You might remember my thread about the problems I had with a Remington Custom Shop Model 7 in .350 Rem. Mag. The expansion right above the belt was .014. I even had a picture or two with the thread, but can't find it now.

Opps... I found it!
CLICK HERE FOR PRIOR THREAD

Everyone said that Remington would do either this or that... well, it seems that Remington just wants to sit on the gun and continue to tell me to call next week. I'm just glad I didn't really need it for the foreseeable future.

There correspondence follows below in reverse order...

Response (TONYA) - 05/29/2003 03:25 PM
Dear Mr. Gilbert:

I apologize for the delay in responding. Your repair is being processed. However, due to
inventory repairs have been on hold. Every effort is being made to resolve your issues as
quickly as possible. Please contact us next week.

Customer (Ernest Gilbert) - 05/28/2003 10:10 PM
Still awaiting news of my rifle? Are you dead. Seems like it.

Customer (Ernest Gilbert) - 05/25/2003 05:07 PM
Can you please tell me the status of my rifle. You have had it some time now, and I'm
interested in your opinion of the problem. Also, is there a projected date of its return

Customer (Ernest Gilbert) - 05/20/2003 05:05 PM
Can you please tell me the status of my rifle. You have had it some time now, and I'm
interested in your opinion of the problem.

Response (TONYA) - 05/12/2003 10:37 AM
Dear Mr. Gilbert:

We have received your firearm. The repair number is 65310. Check with us at the end of the
week and we can check the status.

Customer (Ernest Gilbert) - 05/06/2003 10:30 AM
UPS tracking has it delivered to you this day.

Response (TONYA) - 05/06/2003 10:14 AM
Dear Mr. Gilbert:

At this time we do not have your firearm logged in. Normal shipping time via UPS from Georgia
is approx. 4 - 5 days. Once received it may take a couple of days to get the information logged
into our system.

Perhaps, we will have more information available by the end of this week. If you will contact
us then we will be more than happy to check the status again.

Customer (Ernest Gilbert) - 05/03/2003 10:27 AM
I have sent the rifle to you:
Attention: Joe in Custom Shop this last Wednesday. You should be receiving it shortly. I also
sent pictures or brass, a history of the rifle, etc. along with comments from my inquires on the
Internet. Please confirm the receipt of the rifle either to my e-mail address or by mail at the
return address provided in the letter.

Response (TONYA) - 05/02/2003 12:01 PM
Dear Mr. Gilbert:

We regret that you are experiencing problems with your firearm. Based on the information you
have provided, we suggest that you send your firearm to our Ilion, NY facility.

For U.S. repairs, please follow these guidelines:

1. Record the serial number of your firearm before sending it to us.

2. Pack your firearm for safety and to prevent further damage in shipping and handling.
Preferably, ship in a firearm box, not a hardcase.

3. Remove all accessories from your firearm to prevent loss or damage. This would include
scope, slings, or extra choke tubes.

4. Enclose a letter with the firearm detailing the model name or number of your firearm and
serial number along with a full description of the problem. Be sure to include your full name
and address (P.O. Box and Street Address), including zip code, daytime telephone number, and
e-mail address.

5. Ship your firearm by either United Parcel Service (UPS) or Parcel Post (US Post Office).
Remington is not responsible for damage or loss during shipment, so you may elect to purchase
insurance from your carrier. Customer is responsible for shipping charges to the factory.

For U.S. repairs only, ship to:

Remington Arms Company, Inc.
Attn: Arms Services Division/Repairs
14 Hoefler Avenue
Ilion, NY 13357

Customer (Ernest Gilbert) - 04/25/2003 12:11 PM
Several years ago I bought a Custom Shop rifle in .350 Rem Mag. It has a synthetic stock. It
has been returned to you once because the rounds would porpoise out of the magazine.

