I have been reading through catalogues of the famous English makers from the 20’s to 30’s era and have noticed some interesting points that seem typical to rifles of the day. All the rifles displayed seem to include limited features by comparison to a modern custom rifle. For example, they include a small rear sight island which I believe was typically braised to the barrel. All the metal work seems to include limited work, e.g. no checkered bolt knobs that I could see. Also, the stocks rarely seem to include a cheek piece.

Contrast this with a modern custom rifle which is generally shown with a long quarter rib, often milled integral to the barrel on a high dollar modern build. Ditto the barrel band (being integral). And every metal surface seems to be checkered, jewelled, etc. Additionally modern stocks of the “classic†style custom build always seem to feature a cheek piece.

I am interested to understand how custom rifle building went from one point to what is currently considered the pinnacle. It is not my intent to identify that one approach is “better†than the other, just to understand the change in approach to building rifles.

Just one man's opinion.....

The most beautiful and artistic firearms ever built are being built today by a few of the finest craftsmen ever to pick up a carving or checkering tool. Several of them post right here on this forum.

We have CNC equipment today to make more intricate metal shapes and we use more investment castings than ever.

But the real issue is the evolved design and artistry of the master craftsman. People looking at yesterdays standard and asking.....How do I make something more intricate or functional or challenging.

Make no mistake about it...some of the 1920s creations were magnificient....but there's folks doing far better today maybe not so much in craftsmanship but in the evolved style. The most beautiful, sleekest and best styled guns are being built right now.....enjoy it and go out and order one!

I will give my opinions....during the golden age, so to speak, Africa was mostly under British control, so their gun trades had sort of an in. Also, getting guns from England to Africa was much easier than from the U.S.
As for improvements I think it had a lot to do with advances in machining, especially after WW II. Of course now you have CNC machines that can just about do anything. I also think that adding a new "gizmo" was a way to seperate your work from anothers, or to offer something different. This goes back to early days of Colt or Winchester with all the custom features you could have on one of their guns. Maybe the earlier English makers followed function over form..again, just my opinion.
As for the cheek piece, I think that has something to do with more usage of telescopic sights....kind of an easy fix to let you have a little higher rest for your cheek without having to change the general shape of the stock.
Also a cheeek piece may be more compfortable for shooting, so it stayed on. Again the opinions posted here are my own and in no way reflect those of the owners or moderators of this, or any other, forum...

Having owned a goodly number of English pieces from the "golden days", I'll toss in my $.02 worth.

1. I find the actual detail of workmanship provided by the best custom makers of today at least equal to, and probably on average much better than, the best of the English rifles ever were.

2. The quality of wood available today is generally, however, "CaCa". It is still often fairly nicely figured, but its density and integrity just doesn't compare with what used to be had for a song.

3. Unless today's custom makers learn to properly fit a rifle to its specfic intended owner, then generally, I do not think their products handle nearly as well. (If you will recall for a moment, it was common practice with "best" English rifles to send a fitter to the customer to take measurements. These were later modified by watching him shoot the rifle as its construction continued, with a skilled fitter taking a bit of wood here, another tad there, until the rifle couldn't help but point generally where the shooter's physique and range of motion naturally pointed it... Those dimensions were meticulously recorded so that for future orders the right fit was much more easily obtained. That's one reason why many shooters of the day tended to get most all of their rifles from a single favorite maker of their choosing.)

4. I think many modern custom makers are more attuned to playing wood & metal "artiste" than in making the best functioning rifle they can for a specific owner and use. Because of that perhaps, we tend to see more "gimcrack" options available today than were regularly included on the rifles from England and Scotland. I also suspect the rifles are made more for the gratification of the maker than for the customer, in some instances today.

