Should I fire lap or hand lap. Any wisdom you'd care to share about either process would be appreciated. TIA.

What's wrong with the barrel that you have now?

Neither, IMO, unless there is a specific and verified reason to do so.

If you do go this course I would highly advise against “hand-lapping†since the chances of screwing up your chamber are fairly good unless you are extremely careful and really know what your are doing.

This barrel (a Douglas) shoots two shots tight together and then throws the third 1.5" out. With EVERY load, bullets, etc. I 've tried. This barrel now has about 750 rounds through it and is has yet to perform well. I've tried every thing from action and crown work, to bedding (and rebedding), to re-bedding to a different stock. I've tried different reloading components, dies, brass, bullets, primers, powder etc. I've tried different scopes, bases, rings, etc. In short, the only think I HAVEN"T tried is lapping the bore. So, I'll give it a try (if it's easy) and if that doesn't work, the barrel is going in the trash.

Anyway, the barrel fouls rather quickly (as compared to all my other after market barrels, including other Douglas barrels).

And, NO, 1.5MOA is NOT acceptable in my book.

MOA is a term that is very casually tossed around as though it had some mystical, constant, significance to something...which it doesn’t.

Even High Power masters cannot and do not consistently shoot minute of angle, or less, at all ranges. Consider for a moment that the 10 ring on most official NRA High Power targets is quite a bit larger than one MOA in size for the given distance. How many people do you know that consistantly put all of their shots in the ten rings of these targets at all ranges?

But back to the original question, if I just had to lap an installed barrel I would use one of the fire-lapping kits rather than doing it by hand.

9.3,

Have you tried shooting a three-shot group where you clean after each shot?

jim

This may be a stretch, but with all the work you have done, have you thought about just rebarreling the thing?

In any event, I would recommend fire lapping as the last thing I would do just before I pulled the barrel and used it as a pry-bar.

All of my sporter weight hunting rifles are at least 3-shot MOA average shooters out to 300 yds, most are better. EXCEPT for this one, which hangs at about 1.5-1.75 MOA average.

Yes, I have thought about just yanking the barrel, and I expect that is what is going to happen.

How much attention will all you give a barrel before replacing it? Anyone?

Hell, I don't have one hunting rifle in my stable that will shoot less then MOA. Animals don't seem to mind.
But what did the rifle shoot before you rebarreled it?

Remember to only lap in the direction of bullet travel. When done cut off the first inch and last inch of the barrel to get rid of any ovaling caused by dragging the rod or lapping plug along the bore at an angle when starting and finishing the stroke.

When done fire lapping cut off 1 inch from the chamber end and recut the chamber and throat. This insures that you have fresh lands where the throat gets washed out by the abrasive.

In that case, a new barrel it is.

quote:

Originally posted by 9.3x62:
In that case, a new barrel it is.

If that's the case than lapping in one form or other isn't going to hurt anything so why not try it.

If it is a hunting rifle other than varmint the first shot is what counts.If you need a second it sounds to me that you are plenty close enough.What you need you may already have. What you want may stem from desire only.

Out of curiousity what do the forth through tenth shots do? What cartridge are we discussing here? roger

9.3 x 62, don't sweat all the negativity. I have firelapped or been involved in firelapping over 50 barrels, (23 of them mine) and have never had one get worse in performance. I would absolutely recommend firelapping before rebarreling--as bartsche said, it can't hurt to try if your next step would be rebarreling.

I use the David Tubb final finish system, and have had just great results. Several barrels have shown incredible performance increases, most have gotten at least some more accurate and a few (3 or 4) have not shown much increase in accuracy, but all of them fouled less afterward.

I am obviously a big fan, but I have the positive experience to justify my position.

Good Luck--Don

I did the Tubbs final finish in a really rough, but accurate Savage barrel (243 win). I noticed only a very small improvement in accuracy, and almost none in ease of cleaning. I didn't cut off or rechamber at all.

I won't say that it didn't cause some trouble that will show up later. But for now it seems to be a measurable, but trivial improvement.

I'm not sure I'd recommend it. But if you're about to trash the barrel and don't mind another day at the range, it may be worth it.

Well, I'll give firelapping a try. The barrel does copper foul like no other. After 10 rounds, a patch is as blue as Roger's couch. I've had many douglas barrels, and most of them shoot extremely well and don't foul too bad, but this one is a huge counter example. I think this barrel has had more CR-10 through it than all my other douglas barrels combined.

quote:

Originally posted by 9.3x62:
Well, I'll give firelapping a try. The barrel does copper foul like no other. After 10 rounds, a patch is as blue as Roger's couch. I've had many douglas barrels, and most of them shoot extremely well and don't foul too bad, but this one is a huge counter example. I think this barrel has had more CR-10 through it than all my other douglas barrels combined.

roger

I’m not a fan of lapping bores that are already installed...but I have never read or heard anything about having to cut off portions of the barrel and rechamber after fire lapping.

By the time you bought the lapping kit, loaded the bullets, then removed the barrel cut off the muzzle and recrowned,cut off the breech end and rechambered, and reinstalled the barrel you would have as much, if not more, money invested than if you had just bought a brand new barrel that was lapped by the manufacturer.

If the barrel puts two shots together consistently, then throws out the third, I doubt that the problem is anything that will be helped by lapping. It sure could be, of course, but somehow I'd bet against it based on the little we know at this point about whatever the problem is.

So far it sounds to me more like a heat-related problem, or a bedding problem. I'm not quite sure what any kind of lapping would do to resolve either of those.

Just out of curiosity, what does it feel like when you push a moderately tight patch or a well fitting cast bullet all the way through it? Any "rough" spots? How about loose or tight spots?

I have a factory Browing Barrel that did that. I use the gun for hunting.

Solution: Don't shoot more than 2 shots.

It works for me.

I had a .308 that needed to be set back anyway (way off center chamber). I went ahead and lapped it first. It was all a calculated risk. Got lucky; smooth, non-fouling bore and very accurate, even when warm.