Hello all, I'd like to ask your advice on actions for a rifle I'm looking to build. Which models of large ring Mauser actions should I be looking for to make up a medium bore rifle. I'm looking at 358 Win, 35 Whelen, and 9.3x62. I figure it's best to leave the bolt face dia. the same as there are quite a few good calibers available using the .473 base dia. The 9.3x62 is actually a little over that though, correct?
I have plenty of time to research and find the right action.
As for the other components such as barrel, sights, new bottom metal? What would you recommend?My finances won't allow for expensive components, so give me some recommendations
Is there a real need to replace the trigger?

I would be tempted to use a VZ24 action and chamber to 35 Whelen. If you are lucky everything should work just fine as is, new stock and new barrel and see if you can live with the trigger (I bet you could). Would be great for moose, elk or whatever.

This probably isn't what you want to hear, but if finances are an issue, I wouldn't go that way. You can buy a brand new CZ 550 for under $500. It's mostly a Mauser, and it will be cheaper than anything custom. If you're looking for a fun project, then that's another story.

I did an '06 on a Mauser. It was a fun project. I enjoyed it. I started with a $50 Turkish Mauser, and a $40 Remington new take-off barrel. For $125, the 'smith ground down the bridge, rethreaded the Rem barrel to fit, drilled and tapped for a scope, and whacked off the bolt and welded it back on, at 90 degrees. I did a whole bunch of grinding, and polishing to clean it up. Then came $50 for re-bluing. And $40 for a Timney trigger. Then $125 for a nice stock blank. Then another $125 to get somebody better at it than I am to do the stock inletting and glass bedding. Then a ton of work to nicely shape and finish the outside of the stock.

It's a great gun. Wouldn't part with it. Nobody at the range has a rifle as nice as mine. Wouldn't do it again, either.

My theory is that milsurps should be left as nearly unmodified as possible, and enjoyed for what they are. Making them into something they are not is conceptually simple, but more expensive than just buying what you want....unless what you want is a project.

Well, I should have said this was a fun project, and that I knew I could get one cheaper already made. I'm a great fan of the 358 Win and that's not chambered in any bolt gun that I'm aware of. I have a Rem 700 Classic in 35 Whelen AI, but I'm not a fan of Rem's. If I'm not mistaken, a Kreiger barrel is double what some other barrels sell for, so is a barrel of Kreiger's quality really neccessary on a hunting rifle (especially a first rifle project done under a gunsmith's guidance)?

hmmm ...

since you already have a whelen, why make another?

keep it mauser with a classic mauser-ish cartridge like the 9.3x62 or 9x57 or 9.3x57 or 8x57, if a middle bore is what strikes your fancy. thems what seem to know recommend lothar walther barrels; reasonable price, short or long chambered, unquestioned quality, and they know ins and outs of mauserism.

and since you already are rifled up, you can take your time with this project. acquire the makings a piece at a time if need be, and even have the work done - or do it yourself - a bit at a time.

lots o' mauser actions floating around, as are rifles without collector status. have at it.

I like a .308 win. on the M98 Mauser action. For a 35 Cal., the .358 Win. is a good choice for a light easy to handle hunting rifle. The ones I have seen did not require much if any action work on a Military M98 Action originally from a rifle chambered for the 8 mm Mauser ctg. The .358 Win. can be loaded/reloaded with cast bullets and even pistol/revoler bullets for "plinking and low cost practice. For a (real) low cost "hunting rifle", you can go with an A & B Barrel from Midway USA. You can go a step at a time as previously suggested. Rebarrel and finish chamber (headspace), use original military stock, add sights. Then later scope mounts and scope, bolt modification, and new stock in steps as time and money permit. Watch for sales and "clearances" such as MidwayUSA's European Sporter Semi-Finished Walnut stock for $33.70 plus shipping (unfortunately, I think sold out as of 2 March 2004). "Plastic" finished stocks ("drop in" and tighten the screws) are also an option and some of them are on sale now at Midway. Midway also has "Bold" Trigger for the M98 at under $25 plus shipping. A & B barrels are sometimes on sale and sometimes with a "Combo" offer for Barrel and Stock. Shotgun News and Brownell's also have many items advertised for M98 Mausers. Good luck with whatever you decide to do and have fun.

