Has anyone out there had any experience with the following.

I've built a 17Mach 4 on a trued Rem 700 short action.

Initially I shortened the mag box, follower and spring, eventually reaching a point where it will hold and feed 3 rounds successfully.

The 1st problem was a fired case would fall off the bolt when being extracted, leaving the empty case sitting in the action. I discovered this was caused by the ejector pushing the case to the right far enough to allow the rim to slip out from under the extractor (Only happens with a short case like the 17M4, a 223 case is fineas the angles are different)
I overcame this by fitting a new extractor, however this has caused another problem.

The 2nd problem I face is closing the bolt, which has the new factory extractor. Because the dimensions are slightly bigger on the new extractor it now pulls the short case from the action and ejects it ok. The problem now is the new extractor doesn't go over the rim easily on chambering(sometimes it needs quite a lot of force)this results in a brass shaving being removed from the case rim, and depends on individual cases.
It has been suggested that a sako type extractor will fix the problem.

Has anyone got any suggestions(Useful ones)

Has anyone seen the new Remingtons in 17 fireball or the 221 fireball, and do they work.

Thanks in advance

Was the rifle originally chambered for a cartridge based on the .223 head size? If it was and you are experiencing problems closing the bolt, you could spend more money and have your smith install a SAKO style extractor. I have three Remington 700's with that conversion and none of them experience hard closing, failure to extract or eject.

I would look at the new extractor to see how it is fitting in the bolt face. The .223 extractor should work perfect unless there is a misalignment problem between the bolt nose and the chamber.

If you brought this rifle to me, I would remove the firing pin and then look the extractor over to see if it is seated correctly, then I would insert an empty case in the bolt face to see what is happening.

If everything appeared to be fine, I would remove the ejector and try feeding another round. If the problem were still there, I would try a different extractor. If that failed, I would look at the alignment of the chamber and bolt before spending the bucks on the Sako conversion.

Who “trued†the action?

If you aren’t careful you can screw up the extractor or it’s recess when squaring the bolt face.

It’s also prudent to check ALL functioning after truing actions and BEFORE returning them to the owner.

Doesn’t happen very often, but I have seen some factory extractors that had small burrs/nicks on their lip. Extractors are cheap and you might want to install a new one before you start making irreversible modifications to your bolt.

If you do decide to go with a Sako style extractor I would highly recommend that you purchase one of Dave Kiff’s new bolts that are already machined for them and have the ejector hole in the proper position.

Thanks everyone.

To answer some of the questions raised.
I have a 223 Rem 700 LTR, It had the same problem when purchased new, IE: If you chambered a new case or a FLS case the extractor would slide over the case rim easily (No brass shaving) and extract the case correctly. However if you tried to chamber a previously fired case (From this rifle)the extractor would shave brass off the rim (Very hard to close the bolt). The cause was generous chamber and not enough room in the bolt nose for the extractor to move sideways. IE:FLS cases would move slightly to let the extractor slip over the rim, Fire formed cases couldn't move so the extractor contacted the inside of the bolt nose.
I fixed the problem by removing the extractor and slowly reduced the thickness until a case would slide into the boltface without shaving brass.
I did consider having the bolt nose machined to create a little more clearance for the extractor to move sidways but wasn't sure if this may lead to other problems and as a home handyman didn't have the tools to do the job.
I tried this approach with with my 17M4 and created enough clearance for the extractor to just slip over the rim, However this then lead to the other problem of the case falling off the bolt when it reached a certian point during the extraction, I also tried reducing the ejector spring pressure but that didn't help.
My 223 bolt when used in the 17M4 will slip over the rim great but drops the case during extraction, If I put a 223 case into the 17M4 (Doesn't Chamber, but extractor slip over rim) it extracts and ejects perfectly so length is a factor.

The action for my 17Ma started as a SPS S/S 223, the smith purchased his tooling from the USA, and has built a number of very accurate Benchrest and competition rifles using trued Rem actions and custom actions.

I have had a look at the aftermarket bolts, they look great.

My smith is going to fit a Sako extractor to one of his bolts for a rifle that he is building, and will let me try it in my rifle.

Thanks of the help

x-rings,

Just be aware that installing a Sako style extractor requires some careful tweaking and fitting or it is going to toss empties right up into your scope turret.

Dave Kiff solved this problem by re-positioning the ejector plunger hole in his bolts to the correct position for the Sako extractor so the empties go where they are supposed to.

He will also make the bodies to any diameter you want so you can custom fit them to your receiver for a really tight lock up.

I have no personal or business relationship with Dave Kiff in case you were wondering, but his bolts are the best things out there if you are building on a 700 action, in my opinion.

Factory 700 Fireball's (my first was a Classic) had ejection issues just like you described. Loaded rounds would eject fine, but the angle created with the empty short case, left them laying on the follower.
The fix: moving the extractor location, relative to the ejector. The factory repaired 700 worked fine, then that rifle was sold, but a 2nd 700 Fireball (a LVSF) I currently have came with the repositioned extractor.
Moving where the case mouth hit inside the receiver is apparently critical (with such a short case), along with a better grab by the extractor...resulted in reliable ejection.
I compared my Fireball bolt faces to one from a 250 Sav and a 6.8SPC; clearly different.
It has been too long since I looked, for me to describe in detail just how much the extractor was shifted.
I need to take a picture, as this came up on another board many months ago.
Hope this helps.

Greg

X-rings: In July of 1995 I took delivery of a fantastically accurate custom Rifle in caliber 17 MachIV. It is built on a Remington 700 short action.
The renowned optical genius and riflesmith Wally Siebert built this gem for me!
In the 12 years I have had this Rifle I have fired maybe 2,000 rounds through it - probably less.
In that time I have had maybe 20 fail to feed situations.
I am a Varmint Shooter and mainly shoot Prairie Dogs, Rock Chucks and black feathered flying Varmints with this Rifle - so absolute reliability of follow up shots is not "empirical" for this Rifle in my mind.
By the way I have been using the wonderful Berger 25 gr. bullets in this Rifle - that might have some bearing on its relatively good feeding. I do distinctly remember killing three Coyotes with this Rifle over the years.
Never a failure to extract or eject.
I have a Remington 700 Classic in 221 Remington Fireball as well and have NEVER had a failure to feed or extract with this little beauty!
Best of luck with your 17 MachIV!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy