I need to send a friend in Washington a rifle and he said the gun shop that we're shipping to told him he'll have to pay sales tax on the value of the rifle, this true or are they just hosing him?

That sure does not happen in Minnesota.

Don't know about Washington state tax law, but it wouldn't suprise me. States feel as they're being "hosed" by internet sales and have enacted laws trying to recapture lost revenue. Here, there's a line on your state income tax form for you to declare items bought over the internet. Most ignor or under estimate that number. Look for more 'laws' to be pasted.

A gunshop in Louisville tried that trick on me once. I found another less than 20 miles away that charged $30 IIRC. I never went back into the first shop.

Look around-it may be an isolated shop, like my experience.

Clarence

A shop does that here too. (nyc)

The shop must charge sales tax. If it is a gift, then it is use tax. Same rate.

Thank our WA politicians.

Sales tax in California too, but everything is screwed up here...

Yeah, it depends on the state tax laws; most of them say that if you order something out of state then you do NOT have to pay sales tax on it. Some require that you do but it is usually impossible for them to know about it as you receive it directly in the mail. Check your state laws on who pays sales tax and when, on out of state buys and sales. Here, the shop does not collect sales tax as they did not actually sell anything but the transfer service; you have conducted the entire buying transaction yourself, with an out of state seller. Varies by state.

Yes Washington charges sales tax on internet purchases and transfers. Gotta love it! If you intend to try and trick the system and send an invoice saying that the Holland Royal double cost 200 bucks, don't bother. The Law also says that the store will charge "fair retail value" tax if the invoice is questionable.

At my shop in New Mexico we just charge for the transfer.

The law in Washington is very simple, Every Washington resident owes a tax based on the value of every purchase they make. Where they purchase it doesn't matter in the least. It is still a purchase by a Washingtonian.

The gun store is performing exactly the same function as your employer does with your income tax, Medicare tax, and FICA tax. It takes or withholds enough of your money to meet your tax obligation and sends it to the state, to which it is owed. Some states allow you to deduct sales taxes paid from the state income tax you owe at the end of the year, but most do not these days.

And you do not make the purchase entirely on your own. You may negotiate the price and forward funds to the seller, but the purchase actually is completed at the gun shop. The shop has to identify you, run your background check, have you complete the federal 4473 multipage form, receive your gun for you, store it, insure it, ensure it is not illegally used while in their possession, and then deliver it to your custody, care and control. Only then is there a sale completed.

Until all those steps are 100% complete, there is NO purchase yet. So the purchase is actually taking place at the gun shop.

By law no sale or purchase is complete until both parties receive the agreed upon "consideration". For the seller, that is money, but you haven't received your consideration until you jump through all the hoops and can legally take the gun out of the store with you. So the purchase actually takes place (is completed)right there in the State of Washington when you get the gun as your own.

Not true.
When you send payment and the item is delivered to the shipper title passes to the buyer.
That is according to the Uniform Commercial Code. The gun shop is not selling anything but the transfer service.

If you do not agree ask the gun shop if they ever had title to the gun. The answer is they haven't. Then ask the gunshop to return the gun to the shipper. The answer is they can't. They have zero authority other than to conduct the transfer service.

quote:

Until all those steps are 100% complete,
there is NO purchase yet. So the purchase is actually taking place at the gun shop.

Not here either; the actual purchase and sale of the item is completed when the buyer sends the seller the money. Transfer through a dealer has nothing to do with the actual buying and selling. Now, if a state has a law pertaining to interstate sales, well, then you can't get around that, but it is not because the dealer actually sold you anything but a transfer. Here, they charge a transfer fee and charge state sales tan only on that; they can't charge sales tax on the sale of the firearm, as they are not the owners, nor the sellers, of it.

quote:

Originally posted by Macs B:
If you intend to try and trick the system and send an invoice saying that the Holland Royal double cost 200 bucks, don't bother. The Law also says that the store will charge "fair retail value" tax if the invoice is questionable.

It's an AR-15, what if I send the upper to my friend and then just transfer the complete lower through the gun shop, does the FRV only apply to the complete lower now?

quote:

Originally posted by kend:

quote:

Originally posted by Macs B:
If you intend to try and trick the system and send an invoice saying that the Holland Royal double cost 200 bucks, don't bother. The Law also says that the store will charge "fair retail value" tax if the invoice is questionable.

It's an AR-15, what if I send the upper to my friend and then just transfer the complete lower through the gun shop, does the FRV only apply to the complete lower now?

I would say yes. the transaction of the other portion of the rifle was separate.

i freakin' HATE this law.

State tax laws are as deep as federal tax laws. Any internet forum is probably the wrong place to ask a question about state taxes. You'll get more opinion than fact. Consult the office in charge of Washington state sales taxes or their web site.

quote:

Originally posted by kend:

quote:

Originally posted by Macs B:
If you intend to try and trick the system and send an invoice saying that the Holland Royal double cost 200 bucks, don't bother. The Law also says that the store will charge "fair retail value" tax if the invoice is questionable.

It's an AR-15, what if I send the upper to my friend and then just transfer the complete lower through the gun shop, does the FRV only apply to the complete lower now?

You could mail him the upper plus all the parts from the lower. Then he can buy a stripped lower only in WA for under $100 and reassemble everything. Your upper can go to an auction site or local sale. That's a lot of trouble to save sales tax; it almost has to be matter of principal and not profit.

quote:

Originally posted by kend:

quote:

Originally posted by Macs B:
If you intend to try and trick the system and send an invoice saying that the Holland Royal double cost 200 bucks, don't bother. The Law also says that the store will charge "fair retail value" tax if the invoice is questionable.

It's an AR-15, what if I send the upper to my friend and then just transfer the complete lower through the gun shop, does the FRV only apply to the complete lower now?

Instead of putting yourself through the time and expense just to avoid the buyer paying the sales tax, why not just cut your losses, charge the buyer local sales tax, annotate it on his invoice, and he can pay the offset in Washington. Investing three days work and twice the shipping just to avoid 50-75 bucks in taxes seems more than a little silly.

Yes the state of Washington charges tax on transfers. And, at 9.5% it can add a significant upcharge to the cost of the firearm. You also have to add the $40 transfer fee.

It has really dampened my enthusiasim for buying guns on line.

If you move to Washington and transfer the title on your car you pay sales tax on the value of the car. A guy I know bought a car in Washington, moved to California and then back to Washington and had to pay sales tax on his car again.

I am not sure about the gun transfer but it sounds about right. I know that Washington will charge sales tax on purchases made over the internet if they can.

It isn't right, but it is the way the state likes to get money.

It is a fact. The state has figured out that firearm transfers are tracked, giving them a window into the tax due. Use tax was always due but required the purchaser to voluntarily submit it. I'm sure everybody did.

There is no offset for other tax paid on firearms. The shop will either go off the invoice or the blue book if there's no invoice. The transfer fee is not taxed, however.

It is legal to separate shipments and the dealer will only charge you tax on whatever they transfer - provided you submit your use tax on the other parts to the state...

quote:

Originally posted by PaulS:
If you move to Washington and transfer the title on your car you pay sales tax on the value of the car. A guy I know bought a car in Washington, moved to California and then back to Washington and had to pay sales tax on his car again.

In this particular case, he should only have had to pay the use tax if the percentage went up since he moved out of state. Still pay, but less.

The state of Washington gets it any way they can! Here are the ugly details.
Link