What problems, if any, are there in removing the front ring recess from a 1903 Turkish Mauser. These models have a slight recess (approx .125†deep) on the front ring of the receiver for the handguard lip.

I can’t see where this would pose a problem, but I know very little about Mausers so thought I would ask before I chuck this in the lathe and turn it off.

Just cut it off, everybody does it

Rick,
I just did five back to back in December, and it's a piece of cake by using a mandrel through the receiver & a live center in the tail chuck. Center drill a hole in the mandrel for the tail center, mill a flat on the mandrel side (or drill a shallow blind) to use an old action screw backwards through the action's rear tang to act as a driving lathe dog.

As for cleaning & squaring the face off afterwards, I lathed back far enough to get a "clean" face. Only problem is that the shanks depth ends up averaging about 0.618" to 0.622", instead of a M98 standard average 0.625"-0.635" to the inner collar, and the original barrel will no longer index correctly. Not really a problem as most everybody is re-fitting another barrel anyway.

If you chamfer a wide radius on the OD, it actually looks like "factory" job.

Hotshot

quote:

Originally posted by MajorCaliber:
Just cut it off, everybody does it

I will...just wanted some second opinions since I know little to nothing about Mausers and all of their little quirks.

I just had this picture in my mind of turning it off and then having 50 guys say: “Oh my God, you just ruined the.........“ you fill in the blank!

Rick just screw that reciever onto a mandrel & turn that sucker off in the lathe.

Lot of people were putting swede barrels on those KKale turks , Called them Twedes. Cuting off that Ring extention was part of the project.

Thanks, guys...I know “how†to do it, just wanted to make sure that I “should†do it! I have already set up my lathe to do the job but just wanted to check before I started since these are the first Mausers I have worked on and for us non-Mausers guys they do get a wee bit confusing with all the sizes,types, countries, models, years, names, etc.

I’m putting new Krieger barrels on them anyway so the slightly shorter shank won’t be a problem.

quote:

Krieger

On a Turk!! Most guys use a Remington takeoff!

I have been turning the lip off 1903 Turks.
If I am putting the same 1938 8mm Turk barrel back on, I only stone the face, and do not take it down to shiney.

Using the 1903 action for another barrel, I cut the face down to shiney and smooth.

Don't forget to break the edge on the large ring. You don't want a rifle that can cut you.

quote:

Originally posted by MajorCaliber:

quote:

Krieger

On a Turk!! Most guys use a Remington takeoff!

I never been a big fan of doing what “most guys†do!

If you are working on turks, this site is definitely woth a look.

http://www.gswagner.com/

Best thing anyone can do is avoid that site.

z1r, You mean you dont like this custom bolt handle job by wagner?

Why do I think that the string around the trigger guard loop has a set of fuzzy dice hanging from it?

Perhaps he should have painted a white circle with a big black 8 in it on the knob?

quote:

Originally posted by Rick 0311:

Perhaps he should have painted a white circle with a big black 8 in it on the knob?

If it did, I would have an entirely different opinion of the site, lol.

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/GunTech/NewsletterArchive.aspx?p=0&t=2&i=348

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/GunTech/NewsletterArchive.aspx?p=0&t=2&i=350
http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/GunTech/NewsletterArchive.aspx?p=0&t=2&i=43
http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/GunTech/NewsletterArchive.aspx?p=0&t=2&i=36
Use Weaver base #45 rear and #46 front for the Turkish Mauser 1903 or 1938.

For the 1903:
You may choose to take .014" off the bottom of the #45 for the rear or shim the front .014".

If the hump is not ground off the rear of the 1903 and the holes moved forward, it may be necesarry to relieve the mount for the closing bolt handle to clear.
http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/GunTech/CheatSheet.aspx?p=0&t=1&i=572

http://www.turkmauser.com/models.htm

How do you come up with a number like .014"? That number will vary depending on each individual receiver and also if it was surface ground. These kinds of decisions are best based on careful review of the receiver at hand. Not some arbitrary number that is expected to apply to the masses of mausers.

Despite the relatively small variances of internal or critical dimensions, the outer surfaces can show quite a bit of variance.

Those Brownell bulletins have surprisingly inaccurate info in them. Just read their bit on intermediate actions. They claim the Yugo intermediates and SR Mexican 98 bolts are interchangable.

Don’t get me wrong...Mausers are great rifles and I am already having a ball tearing down and playing around with the two I bought (which are my first Mausers)...but GEEZ, these things are confusing. Large ring, small ring, large ring/small threads, large ring/large threads, hump/no hump, small/intermediate/long/magnum, pre-war/post war, commercial, military.......the list seems almost endless!

Makes me love my 03 Springfields even more!

Rick, that's precisely why theu are so interesting.

You definitely took the challenging route by starting with a Turk, that much is for sure.

quote:

Originally posted by z1r:
Rick, that's precisely why theu are so interesting.

You definitely took the challenging route by starting with a Turk, that much is for sure.

I’ll remind you of that every time I call you up asking all those stupid questions!

quote:

Originally posted by z1r:
How do you come up with a number like .014"? That number will vary depending on each individual receiver and also if it was surface ground. These kinds of decisions are best based on careful review of the receiver at hand. Not some arbitrary number that is expected to apply to the masses of mausers.