Still, regardless of era, the best are still really great guns, which a person just can't have too many of if he has the means.

canuck you covered all the points well,i own around 25 english and american makers all pre war out side of some jeffery rifles that had 1 standing 4 folding leaves coupled with a ladder sight most english guns were pretty "calm" sort of speak, i have 2 rigbys that could easily be copied by any american artist/gunmaker there is not alot to them cosmetically but im sure as you stated above they were fitted for someone when they were built, westley richards, to me were the faciest with raised side panels on there best quality rifles flip over front sights trap grips and butts and a feature known only to them was incorporating horn +metal as with there drop boxes and bolt knob tips

i spoke with the owner of rigbys about 4 months ago while trying to track down a serial number and ran an idea of running of some "commemorative rifles " in 275 rigby and stated the fact that they would probably sell and not much work would have to go into making them if they follow the lines of the typical rifle built around 1910 i think it went in one ear and out the other the fact of the matter is an english firm are the only gunmakers that can make a strip down gun and get away with it,

i resectly sold a rifle built by shellhammer a single sqare bridge in 375 if anyone has the 1953 gun digest there are pics of it in there the gun was commissioned by peyton autry he was trying to prove that an american can build a custom rifle just as good as any english firm there is no doubt he was right the gun had englishy line to it but had to much engraving i guess because when the gun was in its state before engraving i looked good but plain and the only way to "jazz" it up would be ornate engraving ......paul

There are ofcouse many opinions...but surely can the craftmanship be duplicated of the ol`days
...one just have to pay for it...just like back then.

quote:

Originally posted by SDH:
In my opinion, there is more quality "English" walnut available today than at any other time. This is certainly true for the 30+ years I've been in the trade.
SDH

I love synthetic stocks and that they are becoming more and more popular. It leaves more nice wood for me!
One has to think that the popularity of synthetics has reduced some of the stress on the walnut supply but I think that there are a lot more rifles being sold today than say 70 years ago and that may to some extent balance it out. But hopefully there will continue to be nice wood within reasonable price for a while to come...................DJ

ditto on mike petrvs book!

SDH where is the dan fraser?.....paul

quote:

Originally posted by SDH:
Early English bolt action rifles were the "cheap" ones from gunmakers often specializing in double guns and rifles. (They are always shown after the doubles in the catalogs.) For the most part, they were an "off the shelf" item and rarely "fitted" to the client as the double were.
I can't remember ever seeing any mention of fitting a bolt rifle stock in any of the English gunmakers catalogs that I have from that era. But all the catalogs show and discuss shotgun and/or double rifle fitting.

Yes, but it is important to note here that I was not comparing off-the-shelf bolt rifles from either England or North America in my comments, regardless of maker. I thought we were comparing truly custom (one-off) rifles ("commissioned" in today's terms).

Then, as now, those were not catalogued, and generally not sold through catalogues. Instead, they were the result of private arrangements, just as now. Often, personal references and or introductions sold/built those rifles, again just as now.

And I was speaking of "best" quality rifles, not the cheapies. True, the great majority of UK-built bolt rifles sold were NOT of "best" quality, but that does not mean none were. True best quality rifles were commonly fitted.

quote:

In my opinion, there is more quality "English" walnut available today than at any other time. This is certainly true for the 30+ years I've been in the trade.[QUOTE]


That has not been my experience. It is almost exactly 30 years ago that I sold the last of my "best" English rifles. Most of the ones I have seen in the last 30 years, whether of American or English make, have greatly inferior wood quality, in my opinion. As I said before in reference to the wood, though, I am speaking of density (porosity, hardness) and structural integrity of the wood, grain flow, proper sawing, that sort of thing, NOT figure. Really good wood of that sort was very easily available up through about 1960, but it certainly is not easily found any more....particularly at affordable prices. At least, that's my experience though YMMV.

It's also worth noting, I think, that what we now call "English" walnut was not at all popular 80-100 years ago if one judges by the rifles commonly seen. Much more popular was the darker wood, often with somewhat less figure but more perfctly laid out grain. (almost akin to Rosewood in appearance at first, passing, glance).

So, one saw less use of the wood which appeared like what we now call "English". In that respect, of course,, I am speaking partly of how the wood is sawed, and its colouration, NOT its species. That may make good "English walnut" appear more common now by comparison.


[QUOTE]I do find the following comment to be all too true in many cases.
4. I think many modern custom makers are more attuned to playing wood & metal "artiste" than in making the best funuctioning rifle they can for a specific owner and use. Because of that perhaps, we tend to see more "gimcrack" options available today than were regularly included on the rifles from England and Scotland. I also suspect the rifles are made more for the gratification of the maker than for the customer, in some instances today.