Mark,
If you want to streamline this project a little, and save some money, consider using a commercal mauser of some kind. a Mark X, FN, or Santa Barbara. These already have a commercal style safety, trigger, bolt handle, bottom metal, and are drilled and taped for scope mounts.
Just a thought.

I picked up an elcheapo Turk 8mm at Big-5. I cut the barrel, recrowned, then cut the stock forend down. I drilled and tapped the reciever for a scope base, cut and welded the bolt handle, modified the trigger to single stage and put on an aftermarket saftey. I'm into the gun for about $125 includeing the Bushnell 3x9 scope. It will shoot Speer 170's into about .8" at 100yds.
It made a great project. You could go with an Adams and Bennet barrel from Midway and maybe do 375 Taylor or something different.

I built up three conversations now. Two on VZ24's and one on a basic M98. I opted for a 7x57mm, a 350 African Express, and a 458 Win Mag.

In addition to the basic Mauser calibers of 9.3x62, 9x57, 9.3x57, or even a blue printed 8x57, you might consider some of these.

8x62, aka 8mm-06. Same bolt head face, same 8mm barrel, but a new fresh cut chamber. Blue print it and you got a tack driver.

9.3x64 Brenneke. This is by far the equal of the 375 H&H in a standard length 30-06 action. Bolt face has to be opened up, though.

300-375 Win Mag. This is the 375 H&H in using the 300 Win Mag case. I understand that 375 H&H loading data applies as the case volume is the same. However, do verify this before you spend money on it. There are a lot of these floating around.

If you like open sights stick with them. You can put a very nice banded sight on the barrel up front and a nice peep on the rear. This is a very good idea if your Mauser has a very nice crest on it and you don't want to destroy it by drilling and tapping it. Or go with the classic quarter rib and folding express sights.

Timmeny makes a good trigger for it and there are others available, too. Check out the Great American Gunstock company for some very nice but not too expensive wooden stocks. Do a search on Google for "Great American Gunstock" and see what comes up.

RobertD

Fish, and all, thanks for the replies and advice. I have a friend who's been trying to get that 35 Whelen for years, and could get rid of it easily. And I'd prefer one on a CRF action. I'm willing to go upwards of $1000 or so on project cost, realizing it'll probably go higher . I'm looking to make up a reliable, CRF medium bore hunting rifle, in the style of the early Rigby's, a trim classic pure huntin' gun if you will. The caliber choice is down to either a 35 Whelen AI or the 9.3x62. With the Whelen in the lead due to already having dies, cases, reamer, and 1500 or so 35 cal bullets.
Thanks, Mark

1935 Brazillian or Chilean Action (or a good 09 Argentine action), Blackburn bottom metal for the length of the caliber you choose and a Douglas Premium Air Guaged Barrel. Have a good smith install (weld on) a new checkered bolt handle, grind the rear bridge to FN contour, and fit leupold bases. Install a Blackburn trigger and a Wisner 3 position safety.

You should be able to get all of that done for somewhere around $1000.00. It would be a CRF gun in the tradition of the early Rigby's without having to spend thousands on a commerical mauser action.

Blue

Blue,

That $1000 is about what the parts alone cost you twit! What about labor??? Half the appeal of the Argentine action is that it includes the hinged floorplate. You wouldn't need the whole assembly in that case just a nicer floorplate.

Zack

I don't appreciate being called a twit.

I know that those parts would be close to $1000.00 (if you used the Bazillian action probably even a bit more). I should have been more specific about the 09 argentine, although, owning both, I think that the Blackburn Triggerguard shape is nicer than the 09's shape. I am not sure if you can get replcement floorplates for the 09s anymore. I have one (straddle type)that I purchased about 3 years ago that was made by PM.

