How is the knurling on this receiver ring done? Is it a mechanical process or is it hand cut, like checkering?

I never knew for sure but I think it is rolled on; I would roll it on but in the 1930s when labor was cheap, they might have filed it in. The Banner is definitely rolled on and I assume the checkering is too.

it is done with a knurling tool, held in a lathe or mill and the object is turned. cheap little tool to buy too

I am sure the Mauser factory did not use a cheap little knurling tool like the ones we use in lathes, to do that. They used a huge roll in a special rotating fixture.

quote:

Originally posted by butchloc:
it is done with a knurling tool, held in a lathe or mill and the object is turned. cheap little tool to buy too

I would have thought the same thing, but how do they get around the fact that the action is not round? I suppose the same method could be used as that used to machine solid ribs on barrels, but I don't understand how that is done, either.

it is done in a mill. the tool is a little round wheel grooved to cut lines under pressure. look it up in a machine tool catalog & I think you'll see much

You would go bankrupt using those cheap knurling
tools.
Cheapest one I have is about six hundred, and I have to
rebuild it after every job.
Damned if I know how just the top of that receiver was
done.
Only thing worse than knurling was parting off with
a HSS blade.

Its cold forged.....stamped

Round knurl is lathe cut.....this is not round

Of course it is round; they used a fixture to rotate it between centers. Can't be stamped; you can't stamp around a radius. The top of 98s is a circle.

Well, geez. It's a Mauser with obvious claw mounts and in a laminated stock. I see a bit of conflict here. I know, let the flaming begin, I did not address the original post.

If "Mauser" can be stamped on the front ring, why could cross hatching not be done similarly?

Could be wrong, call home and ask my wife.

Luck,

Stephen

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
Of course it is round; they used a fixture to rotate it between centers. Can't be stamped; you can't stamp around a radius. The top of 98s is a circle.

The knurl obviously doesn't wrap so I would bet it is stamped or roll stamped

Round or not.... realy I couldn't care less either way

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
Can't be stamped; you can't stamp around a radius.

I bet you can as I've had to make die to do job similar to that. it's not perfect geometrically correct due to the straight down forces but you can manipulate the die geo to get what you want.

Now it would take some serious work but I or ted could make you a very large heavy die that has the knurling in the negative on a convex face.
After the outside is trued up and before the inside is bored out and while the action is still soft press it with a few tons of force. It will leave an nice knurl in the surface.

My guess is though that it rolled on. You have two very distinct borders on each side. and the knurling fades in and out tat the beginning and end

quote:

Originally posted by brad may.
Cheapest one I have is about six hundred, and I have to
rebuild it after every job.

Only thing worse than knurling was parting off with
a HSS blade.

Your not a Turner then Brad?

I don't consider rolling impressions with a die to be "stamping". If you do, then it is stamped, but it was rolled on. Like KCstott said. Dies were cheap to make in the old days as die makers were paid very low wages then.

My question is, was it done at the factory or by someone sporterizing it? With the claw mounts, seems like it was done after the factory released it. With what folks did to the German 'Guild' guns, would have no idea how it was done but my guess would be stamped or hand (just looks a little too even for hand done, but you never know).

Is that a stock, or the plywood crate it came in?

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
I don't consider rolling impressions with a die to be "stamping". If you do, then it is stamped, but it was rolled on. Like KCstott said. Dies were cheap to make in the old days as die makers were paid very low wages then.

No I mean you can make a convex die and push straight down no rolling involved and get a near perfect duplication of rolled knurling.

quote:

Originally posted by SmallCal:
My question is, was it done at the factory or by someone sporterizing it? With the claw mounts, seems like it was done after the factory released it. With what folks did to the German 'Guild' guns, would have no idea how it was done but my guess would be stamped or hand (just looks a little too even for hand done, but you never know).

It was either done by cutting it after the Mauser logo was stamped or it was rolled in one shot logo and all. High magnification is the only way to tell and then maybe

It was rolled on at the factory and the logo was rolled on after (maybe before or during on the same roll) the checkering. I understand what you mean by stamping straight down, but the diamonds on the side would not form correctly. It was rolled on with the die being held like a knurling tool and the receiver blank rotated under it. Yes, high magnification might tell more.