But, I have a much more pressing problem. I haven't reloaded with the gun, shooting factory
ammunition, but when I decided to load some once shot brass I had around, I noticed a very large
"inverted" shoulder just above the belt. It appears that the chamber is WAY over specks with
the case expanding greatly above what would be normal. This is obviously a safety issue.
Please advise what you want me to do. I have very good pictures of the brass after firing, a
resized case.

You may call me at 912 XXX XXXX
My name is Ernest Gilbert

[ 06-25-2003, 03:25: Message edited by: JudgeG ]

JudgeG,

Lets be fair, Remington as well as most large manufacturers of practically anything, experience a high percentage of customer complaints, requests, repairs and who knows what. They do not automatically put a complaint at the front of the list of things to do. They have to receive the product, log it (Federal law), assign the product to a customer service person to verify if the complaint is justified, send it on to service where it is placed in line to be seen in oder of when it arrived.

Just looking at the received dates of the weapons in my small shop, I see many that have been here for 20 days "waiting to be seen". In my small operation, I can shuffle guns around, out of order received if the ones ahead are awaiting parts or finish work or something like that. This then frees me up to grab the next gun in order and process it, which means check it over against the invoice, test fire it, or tear it down, clean and inspect it to see what is required in the way of repairs and then make arrangements for the necessary parts, or get the job done.

I don't know what Remingtons service volume is, but I would immagine that it is a bit less than that of the judicial system. My son needs to see a doctor, but the soonest the doctor can see him is about 3 weeks. Of course, if it were an emergency, I am sure that my son and your gun would be put to the front. Give them some time, they will do their best.

Good luck,

Malm

I have a Remington LTR 308 that I sent to Remington about 3 weeks ago, the base, screw holes were off center, and the rear of the action must have been ground down to much also.
I called yesterday and talked to customer service, the lady replied that they did agree the holes were off and that I would be getting a new action and barrel, they will be using the original stock, bolt, and trigger.
She also informed me that all that was left to do was to proof test , it would take about a week do to the inventory they were doing this week.
I asked her if I needed to have a ffl since it was a new serial number and she replied that they contact ATF with the new numbers and that the old one would be distroyed. It will be shipped rite to my door.
I bought this rifle used and dont think the original owner even new that there was a problem, it came with a one peice base and leupold 3-9x matte finish.
I just hope everything that she told me is true and I will be a happy camper.
She didnt hesitate on any questions I asked witch is a good sign

I had good service from Remington as well. i have a 597 in 22mag, which of course has a crappy magazine design. the original mag was plastic, it didn't have a strong enough spring, they sent me two replacements. They cracked after a while and they sent me two of the new metal ones for free. I liked that, even though they still don't feed 100%. Only Remington I have owned made later than the 03a3.

Red

G.Malmborg :

I thought the responses from Remington were self-explanatory. Alas, no one is accountable in America anymore, I guess.

You may be satisfied with a company that tells you to check in a week, and when you do, they tell you to check in a week, then when they do, they tell you to check in a week, all the while, knowing full well that "inventory" (whatever the heck that is) has put inspection and repairs on hold (whatever "on hold" means). I am not satisfied with such a run-a-round. I don't think anyone need be. I feel certain that you don't tell your customers you will have a response when you know full well you will not.

I find no problem with honesty. If Remington was truthful and told me that they did not have the staff available to promptly and properly handle the apparent and current flood of safety issues with their rifles, I could understand that. Unfortunately, Remington chooses to wear patience thin with its "later in the week" crap.

You ask me to be fair. How about Remington being honest, or at least candid about their problems in handling safety issues of "Custom Shop" guns advertised as "hand-fitted"... by a drunk monkey, I guess.

Excuse my bile... but I wasn't even really upset, just giving an update to those who were interested in the progress of the "fix" to the problem... but to be asked to be fair when someone (Remington) pisses on my leg and calls it rain, just ain't in my South Georgia bones.