I did recently see a Dan. Frazer Mauser with: Takedown, trap butt with 5 piece cleaning rod, bolt peep and multi-leaf express rear, gold-bead front with folding ivory, side mount for scope, a trap grip cap and nearly full coverage celtic engraving. The rifle was in .318 AE and simply the finest original bolt rifle I've ever had the pleasure of... Unfortunatly, I didn't get pix!
SDH

If this was 30 years ago, I would be beating your door in to find/acquire that Fraser. His shop in Edinburgh was the source of all my most favorite riles, mainly bolts and single-shots.

Best wishes,

AC

We have better steels better machineing. Giving us better barrels, stronger actions. Rifles that shoot better, stand up to weather better.

Cheaper prices overall.

Lots of people have fallen into the trap that older is better. Why are so many older mausers reheat treated.

No we have better fire arms to day.

There are som pretty nice guns turned out all over Europe, but what the top makers of the USofA is turning out today, is second to none, ever.

If I wrote a Country-Western song it would be something like “My Heros have always been American Gunmakers.†Now having said that please allow me to get pretty far afield with this subject. The American Custom rifle firms such as Griffin & Howe and Hoffman both came about (1923) because the American sportsman (with money) were unsatisfied with the large caliber bolt guns from the UK. I know this may be hard to believe but the sporting press from after WWI has many articles in them about the problem with the expensive bolt action sporting rifles then imported. Men like Whelen, Crossman and Sloan wrote about these rifles and the problems. Americans considered a rifle more of a precision instrument and wanted something that would shoot accurately beyond 50 yards. I’ll not get into all the problems with proprietary ammunition, no standard chambers and such. I would suggest that you read “African Rifles & Cartridges†by John Taylor. This book has a lot of info on the English & German bolt guns of the pre-1940 period. Men like Whelen believed that Americans could build a large-caliber rifle and have both power and accuracy and he worked to help establish G&H.


If money was no object and YOU KNEW WHAT YOU WANTED then the sky was the limit when ordering a custom rifle from a UK maker. Many firms built “Best†bespoken bolt action rifles. I spent years looking for that one special rifle, built on a 1903 Springfield, customized by both an English and German firm. I found both, one from George Gibbs of Bristol, England and one from F.W. Heym Suhl, Germany. If it’s of interest I will, over the next week, post pictures and a good description of the Gibbs-Springfield. I wanted to acquire a custom rifle on the Springfield action so I could compare the English and German work on the metal as well as the wood to the American custom rifles of the same period.

Michael,
Great information as usual.

You know no one's going to say no to you posting more pictures of your rifles. They're always appreciated.


cheers,
- stu

quote:

Originally posted by Stu C:
Michael,
Great information as usual.

You know no one's going to say no to you posting more pictures of your rifles. They're always appreciated.
cheers,
- stu

Stu,
Sometimes I let my enthusiasm get the best of me and takeover a thread and the original question gets lost.

For the folks who my not have read what I wrote about this rifle I’ll start with that.

George Gibbs, LTD. of Vancouver, Canada

Part XVI


In 1920’s America there was no shortage of custom gunmakers who could turn your 1903 Springfield into a fine sporting rifle. There was Griffin & Howe of New York City, Hoffman Arms Company of Cleveland, R.G.(Bob) Owen of Sauquoit, NY, The Niedner Rifle Corporation in Dowagiac MI, and Alvin Linden of Braint, WI just to name a few. If you were a member of the NRA you could, for a few dollars, buy a 1903 Springfield rifle from the Government. Every issue of the American Rifleman contained some information on the 1903 and how it could be better adapted to hunting. If you had $100-$200 to spend, one of the above named would return to you a masterpiece of the gunmaker’s art. Handmade stocks of Circassian walnut, horn forend tip, rust blued metal, a Lyman 48 receiver sight, a detachable side mount with Zeiss or Hensoldt scope was the order of the day. If money was no object the sportsman could have R. J. Kornbrath engrave his rifle from one end to the other. The American custom gunmakers of this period brought the bolt rifle to its highest form with gun writers such as Townsend Whelen and E. C. Crossman reporting on and encouraging the makers.

Some of the bigger sporting goods houses of New York City imported hand-made rifles or would have them made-to-order overseas, usually in Germany. The only 1903 Springfields that I have learned about being sporterized in England are the ones made for Stoeger by Webley & Scott (more on them at a later date) and this George Gibbs.