It is crossfiled by hand , using a type of treadfile. The tecknique is mutch like checkering.
Look carefully, and you would se a lot of minor imprefections, as varying linedistances, and linedepths. Those Things would not be found in a stamped or rolled surface, or a pantograph engraved surface.

From the book "Mauser Original Oberndorf Sporting Rifles"; page 162.
"The famous Mauser "Banner" trademark, adopted in 1909.....These were at first rolled onto smooth rings, then later the Banners were rolled over stippled or KNURLED rings."
They weren't filed on.

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
From the book "Mauser Original Oberndorf Sporting Rifles"; page 162.
"The famous Mauser "Banner" trademark, adopted in 1909.....These were at first rolled onto smooth rings, then later the Banners were rolled over stippled or KNURLED rings."
They weren't filed on.

Yep rolled on!

quote:

Originally posted by ted thorn:realy I couldn't care less either way

Still

You aren't the OP who asked the question either. I am doing my best to answer it.

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
From the book "Mauser Original Oberndorf Sporting Rifles"; page 162.
"The famous Mauser "Banner" trademark, adopted in 1909.....These were at first rolled onto smooth rings, then later the Banners were rolled over stippled or KNURLED rings."
They weren't filed on.

As far as i can se from your Quotation, the Mauser book, is talking only about how the banner was Applied, and not how the "knurling"crossfiling was applied

quote:

Originally posted by jørgen:

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
From the book "Mauser Original Oberndorf Sporting Rifles"; page 162.
"The famous Mauser "Banner" trademark, adopted in 1909.....These were at first rolled onto smooth rings, then later the Banners were rolled over stippled or KNURLED rings."
They weren't filed on.

As far as i can se from your Quotation, the Mauser book, is talking only about how the banner was Applied, and not how the "knurling"crossfiling was applied

Yes but it only make sense that they would roll both.

dpcd
As to your comment on the diamonds on the side. that is what I meant by " it can be done but it won't be geometrically correct"
Yes the diamonds on the side would be close but not correct

Yes it does.... remember..... production

Yes, ja,rgen; to me, and the usual English definition, is that knurling means a mechanically applied, rolled on checkering, not a hand job. When you want to describe a hand filed surface, well, that is just called checkering.
And I also agree, it doesn't matter one iota at this point.

The reason for my original question was to determine if it was feasible to give an existing receiver that kind of treatment and whether it would involve annealing the action and the re-hardening it.

I guess the answer to that question is that it is feasible, but only if hand checkered.

Even without purpose built production tooling the top of a receiver can be checkered by hand. I have never seen a Mauser receiver so hard that that it was hard to file.

quote:

Originally posted by xausa:
The reason for my original question was to determine if it was feasible to give an existing receiver that kind of treatment and whether it would involve annealing the action and the re-hardening it.

I guess the answer to that question is that it is feasible, but only if hand checkered.

Why do the diamonds on the edges have to be deformed??? I agree that they would be if it were done as described. Instead of rolling it lengthwise to the receiver roll it crosswise. Perfect diamonds and very easy to do in a roll stamp machine.

Just for the heck of it, I wrote Mauser and sent them the picture of the action. Here is the reply I got today.

quote:

Hello Mr. Knight,
In the meantime one of our experts have seen your picture. Probably the Mauser logo was stamped. According to the date of production (especially in the beginning of the last century) the workers in the Mauser factory in Oberndorf, Germany sometimes used chekering rasps.
Best regrads, The Mauser Team

Hope this helps.

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
Just for the heck of it, I wrote Mauser and sent them the picture of the action. Here is the reply I got today.

quote:

Hello Mr. Knight,
In the meantime one of our experts have seen your picture. Probably the Mauser logo was stamped. According to the date of production (especially in the beginning of the last century) the workers in the Mauser factory in Oberndorf, Germany sometimes used chekering rasps.
Best regrads, The Mauser Team

Hope this helps.

It is not fair to throw in sutch thing as facts.
It makes me look like a complete idiot. Just because i could remember how we did in my yonger days