I have a WW1 .303 British Enfield model. The barrel on this rifle is horribly pitted and beyond salvage. Is there anything I can do to this weapon to make it useable again?
I'm talking new barrel, rechambering etc..

I would like it in either .303 or .308 winchester but the main thing is something that is serviceable. Has anyone ever done anything to salvage one of these old guns?

Please let me know if this has been done. I'm hoping to spend under 200$ to get this gun in shape to hunt with.

thanks

While there are new 311 barrels available I'm afraid you won't get one installed for 200 dollars or less. Your best bet is to simply pick up another Lee Enfield which you can do up here for around the 50.00 mark.
An alternative is to rebarrel to 30/40 krag using a used barrel or an inexpensive blank. This way you may be able to stay within your budget. Regards, Bill

They can steer you in the right direction for aftermarket sights, parts etc

Springfield Sporters
no website!
RD #1 Penn Run
Pennsylvania 15765
Phone - 412-254-2626
FAX - 412-254-9173
*******************
http://www.303british.com/

Thanks for the link. Hopefully I can get some ideas from their forum.
For curiosity sake what would a conversion to 30-40 krag entail?

Remember that the no.1 MK III action is not strong enough to take the pressure of a 308. Yes the indians mad some but these were of different steel and designed for the round. I would say that you couold rebarrel the action to a 30-30 or a 30-40 or similar low pressure rounds. If you deside that it is to much to mess with and want to give it away let me know.
Ray

Don't sweat it: brand new barrels are being sold now as surplus, very cheaply. First do try Springfield Sporters to buy one, and if that doesn't work out, try Numrich (Gun Parts Corporation). BUT, whatever you do, be SURE to tell the supplier exactly which rifle you have, right down to the last asterisk.

By the way: headspace on the SMLE rifles is adjusted by changing bolt heads, so don't sweat that either. Most important thing is, find a bonafide GUNSMITH who is set up to swap the barrels, so your rifle is not damaged by some jackleg. Let us know how all this works out....

Just curious, how does it shoot?
Some pitted barrels shoot just fine. Unless the pitting really bugs you, in that case, the cheapest suggestion is to trade it. You can find these rifles with mint bores if you look hard enough. The #4, and #5 actions are heavier, and stronger.
303british.com has some ideas for you.

The barrel has pits all up and down it and many are almost as deep as the lands themselves. I haven't tried shooting it but a long lost family member claimed it put the bullets through paper sideways. At least that's what he told his nephew that happens to be my grandfather before he gave him the rifle. I would guess it hasn't been shot in 20 years.

I know it will be more trouble and not as economical to fix this one as it would be to just find a new one. I would lose sleep if I allowed a free market rifle go waste. It also has a family history. Thanks for the information, I am checking all the options right now.

I it has historic family value I would try to get a gunsmith to make a barrel that matchs the millitary contour. I would have this barrel chambered for 30-30 so that there would be plenty of commercl ammo for hunting with. There are also some origional millitary barrels out there. I would contact springfield sporters. Any good gunsmith should be able to switch the barrels for you.
Ray

Just to make sure, you are talking about a Lee-Enfield correct and not an Enfield P14 in 303? Both were used in WW1 but the P14 is a tremendous action for large cartridges, unlike the Lee-Enfield.

I agree that right now it is almost cheaper to buy the whole rifle than just a barrel, not even including labor for installation.

Jeremy
As it happens, I have a WW1 rifle in the same condition. In my case, maybe yours, the condition is "cord bore" the result of cleaning with a cable pull through that wore the rifling terribly at the muzzle, along with the Corrosive primers of the era.
My rifle, my grandfathers rifle, also has family history, he refered to it as "Long Tom". I have been fighting within myself over keeping it original to the way he had it (he sporterized it), or rebarrelling it. I decided to keep it as a family piece, and get another Lee Enfield to shoot.
The struggle continues in my head, even though I now have several Enfields. They are addictive.
As to Amo, in Canada, any place that sells amo of any kind has 303 British. It's very popular here, and around the world. The WW1 action is NOT strong enough for the 308!
The 303 is probably a better killer anyway!
It's a perenial favorite for short range moose hunting here, and has taken most big game animals around the world.

