For years I have tried to get that sateen sheen of the hand rubbed oil finish that you see on custom rifles like this.


But I have never been able to pull it off. I have been able to make some very nice high gloss finishes but never the nice sateen sheen as shown in the picture. I have tried many finishes like, tru-oil, minwax wipe on poly, linspeed, linseed, pro custom, tung oil, to name a few. I have tried many application process and many rubbing out processes (rubbing compounds, polishing compounds, rottenstone, steel wool, scotch brite pads) and am able to make a nice gloss finish and a ok flat finish but not the sateen sheen.

My current project I have been using Laurel Mountain Forge, Permalyn stock finish over Herters French Red Sealer hand rubbed on by my finger. At first it looked like it was going to be just the ticket for the finish I wanted. After the first few coats the surface finish looked wonderful but the grain was not yet filled. So I applied more coats while knocking down the finish between coats with a fine scotch brite pad. By the time I got the pores filled in I had about 10 coats and the nice sateen glow was replaced with a high shine.

I know from experience that steel wool will give me a flat finish and rottenstone and wax will give me a fairly high polish. Where do I go from here? I could really use some advice. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

(I used the example image from Dave Norin's site, it did not appear to be copyrighted. It is not my image and not my rifle I am just using it as an example of the type of finish I would like)

I'm no pro but when I want to de-shine a stock I use OOOO steel wool dipped in hard paste wax. Takes off the shine and leaves a glow. FWIW --- John303.

Pumice Stone with baby oil as the medium works for me.

I did mine with TruOil and mineral turps 20+ coats and 1000 grit wet & dry as the final 5 coats. I was not happy with the 0000 steel wool finish as I could see the difference and did not like the shiny bits of steel embedded in the stock. I used 240, 400, 600 & 800 grit wet & dry for the earlier coats.

This was my first hand rubbed oil finish.

Well, I stay in that "boat". I am always looking for a better finish. I have gotten the look I was wanting from Permalyn sealer one time, only to be disappointed on another stock. I finished one with Watco and it came out perfect, then did another and never could get the right sheen. I have seen some done with Velvit oil that I loved, but never tried it. My latest purchase is Behlen's Gel coat that I will try next. Maybe it is the individual pieces of wood that let me down, but I cannot seem to find one finish that consistently gives me the end result I want. I keep going back to Tru-Oil time and time again and although not perfect, I seem to get consistent results. It also allows me to polish it for a sheen or cut it back for less of a polish. The search goes on. Its almost like playing the lottery for me. I go into some woodworking stores and see all of the finishes and read the descriptions with words like beautiful, warm, glowing, sheen, rich, hand-rubbed, etc, etc, and my eyes glaze over with anticipation and I buy a new finish to try and get disappointed. I have not tried Waterlox or Watco Teak Oil.....yet. When someone finds the perfect finish, please tell me. Please. I think you are on the right track with Permalyn Sealer maybe Velvit Oil. I would love to see a thread of photos with different finishes represented. Maybe some of the masters will share some later in this thread.

quote:

I know from experience that steel wool will give me a flat finish and rottenstone and wax will give me a fairly high polish.

I've been finishing stocks for about 35 years now. I have used about everything to finish wood and have polled many, many top makers about what they use.

Your problem seems to be not the materials you are using but the fact you insist on overpolishing the final finish by using too fine a grit.

All wood sanding/polishing routines are basically simply making large scratches into progressively smaller ones by moving to finer grits in the process.


You are getting a duller sheen with the steel wool because it is leaving larger scratches on the surface and you are getting to high of a gloss during your polishing operation with Rottenstone because you are using too fine a grit for the polishing operation.

That's because you are skipping a whole range of polishing grits in between which is Pumice- which comes in various grit sizes.

Once you get your wood surface pretty smooth and even I would experiment with the various grit sizes of Pumice to get the sheen you desire.

I would take a few scraps of the wood your stock is made from and finish them up alongside the stock itself. Use them as "test panels" to play around with grits to decide on your exact polishing regimen. It's just like a reloading recipe- TAKE NOTES of what you are did, the type of wood grain and finish you are using and the grit and exact polish regimen you used to get the desired result. It will help you get there again. Don't leave it to memory .


BTW, various wood finishes are different hardness and toughness, so each type of finish will most likely require a slightly different grit size to get the range of gloss you desire.

Thanks for all the responses guys, I really appreciate the input. It appears from your responses that the problem I am having is with the rubbing out of the finish not the application. I have a few questions.

John303, what type of paste wax did you use, a furniture paste wax? I have seen this suggested online before but I am not clear what type of wax is used.

Aron, Did you apply a wax after the Pumice and Baby Oil or just leave it after rubbing out.

Jim62, Thanks for the detailed response, In the past I have tried fine sandpaper rubbing down to F-FFF compounds but the finish always showed scratches. So eventually I went to Rottenstone the finish still showed scratches (hazy) so I applied a carnuba wax on top of that. It came out as a nice finish but a fairly high gloss. That was with minwax wipe on poly. So maybe I will have better results with the permalyn and the compounds. Do you apply a wax on top of the finish after you are done rubbing? What do you use as a carrier for the compounds?

Thanks for the advice on taking notes, I have a book where I log barrel thread dimensions and other things when I build a project gun, currently I log the type of finish but not the process of rubbing out.

I wet sand with a thin finish like Seafin, the higher I go in grit the finer the polish sheen. The real trick, for me anyways is the wiping. Wipe the sanded finish off when it's about tacky with something lint free, cotton or certain paper napkins. I don't see the need to "finish" the finish this way. Different grits of wet/dry sand paper or doing it with some other sort of material like rottenstone and oil..........I see no difference.

Get the hardest paste wax you can find, I have a can of car paste wax, but on occassion I use shoe polish, what it does is reduces the "abrasive cut" of the wool. I too have run into the problem of wool imbedded in the finish, I think the finish must be really dry - I don't do the wool thing for several weeks after applying the finish. Tried many different finishes now I only use Tr-Oil. I find that taking the shine off those plasticy looking factory finishes using the above method works very well. FWIW --- John303.

Put some paraffin oil on the stock, and then sprinkle it with a bit of rottenstone.

Then rub the rottenstone over the entire surface of the stock, slowly and gradually.

Use your index finger covered by a lint-free cotton cloth.

Wipe off the oil and rottenstone from the already rubbed areas as you go.

This was recommended to me on this forum (I forget who suggested it).

It works very well to knock off the glossy finish and produces a subdued, satin sheen.