Despite the relatively small variances of internal or critical dimensions, the outer surfaces can show quite a bit of variance.

Those Brownell bulletins have surprisingly inaccurate info in them. Just read their bit on intermediate actions. They claim the Yugo intermediates and SR Mexican 98 bolts are interchangable.

.014" is just for S#45, S#46, the 1903 Turks made from 1903 to 1905 at Oberndorff, and leaving the rear hump or removing the rear hump without disturbing the rear ring.

will a remmy barrel screw right on??

quote:

Originally posted by cummins cowboy:
will a remmy barrel screw right on??

No, they have to be rethreaded for the Turk action.

quote:

Originally posted by craigster:

quote:

Originally posted by cummins cowboy:
will a remmy barrel screw right on??

No, they have to be rethreaded for the Turk action.

You know, I didn’t really understand that comment when it was first made and sort of just chalked it up to sarcasm.

What would be the point/advantage to having to completely rework a barrel to have it fit the action???????

The Remington 700 has minor thread diameter on the barrel = ~ 1" and the Turk barrel has major diameter = ~ 1", so even though the Rem has 16 TPI 60 degree threads and the Turk has 12 TPI 55 degree threads, an average guy with a lathe can cut new threads on the Rem 700 barrel and screw it into a Turk, often without a reamer. But getting the sight dovetails to line up on top is hard to do without a reamer.
Because Rem 700 take off barrels are cheap, plentiful and high quality, and because Turks are plentiful and cheap with barrels are often rotten and 8mm, it is a marriage made in heaven for low budget amateur gunsmithing beginner projects.

quote:

Makes me love my 03 Springfields even more!

Rick

Truer words were never spoken.

Although I have a few rifles that started life as military Mausers, one of them a 1931 Oberndorf, I still prefer a good DHT Springfield action any day.

tnekkcc

I can understand how a Remington barrel can be rethreaded to fit a Turkish Mauser, but I can't see how this job could ever be done without a reamer. Don't you have to cut off the recessed part of the Remington chamber when you fit a Remington barrel to a Turk?

quote:

Originally posted by Idared:

quote:

Makes me love my 03 Springfields even more!

Rick

Truer words were never spoken.

Although I have a few rifles that started life as military Mausers, one of them a 1931 Oberndorf, I still prefer a good DHT Springfield action any day.

tnekkcc

I can understand how a Remington barrel can be rethreaded to fit a Turkish Mauser, but I can't see how this job could ever be done without a reamer. Don't you have to cut off the recessed part of the Remington chamber when you fit a Remington barrel to a Turk?

My father is a 1903 Springfield man [from WWII 1944], I am a 98 Mauser man [From BIG5 1999].

The Remington chamber is already cut. Cutting the protruding Rem breech off is part of the job.

No reamer:
The cartridge sticks out of a Mauser barrel by ~.125" and it is flush on a R700, then ~.125" must be cut of the breech. The tennon is .9" on the Rem, so there would be .775" left. The Mauser has .625 ~ .645", so one either has to make a .13 ~ .15" washer, or only seat the inner shoulder on the Mauser. That is becuase with the original Rem chamber, the shoulder is too far forward for the Mauser action.

With a reamer:
Getting the sight dovetails on top and getting an outer shoulder is easy.

That was my point, I guess. Remington barrels would need an awful lot of modification to fit a Mauser of any model...so why bother???

quote:

Originally posted by Rick 0311:
That was my point, I guess. Remington barrels would need an awful lot of modification to fit a Mauser of any model...so why bother???

So why bother? Where is your spirit of adventure and accomplishment. I have several Turkingtons and they are about as cheap as you can go with a good hunting gun. A bold trigger and a Boyds stock make for a very practicle deer gun. Not fancy but of great utlity for a reasoable price. Now for the gun cranks that can afford a custon rifle built this is probably out of the question. If you have the tooling at home which most of our enthusiests have that tinker with this stuff, it's fun to get by on the cheap and still have something that you engineered yourself. Hell it keeps me out of the bars and JAIL. And the more reason to head to the range, any excuse will work to go to the range. To road test a gun you assembled yourself is about the best excuse one can imagine. Keep your powder dry.

oldcrip,

I appreciate all the advise, but I wasn’t asking for barreling suggestions...I just wanted to know if there was anything unique to a Mauser that I should know about before I chucked them in my lathe and turned the recess off the receiver face.

I’ve built several of my own rifles, I’ve just never built one from a Mauser before. I didn’t think there would be a problem but wanted to check with people who had dealt with it before since I have not. All of my rifle building experience is with 1903’s, US Krags, and Remington 700’s...and I know them inside and out really well. About all I know of Mausers is that some German guy named Paul invented them, and all the types/models seem be be different from each other in varying degrees!

I’m not a “custom†builder...and I don’t believe a rifle has to be “custom†in order to use top quality barrels.

Not trying to sound “superior†but I only use Krieger, Shilen or Schneider barrels and I’m not at all interested in using a take off barrel that would take as much time, if not more, to install than a barrel of my choice would.