Is it me, or have there been alot of posts lately asking "I have gun XYZ so can anyone recommend a good smith to work on it for me?"

In general, a smith who has been around for a few years and has a shop that is never quiet and never clean, is in general a good smith.

You do not have to be an expert on every gun out there to be a reputable and solid gunsmith.

Therefore, for those looking for that magic guy who can solve all your firearms woes, start in the phonebook under 'G'.

-Spencer

I think that depends an awful lot on where you live and what you want to have done.

A bad blueing job isn’t going to permanently effect your rifle’s mechanical function and can be fixed pretty easily. Some other jobs have a far more permanent nature and can be extremely difficult or even impossible to fix if they are screwed up.

Caveat Emptor is the phrase of the day when buying firearms (new or used) or getting them worked on.

I was once told that the difference between a good gunsmith and a bad one is that the good one knows how to fix and hide his own mistakes better.

Alot of those in the phone book under "G" should be located under "B" for butcher. I should take some pictures of my mauser action that a guy under "G" ruined. This guy tried to hide his mistake too. I could tell he screwed it up when I picked it up, but when I got home and took it apart ,I found out the extent of the damage he did. I thought, he must think people a extremely stupid to accept butcher work like this.

I took the action back to his shop , I did not say a word, held it up so he could see his work , gave him "the look" and walked out.
He called me later and offered to replace it.

quote:

I was once told that the difference between a good gunsmith and a bad one is that the good one knows how to fix and hide his own mistakes better

I like that.

-Spencer

Not all of us are foruntate to live in a place with a lot of "Good" smiths to choose from. Have tried several in my area, I have yet to find one I am happy with.

I think there are probably a lot less bad gunsmiths than there are PITA nitpicky customers. It is hard enough to make it as a 'smith, an idiot doesnt stand a chance in the trade and wont last long. It is not like looking for a job as an auto mechanic, any high school dropout can become a grease monkey. And that is not to say that all mechanics fit that description, some of them are very good, but a good many of them are not.

I expect that one common problem with both trades is a lack of people skills. Work on another persons possesions should never be started without plenty communication and an acknowlegment by the customer of said work to be excecuted. To do otherwise is a huge mistake IMO and is asking for controversy.

Lets see ... I had one smith say there are no one piece bases made for Savage Model 99's. Had another smith who thrice ordered the wrong slide for a 1911. Had another who bent a slide on a Browning Highpower fitting a new front sight. Had another that said there is no point in installing pillars and bedding an action if it already shoot 1.5 inch groups as it will not provide any benefit. He never even looked at the rifle.

All the above happened many years ago when I first moved to the area. All where local recommendations. My 1911 was finally sent to a Master Pistol Smith and it now works great. The Highpower was sent to Browning and still never worked right again. The Savage I fixed myself. There may in fact be some good smiths in my area. But, I guess I gave up on my local smiths. Too many bad experiences.

Yes there exits a large group of people whom you can never please. And there are those who refuse to pay what it costs to do it right and then gripe later when they did not get what they wanted because of it.

Although I think that the grease monkey comment could be accurate in the case of guys that just do oil changes and lube jobs I wouldn't say that a dolt could be what I consider a mechanic.

that' isn't the point though. I think people ask about recommendations for 2 reasons (in the main)

1. they have been burnt or unable to find a good local smith

2. they understand the value of their dollar and would rather increase their chances of having a good first experience by getting recommendations.

Gunsmiths are not that easy to find. I am not talking about the pad installation and bolt jeweling crowd, I am talking about doing anything you need done. There are a limited number of clients, and most shooters and hunters are content with off the shelf rigs without modifications other than the scope installation. Most of what you find are gunshop owners that either have learned to do some of it themselves or have a guy that did get trained but spends more time doing the things needed to make an income than he does building custom rigs. This type of place is likely fine for most of what a guy wants. But when it comes time to spending hard earned money on a piece that requires extensive work, or precise work, it needs to go to a different type of guy.

