My hunting buddy is trying to save rifle weight, is it possible to not have the bottom metal to access the magazine and just have a lightweight stock with no hole in bottom instead?

He currently has a ULA in 300 win mag, but doesn't like the action (too tight or something) and he just purchased a RH Model 70 with magazine bottom latch. (What is the term for this type of magazine?). But his ULA doesn"t have this feature, it is a blind mag and he likes that.

Anyways, he is thinking about taking this Win. Model 70, 300 win mag to a gunsmith and converting to lightweight sheep rifle:

Win Mod 70 action, 300 win mag, #2 lilja at 25" would be .591" , McMillan Hunter's Edge (22 oz.)etc...

Is this possible to convert to blind mag rifle? Will he loose cartridge capacity?
How much weight savings would there be?

Thanks

Winchester used to offer the M70 in a blind mgazine. Don't remember the capacity.

Magazine capacity stays about the same depending on whether or not you shorten the magazine box or not.
To do it you need to order a Winchester 670 Trigger guard and a front screw Escuteon........DJ

Yes, you will lose capacity. I talked to McMillan and Mark Bansner at HighTech... at least with a standard cartridge capacity will go from five to three... I can only assume the same will be true of mag's.

I have a number of model 70s with blind mag Mcmillan stocks in 30-06-sized cases. 4 in the mag and 1 in the pipe is absolutely no problem.

BTW, though a bit of an aside, if your buddy is so concerned about weight for a sheep rifle, why not put together (or buy) a shorter, lighter 270 or 280? A Lilja #2 @ 25" on a magnum action and suitably constructed (filled) stock is still going to be on the heavy side. A nice 270 or 280 with a 22.5" ultralight contour on a standard action is going to be noticeably lighter and plenty of gun for a sheep. Anyway, I know you didn't ask that...

Your friend should have bought a Winchester Super Shadow in 300 WSM. Blind magazine, short action for lighter weight. Plus they are inexpensive. You can find them at many dealers, and all Wal-Marts that carry guns.

Aaron

9.3x62, Old habits? He's been hunting with a 300 win mag for 30+ years.

He also lives in B.C., and bear are always a possibility- probably fels more comfortable with a 300 win mag than a 270-280 cal.

What weight would such a rifle have, finished? His current ULA is about 6.75 all equipped (Scope, sling, ammo).

His current 300 WM UL rifle is 6.75 lbs fully equipped and he thinks that is too heavy?

No, he loves the weight, but hates the tight action- apparently with the ULA he can't even use once fired cases from any of his other guns because they jam.

He can deal with a slightly heavier rifle, but wants to shoot for about 7.25 pounds. Is this possible?

I guess everyone has their opinions, but personally if I was going to save weight I would rather whack an inch or two off the barrelthan get rid of the floorplate. If you need to get the cartridges out of a spronged gun for whatever reason- cartridge pops up, gets dropped in a sand dune or mud puddle, get a twig or pebble in there and interferes with the bolt from below, it can be a royal pain to fix in the field and in a hurry. Just my opinion though, carry a leatherman and you'll have most of those bases covered.

It's easier to get a M700 to a low weight than the M70. A 22" BBL long action rifle can be made into a 5.5# rig (with scope and sling installed) without too much trouble.

WHat is jamming on the NULA? Is it a tight chamber, funky feed rails, feed ramp? SOudns lik ehe has a pretty nice rifle already. Maybe a little tweaking woul dhave him in operation at minimal cost. Of course, I and a thousand other folks would love to build another ultra light rifle for a customer, but he can probably get his going for just a few $$. If you could post some detailed isseus, maybe we could help him with the rifle he has.

MarK and Marc_Stokeld, and others
:
He is set on getting another rifle.

The ULA is not a problem per se, but here is what he explained to me as to why he wants another rifle made up in 300 win mag.:

ULA that he owns has a "...tight fitting chamber." It is difficult to extract cases that were once fired in another rifle. He already broke the extractor (his fault, jammed cartridge- too much pressure)and had it replaced by Melvin. It doesn't feed as slick as a factory Model 70 he bought. It also has a short barrel (about 22" because he doesn't use the muzzle brake that came with the gun), so he doesn't get the velocity he wants, etc....