George Gibbs:
The firm of George Gibbs was founded in 1830 by Joseph & George Gibbs, George becoming the sole owner in 1842. After several different moves he settles at 39 Corn Street Bristol, England with a showroom and office at 35 Saville Row London. After declaring bankruptcy in 1929-30 they moved to 37 Baldwin St and later to Wells Road where they were bombed out in 1941 during WWII and all records were lost at this time. Today the company is owned by the Crudgington family of Bath, England.

Gibbs built their reputation on early single-shot target and hunting rifles and later sporting rifles built on commercial Mauser actions. Specializing in rifle work the company also made fine double barrel shotguns. They are best remembered today for the 505 Gibbs cartridge introduced circa 1910. From the “Forward†to their 1927 Rifle catalog: “Its reputation as Rifle Makers is world-wide, and its weapons have gained renown on every forest in Scotland and in all other countries. The reliability of its sporting rifles is vouched for by many famous big game hunters, including Captain F.C. Selous, F. Vaughan Kirby, Arthur Neumann and W. Bowker.â€

Gibbs Canadian & U. S. Representative:
I have found only three ads in the American Rifleman 1925, ‘27 & ‘28 with George Gibbs advertising a made-to-order rifle. The 1928 ad is the only one specifically offering to customize your 1903 Springfield. At the close of WWI Major Earnest E. Townsley (1896-1980) returned to Vancouver, Canada and became the Gibbs agent starting around 1923-25 until sometime in the1950’s. The first address I can find is from a 1925 ad listing the address as Box 278 Vancouver, BC. By 1928 the address was Box 93 Vancouver. In a 1927 Gibbs catalog the Canadian address is listed as PO Box 93, Pacific Buildings, Vancouver, B.C. I believe that this was Major Townsley’s office and that there was not a showroom. As far as I have been able to learn no work was carried out in Canada. Major Townsley was also a collector of fine and rare firearms and occasionally wrote for the American Rifleman magazine. When a rifle was remodeled it was sent back to the factory in Bristol, England. Over the years I have seen a few rifles with the Canadian address on the barrel but until recently they all have been built on Mauser or Mannlicher actions. The very first Gibbs Vancouver marked American rifle I ran across was a Krag and the second is the 1903 this story is about.

Henry Brace:
When I started this research project I was told that the Gibbs-Springfield had been the property of one Henry Brace who had been a member of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP) and the Gibbs representative in Canada. As these stories sometimes go the only thing correct was that the owner of the rifle went by the name of Henry Brace. I later learned his full name was William George Henry Clarence Brace. The mistaken information that he had belonged to the RCMP was in a way very helpful. When I emailed the RCMP, who can only supply information on members who have been dead for twenty years or more I was told that no one by that name and age was ever a member. The on-the-ball gal who answered my email said that there was a man who was alive with a very close name and if I liked she would forward my inquiry to him. About a week later I got a call from Henry Brace’s son, a retired Mountie.

Henry Brace was born Oct. 14, 1885 in Essex, England to William & Georgiana Brace. He immigrated to Canada in 1903 and returned to England to serve as a Trooper in the Essex Imperial Yeomanry for two tears. He returned to Canada in 1905 to ranch. Some time later he joined the Alberta Police, then went out on his own as a consultant on forensic ballistics for the Alberta Provincial Government, The British Columbia Police and the Royal Canadian Mounted Police. One of Brace’s more famous cases was written up as “Fingerprints in Brass†True Detective Mysteries January 1941. Basically a farmer was killed and from the evidence recovered the RCMP was looking for a man or men who owned a 303 Savage rifle. After Brace looked over all the evidence he told the RCMP they should be looking for a man with a Ross rifle in caliber .303 British that was in much worn condition with a rusty firing pin. If that was not enough he informed them that the murder weapon was most likely the owner’s .250-3000 Savage that was missing. He felt that the fired brass and bullet recovered were left behind to confuse the authorities. After a manhunt by the Mounties that took in much of Canada and the US the murderers where brought to justice thanks to the help of Mr. Brace. The murder weapon was never recovered. This may have been the first time a conviction was won on forensic ballistics. Brace was able to prove that fired cases found on the farm shot years ago and those from a gas station owner who pawned the rifle for a tank of gas and had it for only two days were both from the same rifle. The owner’s father stopped by the gas station and shot the rifle luckily keeping the fired cases. As well as a consultant on forensic ballistics Brace was a Justice of the Peace, from 1924 to 1936 the Deputy Superintendent of insurance, 1936-1941 Superintendent of Insurance & Fire Commissioner of Alberta retiring in 1941 when he then moved to Victoria British Columbia. Henry Brace died April 14, 1973 at Victoria B.C. Canada.