If I implied that labor was included, I apologize.

I still stand behind the recommendation.

Moreover, I know of at least a couple of very good Smiths s that could do outstanding work to put it all together for less than a $500 bill (stock not included of course)

Blue

Hey Zach, please don't turn this into a slam fest. I appreciate your input, I'd just really like to avoid any flame wars on here OK? Thanks, Mark

Mark



Since you mentioned that you were looking for a 35 Whelen in a controlled round action, you may want to take a quick look at Auction Arms auction number 5540661. There is an FN commercial already barreled up in 35 Whelan that may interest you.



http://www.auctionarms.com/search/displayitem.cfm?itemnum=5540661



Blue

Mark,

I had a gunsmith install a Douglas XX air gauge Premium barrel, chamber it, cyrotreat it, blueprint the action and bolt, install a Model 70 3 pos safety, mill the rear feed lips, high polish blue on the gun, magazine, and action, drill and tap, and new rings and bases; then I put on a new 2.5x8 Leupold scope, commercial magazine, Timeny trigger, and a spiffy A grade stock from Great American Gunstock Company -- the total cost came out to 2400 and that included the price of the VZ24 Mauser. The caliber was 350 African Express.

I also did the same thing to a 458 Win Mag and it totaled 2300 with scope and iron sights.

If you go first class, it is expensive. Then again, it is a class act that is a tack driver as opposed to something off the shelf.

Fred Zeglin did the work for me and I was very pleased with the results and the turnaround. You can check out his website at www.z-hat.com along with pricing out your own custom rifle there.

RobertD

Mark,
1909 Action, $150 ball park, surface grind the action $75, drill and tap $40, new bolt $100, new barrel fit and chambered, $350 +/-, Timney Trigger, $35 or so, 2 position safety $85 or a 3 position safety $200, Straddle floor plate if you think you need it (the standard one looks fine) for the 09 is around $50 and Wisner has them, figure $50 to open up the magazine a bit. The trigger guard can be reshaped for $30 or so and look just as good as one of Ted B's. You can find a commercial FN action at times for $500 to $650 or so. The Sears rifles were the same if you can get by Sears name being on them.

Mark, as far as triggers, I have had some military 2 stage triggers that broke like glass and I often wondered what I was doing replacing them. You can install a set screw to take up most of the first stage. They can be tuned to make a very good trigger.

Blue, thanks for the heads up on that 35 W. on AuctionArms, but I'm buying a VZ24 action from one of the kind folks here. I'm really doing this to experience the whole "build a rifle from scratch thing".
Mark

Mark

You are welcome. Be sure and come back and show us what you built!!!

Blue

I would definatly use a larg ring Mauser, VZ24 is good, 1909 Argentine is good...My choice of the calibers you mention is the 9.3x62, I think its one of the all time greatest rounds ever....

I have an 270 FN commercial rifle for sale that would make a neat conversion, and a M-54 Win converted to a M-70, and already in 9.3x62, Lother walther barrel, nice english sights ready to custom stock, test fired for accuracy adn its very accurate..I am selling the M-70 as a barreled action, but I have the 54 stock and I would toss it in...If this is anything that might interrest you then give me an email..

I would defintely opt for the 9.3x62 round it is efficient and very good, bullets for all ocassions exist from 232 gr oryx bullets to woodleigh 320 gr, so it is not that hard to get bullets or brass for it.

Ray, my email is not working. Could you send me a PM in regards to the guns/actions you have? Particularly the M54/M70 9.3x62. I'd like some more info. Thanks, Mark

Gentlemen

There are many advantages of the 9,3X62 over the AI whelen. Factory ammo is not a problem to find in most parts of the world. It will also save some of your hard earned money that been tossed into the project in a higher secondhand value.

How about a 8X68S? 8-06 is nothing more than a poor copy of 8X64S Brenneke

Cheers
/ JOHAN