For these reasons, he bought a Model 70 with floorplate and now is thinking of one without a floorplate and an ultralight stock.

How much weight can be saved by going to a blind mag. configuration?

If he sticks to the floorplate design, can the action or floorplate be trimmed or something to reduce weight, if so, how many ounces are we talking about?

I will send him an e-mail so he can see your answers. Further, if you have anyone that might do this type of work, please PM me.

You can go with a Lone Wolf or High Tech Specialties stock and save some weight. Ditch the floor plate. Yes, you can start milling and drilling and save weight as well. Plus flute the barrel. It starts to get get expensive when milling on the action, so he has to decide how much an ounce is worth to him. Easier (cheaper) on a M700. I like seeing how light i can make a rifle, but it is a lot of work if this guy is paying to have it done-it is regular custom work which means most folks don't know how much work is involved. But if he was shooting a NULA, he must care about what he shoots. I would go with a fluted, unbraked, 24" barrel

As for actual weight savings, I don't know. TO sound like a broken record yet again, most folks do this with a M700. I have some numbers on those ,but not a M70. I am trying to figure out just these numbers right now for a guy who wants to lighten a .270 M70.

Ask him what kind of distance he is going for.
If not that long of range, maybe a lever-action 30-30 would be a good choice.
If he wants it long range, you can certainly do alot with a bolt action, but I think converting to a blind magazine is more trouble than its really worth.
Also, big magnums really need the extra weight, otherwise the recoil can get pretty bad. I think a lightweight #2 countour would be brutal, especially if in a synthetic stock.

-Spencer

Rifle weight is like fast cars, in that speed costs money. How fast do you want to go?

Rifle weight is the same, How light does he want to go?

Mike

quote:

---

Rifle weight is the same, How light does he want to go?

---

As I said previously,

quote:

---

He can deal with a slightly heavier rifle, but wants to shoot for about 7.25 pounds. Is this possible?

---

7.25 lbs shouldn't be a problem, but I'd go it in an 06.

Chuck

Fro a 7 1/4# rifle, if he is in the States, I would have him send the rifle Banser's and have him flute the bolt, flute the barrel, and install one o fhis High Tech Specialties stocks.

If he is a Canuck, then I would find some one up there who could do the metal work and then install a Lone WOlf or High Tech Specialties stock with a blind magazine.

After doing these modifications, he can see if he still wants to lose more weight. IF he does, he can go to some one and have them start milling. BUt He will likely be happy with the above metal work and new, lighter stock with a blind magazine. If you don't mind, I would appreciate it if you posted what exactly he does. I would like to know accurate before and after weights. It wuld help me out when figureing out exactly what is possible with different actions. Thanks

All of this is going to way too much trouble. Have your buddy go buy a Kimber 8400 Montana in 300 WSM. It has a blind floorplate and weighs about 6.3lbs w/o scope. Proper scope selection will get him into the weight he wants. The 300 WSM is ballistically identical to factory loaded 300 Win Mag. The Kimber 8400 feeds like a Winchester and has the same type safety. They shoot great too.
He can get all he wants in a new rifle for less than he could get into trying to redo the one he has...................DJ

Have a M-70 in an MPI (classic Dakota style)24" 7mm barrel that goes .565 at the muzzle. Holds 4 in the mag. Weighs 6# 1 oz. sans scope and mounts.

Oops, here the stats:
The floorplate and TG weigh about 4 oz, but you don't save all that with a blind mag because of the stock acting as a floorplate--call it 3oz with an alloy triggerguard.

I asked for as light of stock as possible--finished with pad and studs 1# 4oz. The magazine box is stock. Skinny barrels can be fussy.

quote:

---

Skinny barrels can be fussy.

---

Is a #2contour Lilja going to be too skinny for his 300 win mag ?

Apparently, even Rifles Inc. uses their own #1 contour...

Any thoughts?

#2 is plenty heavy enough. I would flute it to save weight

Thanks Marc. I will let him know.

He ended up with the .300 WSM Kimber after all this...

He likes the rifle though. His ULA is now his back-up rifle.

Thanks folks.

The 670 held the same 4 rounds in 30/06. I went the other way and converted the 670 to a 70 using Williams bottom metal and a ramline stock.

Same thing with the 70A. I took mine the other way. Just gey a USRAC parts list and look for the different part numbers.