The Rifle:
Henry Brace was a member of the NRA and as such could order a 1903 Springfield rifle. After the action was annealed for engraving and before the numbers were removed serial number 608012 was restamped on the bottom of both the receiver and barrel. Rifle number 608012 would have been made at Springfield Armory in 1915. I am going to let Mr. John Beard, a researcher, author and student of the 1903 Springfield tell you about the “NRA†sales rifles in his own words;

“The pre-WWI Springfield Model 1903 rifle we commonly refer to as the “N.R.A. Sales Rifle†was originally designated the “U.S. Rifle, Cal. .30, Model 1903, Specially Selected, Star Gauged, and Targeted.†Most rifles were not originally marked “N.R.A.â€; the marking was applied much later.

Sale of these rifles was originally limited to members of the armed services and Life Members of the National Rifle Association (NRA). The rifles were manufactured by both Springfield Armory and by Rock Island Arsenal. The first rifles were selected for sale in 1908. The rifles were generally manufactured in special batches with several larger and later batches being consecutively serialized.

Examination of extant specimens shows that the rifles were superior to regular service-grade rifles. In addition to having star-gauged barrels, the rifles also had a higher grade of wood in the stock and handguard and the fit and finish were superior. Some later rifles had a fine blued finish on the receiver in lieu of the standard casehardened finish found on service-grade rifles.

A few rifles are found today fitted with vintage Lyman 48 long slide rear sights. The quality of fit and workmanship suggests the sights were fitted at the armories and were perhaps offered on special order. In addition, a few rifles were converted by fine gunmakers into vintage custom sporters or international free-style match rifles.

In about 1915, a Model 1903 rifle was seized and the owner charged with possessing stolen government property. A subsequent investigation showed that the rifle had been purchased legally through the sales program. Following dismissal of the court case, Gen. William Crozier, Chief of Ordnance, ordered that all sales rifles be marked. Owners were contacted and arrangements were made to have the trigger guards marked “N.R.A.†along with the Ordnance Shell and Flame on the forward portion of the trigger guard. As might be expected, not all rifles were located and marked.

The exact quantity of rifles sold has not been determined. A survey of extant serial numbers suggests the quantity was about 10,000 or more. Sale of Model 1903 rifles to Life Members of the NRA was suspended in 1917 following U.S. entry into World War I.â€


The practice of stamping a small star at the six o’clock position on the muzzle on star gauge rifles was started years after the “NRA†sales rifles were made. This rifle is more refined than any other sporting 1903 I have examined. Nothing was overlooked in building this rifle from the front sight with its pop-up white ceramic night-sight to the sling swivels which have precise fitting and finished screws. The bolt raceway, firing pin sear and trigger are honed and polished until all the tool marks were removed leaving a two-stage trigger that is so smooth I did not realize it was possible on a 1903. Before WWII most custom makers inletted the back of the tang tight to the stock and most show cracking years later from the recoil. Gibbs who had been in the large bore rifle game for many years relieved the rear tang area on the rifle. The express sight has three folding leaves which are marked 100-300-500. The bolt-knob is four paneled, two on the underside finely checkered with the two outside ones engraved. The bottom of the bolt shroud has a screw on both sides at the bottom and ground so the bolt when moved forward cams up tight and, allows no play. Kirkwood Bros. of Boston did this same modification. The rifle is marked “Not English Make†and London Proofed dating it no earlier than 1925. The stock of thin shell European walnut has a lot of contrasting grain and is not at all like the wood Gibbs would have used, much fancier than what is found even on their “Best†rifles.