[This message has been edited by John Y Cannuck (edited 01-25-2002).]

I agree with Paladin, You can get a new surplus barrel cheaply. Pay someone who knows what they are doing to swap the barrels, then its just a matter of installing the right bolt head for correct headspace. You should be able to do it all yourself, except actually unscrewing the old barrel and screwing the new one on. That's best done with special wrenches. Since no lathe is required, it shouldn't cost too much. .303 ammo is plentiful and cheap.

You can sporter it as much as you want, but if its an heirloom, I wouldn't mess with it. Here's a sporter I did, but I didn't rebarrel it.

http://www.hunting-pictures.com/members/beelzebubba/index.html

[This message has been edited by Beelzebubba (edited 01-25-2002).]

Paladin and B Bubba
The #1mk3 Headspace is not adjusted by changing boltheads, the #4 or #5 are.
Bbubba
Nice #4. Is that a jobber mount or homemade.
I use stainless angle iron and polish it.
Jeremy
A used #1 barrel is cheap.At the same time you have it changed consider the 303 Epps Option .
RR

What is a .303 epps?

The 303 Epps is essentially a 303 Improved. That is the original case is fired in the new chamber and "blown out" to it's new form with less body taper, a sharper shoulder and more capacity. It was developed by Elwood Epps. It is a great cartridge in a P14, not bad in a Number 4 and of no practical value in a Number1.
Changing the Lee Enfield to 30/40 Krag is a simple rebarreling operation. The cartridges are so similar that the 30/40 fits the Lee Enfield perfectly. I hunt with a #4 in 30/40. Regards, Bill

I have located a few surplus .303 barrels to consider. Do you have any idea where to look for .30 caliber barrels?

Also, I am not positive what model this is. Under the bolt handle (when closed) the markings are this:

(crown)
GR
B.S.A.C_o
1917
SHT. L.E
III*
Does this indicate a Mark 1, 1917 Lee Enfield?

It looks like I can get this done. If nothing else but having a different .303 barrel put on. It would be interesting to have a 30-40 Krag as well.

[This message has been edited by jeremy w (edited 01-26-2002).]

Bill
It all but eliminates case stretch an advantage on any Lee Enfield. Depending on bore size he might be able to use 308 bullets accurately anyways.Or is there some other benefit to the 3040 conversion.
Jeremy
It's a 1st world war #1 mark3 action made by BSA in 1917. I don,t have an enfield action wrench here or I would send you a barrel . I can get you one in 2 wks when Kerry Higgens gets back from the Show in Vegas. About $20 For a 311 Bore. Origional barrels vary in diameter from .308 to .317
RR

[This message has been edited by RR (edited 01-26-2002).]

That is an interesting point I hadn't thought of.
I found a barrel for about 45$. Fortunately I have acess to a decent 'smith that could put one on. What is the usual going rate for sticking a new barrel on one of these?

Thanks for all the information.

RR,
Unfortunately no case design can stop case stretching in a Lee Enfield. Only a set of locking lugs at the front of the bolt could do that.
I rebarreledto the 30/40 for a couple of reasons. First, I had a 30/40 reamer and at the time was building 30/40s of all types including a heavy varmint BR rifle based on a modified Ruger 77 action. Secondly, I had a whole bunch of 30 cal barrels and no 303s!
I have used various 30 cal bullets in Lee Enfields with success. I had one that would shoot under an inch with 125 Sierras. The same rifle would group 180 Sierra boat tails into a solid 18 inches though! Regards, Bill

Jeremy, gunsmiths charge what the traffic will bear. In this case, simple installation would range from $45 through $110, depending. And, the higher price does not necessarily mean greater value, although it might represent added time spent in assuring proper headspace, diddling with the sights, etc..