[ 05-30-2003, 04:01: Message edited by: JudgeG ]

Considering how Remington has dealt with their M600 and M700 trigger issues, are you suprised?

I can understand why you're peeved, I think many companies have taken the stance that it's ok to tick off a few customers now and then rather then do everyone right 100% of the time. I guess good customer service is something that can't be calculated by the bean counters, therefore isn't an issue.

JudgeG, I dont disagree with you. Trust me when I say that I had many 4 letter words after spending 700.00 for a piece of crap.
The only option that I had was to send it to them and hope for the best.

I dont have the rifle yet, It may be more like 2 to 3 months untill I get it back, who knows.

If I am not satisfied when it gets here, back to Remington it will go until they get it right!

If they dont get it right, I will sell every Remington I have and buy Mauser's, they are my favorite anyway.

I wish I had bought the Winchester stealth in 308 now.

Companies should stand by there products no matter what the cost.

JudgeG,

So then, don't be fair... BTW, what have you got against drunk monkeys?


Malm

I'm calmed down... Had a toddy myself.

My problem with drunk monkeys is that they all live in Utah.

If I wanted perfection, I guess I should have had you build me a rifle.... right?

Malm:
Actually, I'm upset that Remington has seemed to stooped to the "post-64" Winchester mentality and production standards. Excluding the very, very serious trigger problems (if one can do that), for many years, Remington was a great buy with "out-of-the-box" accuracy equal to anyone. It just seems to me, that in the last few years, Remington has, as someone stated on another thread, "WalMart"ed their products. The "throw away" model 710 now seems to be the common denominator for which they strive, and that's not good.

I'm getting model 710 customer service on a rifle that lists for 4 times as much. They could (and will have to) do a lot better (if they want my business in the future).

Hey Judge G, Just looking at your picture on my small Laptop screen and I see a strange illusion over your left shoulder. The rock(on the extreme right edge of the picture) looks like a large Black Bear coming for you. Then I look again and it looks like a guys face next to the Bear.

Not sure what to think of all this, cause I'm rather sure the Country Ham, hot homemade biscuits, grits, hash browns, sliced tomatoes and half dozen eggs contained no " Liquid Corn " this morning. (Maybe the grits had gone into some strange fermentation mode.)

As to the Remington rifle (with it's totally excellent, extremely well designed Remington factory trigger), I'd suggest you trade it off as soon as you get it back, don't even bother firing it. I doubt you will ever be happy with it regardless of what Remington does. No need to have that churning around in the back of your mind when you need to count on it for a difficult shot.

That is what I do when I get a firearm that for whatever reason doesn't fit my personal standards. Plenty of great (American Made) firearm manufacturers out there. And the used firearm market will welcome a 350RemMag Custom Shop rifle.

Best of luck to you which ever way you go. And watch out for that Black Bear over your shoulder.

HOT CORE:

What have you been drinking?


And the little copy again...

[ 05-30-2003, 18:07: Message edited by: JudgeG ]

JudgeG,

For your own safety, probably the best result will be if Remington refuses to give your rifle back. I admit I am biased against Remingtons, given their trigger history and other shoddy production practices. However, a nice model 98 can be rebarreled to 35 whelen or 9.3 x 62 to give you as good or better ballistics as the 350 remington in a classy controlled feed setup.

OK, enough lecturing and opining. Good luck and I hope you don't end up in push feed heaven.

Still looks like an elephant to me. Large or small.

JudgeG,

I have to admit, I don't look at factory weapons in the same light as most folks, because I am in the business of improving and rebuilding these. The "repairs" that I do, are to guns that are old and have broken from much use.

Do I see junk coming from the manufacturers? Of course I do, it's just that when a screwed up factory weapon make it to me, it isn't coming for warranty work, most likely it is coming to be rebuilt into something the customer really wanted to begin with but couldn't get from the factory.

A lot of us are in business "because" the factories produce inferior weapons. It is "our" job to take these unfinished articles and turn them into something usable. Not by performing warranty work, but by finishing what they the manufacturers, started.