Red

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
Mr. westernhunter, do you think any highschool drop out could do your job? Probably as good as his chance of making a competent mechanic. All 4 of my mechanics have been with me over 16 Yrs. ea. and probably have more continuing schooling than you. I think comments like you made are very much out of place. Butch

I made an effort in my previous post to qualify my statement and so as not to offend mechanics such as yours. Now are you going to tell me that there are "not" scores of bad mechanics wrenching on peoples cars in sweatshops across the country? I know enough about the business to know better, certianly more than you know about my continuing education.

54JNOLL,

Your points are well taken. Gunsmithing in general is a diverse field. I expect the ones who know all there is to know about it can be fit into a Volkswagen bug.

As such customers should realize that and if one 'smith doesnt have what they consider a satisfactory answer then they need to seek a second or third opinion.

Conversley, I expect that the number of 'smiths who have never buggered something up could fit into the same little round car. They are all human and their clients should realize that as well. That is not to say it is OK to do so, but that there are good and bad ways to handle such circumstances. Im sure that Butch can relate to that as well as the two trades do have certian inevetable mechanical (and human) parallels.

The odds of having a good gunsmith in your area are vrey slim, to try and find a guy within driving distance is an exersize in frustration in most cases. I live in Maine and have most of the work that I cannot do myself done by a gentleman in Texas. Well worth the postage.

Mr. Beyer, you are correct in saying we have a few very good smiths in Texas. You won't find a nicer, honest, or more knowledgeable smith than Mike Bryant. As you may know, I used to be in the barrel business and sold 1000-1500 barrels a year to smiths all over the USA,Canada, New Zealand, and Australia. I am more fortunate than most people as I have been in touch with a lot of people in this business and have a good feel about some of them. Butch

[ I expect that one common problem with both trades is a lack of people skills. ]

Most good smiths are also type A personalities. Perfectionists aren't unfriendly, they just don't tolerate idiots well.

Butch, I would say that it is either Texas or Penn. that has the majority of knowledgable gun smiths of any state. The gentleman that I am refering to is in Bruceville and I will be quite surprised if you do not know who I am talking about. As far as I am concernsd he is as good as they get.

Bob, are you talking about Don Mulhal? If you haven't heard a good joke in a while, call Don. Butch

Along the topic of this thread, could someone, anyone, tell me of someone who can fine tune a Mauser-style (CZ) action in regards to feeding and who is located within a three hour drive from Dayton, Ohio?

quote:

Most good smiths are also type A personalities. Perfectionists aren't unfriendly, they just don't tolerate idiots well.

Man, I hate to think of myself as a type A personality, but boy do I hate idiots.


-Spencer

quote:

Originally posted by HP Shooter:
Along the topic of this thread, could someone, anyone, tell me of someone who can fine tune a Mauser-style (CZ) action in regards to feeding and who is located within a three hour drive from Dayton, Ohio?

Give Bruce a call at Flint & Frizzen, (248) 625-3333 to see if he can help you out. He's about 1 1/2 hour north of Toledo.

quote:

In general, a smith who has been around for a few years and has a shop that is never quiet and never clean, is in general a good smith.

I have someone for you - just a mile up the road, meets all your criteria, and I would not consider him qualified to mount a scope (even if the barrel is already tapped).

Brent

Butch, as far as I am concerned there is no better gunsmith around then Don, along with being a gentleman in every respect. I say this about a guy that I have never even met.

So, I guess when you start looking for a Dr. or mechanic you just go to the respective listings in the Yellow Pages?

You are looking for confidence and references.
Very few of us just go cold calling folks to fix things.

All my 'smiths are in different time zones than I. There be a bunch of pistol 'smiths everywhere I go, damn few rifle smiths though, and even fewer that know what they are about. I speculate there are some good ones here in the Windy State, but the only fella I know personally that is good is up in Georgia.

If you want a challenge try finding a good rifle 'smith in Miami/Ft. Lauderdale/Palm Beach. Lots of luck!

I have had decent luck in my part of Iowa (Quad Cities). With the Rock Island Arsenal, Rock River Arm, Armalite, and a few other gun makers near by there are a lot of guys who do a little smith work on the side. I have seen a few real bad butcher jobs, but they don't last long here.

Funny thing is a good gunsmith lives 4 miles away from me now. In Nebraska, I had to search far an wide to get a decent smith.

Rusty, believe me there was an awful lot of research put into picking a gunsmith before I sent anything to anyone.