Hello all,
I have just aquired a model 70 375h&h that was modified by Griffin and howe.
The serial # dates from 1949 , the researcher @g&h was kind enough to tell me that the gun was brought in by abercrombie and ficht, sold to Griffin and howe in 1950 and modified and sold by them on october15,1950. Stamped on top of the barrel is the script"rebuilt by Griffin&Howe inc, New York". It has a cloverleaf tang, normal safety, original front sight.

The modifications appear to be a complete griffin and howe stock, that is a fairly close duplicate of a supergrade stock with ebony forend tip, and the addition of a silver medallion for initials on the underside of the butt. and a leather covered recoil pad. Also added (in the original tapped holes) a fairly sturdy fixed express style sight in place of the original flipper type sight.

My question is- the gun is starting to look abit worse for the wear, the leather on the pad in particular is cracked and tearing so that only half the pad is now leather covered. I want to use the gun and infact intend to take it with me as my light rifle to zim. in may, should I send it back to G&H for a complete refinish? Pad only? No work at all?

Where would a gun like this fit into the value scheme of model 70's? is it more or less desirable with the modifications done by G&H?
Is it a shooter or a collector?
thanks
Dan

Personally, I would only fix the pad and only if it needed it to make it perfectly serviceable in the field.

I agree, I would replace the pad with a Kick-eze or similar type. Check the Bore with a bore-scope if you can. First I would shoot it and see what I have before I put a lot of $$$ into it.

The bore is fine and the gun shoots fine. The only problem is the cosmetics of having a ragged pad and a 60 yr old finish on the stock that would certainly look better if it was freshened. I am just wondering if that would kill value if this is a collector type piece, or has that already been nullified by the fact that G&H has modified the stock from the original?

My guess is the value increased with the work by G & H. If they will provide some documentation on their previous work then I think you have something. In that case I would have them re do it. Without documentation from them what you have is an altered Pre 64 M 70 with a G&H stamp on it. You might also try to get a letter from the Cody Museum showing it was sold to A & F. Just my .02 cents worth. I could be way off?

larry,
sounds like good advice to me. A G & H gun restored by same would indeed be a nice piece of history and valuable.

quote:

from the Cody Museum showing it was sold to A & F

cody doesnt do letters on win m70 bolt guns....

The historian at G&h has already said that they will do up a letter for me that includes all the pertinant details, date, buyers name,etc.... They make copies of their ledger book and take some pictures. It costs $50 so I guess that would be a worthwhile investment.

Thanks very much for your opinions guys. I had considered just going to someone local to redo the pad but maybe I'll just stick with G&H.

I'm going to take it to Zim this may and whack a buff and leopard(hopefully) with it. So any work will have to wait until after that anyways.
gives me some time to ruminate on what to do.

No question have G&H do the work.

IMO, that would do nothing negative to the value. A quality refinish may even enhance the value

A 1940's era custom pre 64 M70 .375 with a G&H and A&F pedigree is glimpse into a age long gone.

Adding a modern pad via the local parts switcher would be just plain wrong.

BTW

post pics of your rifle please.

The school of thought on firearms value is changing toward that of other antiques. Cleaning patina and other signs of age will definitely de-value a true collector's piece.

OTOH, a G&H Model 70 c. 1950 may be in-between collector's and collectable. If so, having G&H redo the pad should improve the value.

Maybe a call to Christi's auction house could provide some reasonable guidance.

I used to live 2 miles up the road from the G&H shop in New Jersey. Visited often to admire their used rifles, many of which they had smithed and stocked during the period they were in New York. For that reason, and strictly for my own use, I would value a pre-64 M70 that they had restocked much higher than a standard grade in the same chambering and original, but not NIB, condition. Looking at the G&H site today, they show 2 pre-64s for sale.

For $2,295 there is a 308 Featherweight with refinished stock and Leupold scope, mounts and rings that look like current production. Also, aftermarket sight in the barrel dovetail.

Their other pre-64 is labeled a Griffin & Howe-Model 70 and is in 35 Whelen for $4,650. It is earlier than the FWT but not early enough to have the cloverleaf tang. It has a nice stock,custom bottom metal, G&H sidemount, and what looks like a thin, hard rubber or plastic recoil pad. There is a ramp front sight, but no rear and no "goose egg" barrel boss, so I assume it was rebarreled by G&H. This is a long way of saying that G&H agree with me that their rifles should appraise higher than stock Winchesters.

So far as the leather butt pad cover is concerned, I would have it recovered. The rifle was made for hunting and my view is it should be maintained ready to hunt. I'm going to be getting one of my custom stocked rifles fitted with a leather covered pad and the advice I get is it takes a specialist to to a job that will still look good after a couple of years. Price seems to be about $350 for a new one from scratch.

I'm not technical enough to post pictures, but I could email them if someone would be so kind as to volunteer to do it for me?
thanks again