighting stags. I was carrying the Ottmar when he did it. He hunted with me in Patagonia this year also and is booked for next. Matter of fact I need to talk to him about that. We have been playing phone tag. Wonderfull person.

JohnAir,

Yes, Henry's a prince. Tell him hello from Roger when you talk to him.

I handled one of Mr. Ottmar's rifles. It was a 35 Whelen on a 33/40 action.

Wonderful inset checkering, fit, finish, style, what a wonderful, wonderful rifle. This was at the Dundee Michigan Cabelas.
Price was $3500, and unfortunately I couldn't afford it. If I'd have had the funds I'd have bought it, and heck yes, I'd have hunted with it.

What good is a hunting rifle that you are afraid to take hunting ?

Well if a work of art is in perfect condition why not leave it like that. Why not hunt with a standard style/finish.
Would you beat eggs in a Ming vase?
Would you play darts on the Mona Lisa?

For me, it doesn't pass the sanity test to buy a magnificent rifle, and leave it sitting in the gun safe.
I know a guy down state that used his Bob Owen Springifield Sporter for hunting regularly.
Add me to the group that would use an Ottmar Rifle, and LOVE every shot I got with it.
I wouldn't buy a Porsche and leave it in the garage either.

Don

quote:

Originally posted by JAL:
Well if a work of art is in perfect condition why not leave it like that. Why not hunt with a standard style/finish.
Would you beat eggs in a Ming vase?
Would you play darts on the Mona Lisa?

I probably wouldn't hunt with a rifle as old as either a Ming vase or the Mona Lisa but if I had either of those two art pieces I would certainly put them on display - which, after all is what art is about. Rifles, especially well designed and built hunting rifles - deserve to be hunted.