The rifle has about 100% engraving coverage including the long-slide Lyman 48 sight. A Canadian theme is engraved with a moose on the floorplate, bear on the receiver ring, sheep on the triggerguard and a caribou on the trapdoor grip cap which holds a spare front sight and retaining screw. The steel buttplate is checkered, engraved and has a trapdoor. The safety is finely checkered on the end and the words “Ready & Safe†are in gold. The words “On & Off†on the magazine cutoff are also in gold. Engraved on the barrel is “George Gibbs, Bristol, 35 Savile Row London, & Vancouva (sic) Canada.†The engraving is very Germanic and most likely was done in Germany or Austria. Gibbs would have employed an engraver(s) but the engraving is not what one would be likely to see on an English rifle or shotgun. The Krag-Gibbs pictured in this article appears to be engraved by the same hand. The Krag engraving is not signed but the 1903 has the initials “N.A.â€. The krag is engraved on the barrel “Remodelled (sic) by George Gibbs, Bristol, 35 Saville Row London, & Vancouver Canada.â€

When the Gibbs records were destroyed in WWII this ended any chance of learning what the rifle cost or how long it took to complete. Both time and money would have been substantial to build this rifle considering the fancy wood, complete engraving coverage plus having to ship the rifle from Vancouver to England and Europe and back. Even though Mr. Brace was an avid outdoorsman and hunter this rifle has seen little use with few handling marks and a pristine bore. As one observer of this rife said “A complete gun collection in one gunâ€.

I would like to thank Henry Brace’s son William Henry Marter Brace O.M. and his daughter Mrs. Margaret Garry for their help in my research of their father.

Michael Petrov,

Id like to see a pic of that rifle assembled

Whats the forearm length on that stock from the front reciever ring edge to the forend tip?

Rick

I try to attend the winter Vegas show every year where I get to see many pre-war custom rifles both for sale and ones brought by folks for me to look at and get information from. About six years ago on the very last day of the show Jerry Fisher found me and said “Follow Me†he then lead me to a dealer who had mostly shotguns and there was the cased Gibbs-Springfield. I would have never looked in an English case for a 1903 Springfield sporter. The rifle was priced way beyond anything I could pay, I spent a LOT of time talking with the dealer who had it for sale on consignment. It took two years with me saving my coins and offers back and forth before I became the caretaker. The dealer is a super nice guy and did his best to make sure everyone got a square deal. Here was a rifle with engraving from one end to the other, nice wood but the thing that caught my eye was the sling-swivel, the attention to detail on something normally overlooked was special.

quote:

Originally posted by GSP7:
Michael Petrov,

Id like to see a pic of that rifle assembled

Whats the forearm length on that stock from the front reciever ring edge to the forend tip?

Rick

Not the best picture, sorry. The length from the front of the receiver ring to the forend tip is 6 ¼â€.

Thanks Michael, 6 1/4" .... Looks like my 8 1/4" on my pattern will be OK

Does everyone see two large pictures and one small one? I'm trying to resize and having problems.

MIKE,you know how much i like pictures as im sure most people here do,just dont give out too much info here they wont need to buy the book!!!........paul

I've always been under the impression that the british bolt actions were never of the quality of their german/austrian counterparts. It was the doubles that made the british what they were back in the day. And even those were never or should I say rarely "beautiful" to behold.
(Most of the wood looks of "Dakota" grade)

Just as in Aston Martin and Rolls Royce, the british were known for the "bespoke" nature of their doubles, whereas the germans/austrians were more known for their metalwork.

quote:

Originally posted by FMC:

Just as in Aston Martin and Rolls Royce, the british were known for the "bespoke" nature of their doubles, whereas the germans/austrians were more known for their metalwork.

Today Bentley Motorcar's frames are produced in Germany and then shipped to England for finishing. At least in cars they are learning to get the best of both worlds............DJ

The rear sights, the bars on the express sights are tarnished silver, I’ve not tried to polish them but should.

A little about the action work done by Gibbs. The raceway, rails, ramp, breech-cone and extractor collar have all been stoned and polished until all tool marks were removed. The trigger and sear have likewise been cleaned up and polished to a degree I have not seen before. Even thought the trigger is still two-stage (of which I like) it has the best rigger pull of any 1903 Springfield I have seen. The bottom of the safety housing has two screws (see picture) added then ground to lock the back of the bolt up tight and in the same position each time. Kirkwood of Boston did the same thing except they used pins instead of screws.

The stock where the back of the tang is has been relieved so recoil does not crack or chip the wood. About every pre-war American classis rifle was stocked tight in this area, with the possible exception of Wundhammer most are chipped or cracked.

If anyone would like other pictures or measurements, just ask.

quote:

Originally posted by djpaintles:


Today Bentley Motorcar's frames are produced in Germany and then shipped to England for finishing. At least in cars they are learning to get the best of both worlds............DJ

It's deja vu all over again....use a Mauser action for a H&H bolt rifle.........