Since this rifle is an heirloom-level piece, you probably should go ahead, although the price for the barrel you located seems a little high according to the prices I've noticed recently. But, it may not be worth your time and effort to quibble, particularly if the sights are intact and functional, and the bore is nice. Having said that, I suggest you slug that bore and measure the approximate diameter of the slug, groove-to-groove. The further it gets from .311" the less desirable it is unless you wish to use oversize cast bullets mainly. This precaution is because it is hard to buy jacketed bullets in the U.S. which are between .312" and .323" or so. There aren't many to choose from.

Hope this helps,
Paladin

Bill
I have 4 improved cases on Enfield actions
6 mm 303 imp A little fatter than 6mm Epps
with a longer neck.
22-303imp 1.82 case length 1.5 to shoulder .446 shoulder dia.about 44gr water to top of neck
17 Ack Bee
these 3 I only neck size. So far I have loaded some cases 5to6 times for them and havn't had to trim.Mayby its the neck sizing
combined with the Imp.
303 Imp Bevan didn't have the Epps Reamer so I asked him to use the 6mm .
I havn't tried it yet so don't know about case life on it.
The most accurate bullets we shot in a #1 were 123gr .310 dia speer .83 for 5 @ 100yds.
like yours won't shoot for shit with heavy bullets.
Jeremy
The barrel I have for you is on a #1 mk3 1917 Bsa same as yours.All thats left is barrel and action.
Beelzebubba
Again beautiful rifle. tell us some more about it. How did you finish the bolt,what is the stock made of,what scope mount?

RR, Thanks for the compliment. The rifle took about a year of my spare time to complete. It was a Fazakerly made in 1942, which I purchased from AIM. I did all the work myself, except for actually dipping it in the bluing tank. The scope mount was a piece of angle iron, that I shaped on a mill-drill and hand polished. I got the idea from Steve Redgewell's .303 site someone linked above, but moved it forward for better eye relief and (IMO) better appearance. I also milled off the rear sight, then lowered and flattened the receiver bridge. I shortened the barrel to 20.5" and recrowned it to an 11 degree taper. The stock was a semi-inletted blank from Wenig. I glass bedded the front of the action, floating the barrel and installed a homemade aluminum pillar in the forearm (careful if you attempt this, its tricky to get it right on this rifle). The metal buttplate is a casting from "Treebone Carving." I hand polished all the metal surfaces including the bolt and cocking piece, then left the bolt "in the white" and put some polymer car wax on the bolt for some degree of protection. It consistently puts five rounds of PMC factory ammo into an inch at 50 yards, which is not bad for an enfield, but I kept the original barrel, which seemed to have a wide bore. I forget the measurements, but I'll look for the slug this afternoon.

Sorry about the bad info I posted about bolt heads. The great thing about the internet is the consensus of opinions keeps us honest. - John

RR,
Actually mine shot real well with all bullets except sierra biattails! 200gr Speer 308 bullets would shoot into 1.5 inches. One of the most impressive efforts was a 10 shot .9inch group shot with 147gr IVI miltary 7.62 bullets. These bullets measured .3065. The load was a mild one of 4895. Recovered bullets did not have grooves in them only five shiny marks where they had ridden on top of the lands.
You will get good case life out of a Lee Enfield as long as the pressures and therefor the bolt thrust are not too high. Hot loads though and seperated cases are the rule. Fullbore shooterswith #4s in 7.62 discovered this when they started reloading. These things eat brass for breakfast!
I can load my #4 in 30/40 to 2600 with 180s but will get only about 3 reloads before the brass is junk. Back off 100 fps and brass life is doubled or better.
The same thing is true of any of the rear locking actions. The Colt Sauer, Steyr Mannlicher, Golden Eagle (AKA Guilded Turkey), and even the massive Schulz and Larsen actions exhibit this case stretching ability to varying degrees. Regards, Bill

I re-measured the "slug" from my sporter. It is .304" across the lands and .322" across the grooves. I'm not sure what to make of it, but at least the grooves take up a lot less surface area than the lands on a 2-groove barrel. I imagine they get filled up pretty well by the lead/copper displaced by the lands. For what its worth, The "slug" was a cerrosafe casting made from the original muzzle that I had cut off. Any opinions on these measurements are appreciated. - John