I don't sell guns. So I don't hear the customers complaints. I see the crap coming from the manufacturers, but the customers aren't coming to me with their complaints. I do on occasion go to bat for customers against giants in the industry like Winchester, and Olin when injuries do occur, but in general, I don't hear the complaints about factory quality or lack of it.

The guns that come to my shop are coming in to be improved. They are brought in by folks seeking the best accuracy they can wring from their existing weapon without the expense of building a complete weapon from the ground up.

Because of this, I don't hear the complaints from the public that other shops do. I suppose I am somewhat insulated from it because if it's screwed up, then I unscrew it and I stand behind it.

I haven't bought a new rifle in years. If I want one, I obtain an action and build me one. Because I am fortunate enought to be able to build anything I want, I sometimes lose sight with the customer who relies on the manufacturer to produce something usable right out of the box. For this I am sorry.

Have times changed and things gotten worse with factory weapons? Absolutely. I believe Remington is guilty of setting up recruiting booths at Burger King in hopes of stealing employees and changing career paths. (Not that there is anything wrong with working for Burger king mind you...)

So, if I seemed not to care about your circumstance with Remington and their customer service department, I appologize. Had I shelled out big bucks for a weapon from their custom shop and had it come with the problems the way you posted it, I too would be pissed.

That said, If I were to purchase me a brand new rifle today, it would be a Remington 700. Of course tomorrow the action would be in the lathe, and the barrel and stock would be on ebay!


I do hope they treat you right.

Malm

I toured the Ilion, NY Remington plant in the late 90's and was favorably impressed with the people and the facility. This was particularly true of the Custom Shop. Having worked in a customer service industry (electronics) for the better part of a decade, I cannot understand the lack of good customer service on Remington's part. I own more than a few Remington rifles, but must admit none are post-2000 models, and am happy with their quality. ANY company can have quality control problems, and ALL eventually do. They should be judged by the lack of quality control but more importantly by their response to the customers problem. Judge G, I hope you get a quick and satisfactory fix to your gun (new barrel). There is no excuse for giving you the run around.

Hey Judge G, Thanks for blowing it up. Even old Hot Core can see the Elephant now. Don't have a lot of them where I hunt.

An update:

Nothing from Remington to date (unless something came in the mail today and my breath isn't being held).

I guess Remington has enough business and the folks who run the place now don't think my inquires to either management or the Custom Shop warrant quasi-prompt action.

My last two rifles have been CZ's. So far, so good.

Ernest,

Don't be so hard on the good folks at Remington. Rifles get fixed on a first come, first serve basis, and they've been manufacturing crap for quite a long time. Plus, I'm sure they'll include a discount coupon for your next Remington purchase.

Although I've made more inquires, still no word from Remington. Perhaps they died???

I hate monkeys too Judge. I got a similiar runaround from Winchester on a Model 70 Laminate in 300 WSM. Took them 8 weeks to get to the rifle after it arrived. They send you a postcard with a reference number on it for when you call. Problem is they only have 2 status categories "It's waiting for a gunsmith" and "shipped". I got the gun back and it is fixed but never any explanation. For the record, The chamber was cut so poorly that a fired case would not fit back in, a resized fired case wouldn't even go in! It came back with 2 fired cases that measured .0015 runout, the fired cases it was sent with runout could have been measured with a ruler! They were kind enough not to screw up the trigger job or pillar bedding that I had already had done. I think I am done buying factory rifles with the possible exception of a CZ550FS in 9.3x62. If I want something in the future I'll find a used action and have it built right,I send them all to the smith anyway.

JudgeG,

Any news on this? A friend sent a Custom KS in a couple of weeks ago, and has gotten decent response from them. He has been dealing with "Joe".

George

Never bitch at the waitress until AFTER you get your food. You bitched too early, and now they are spitting in your rifle's barrel.