The Accurate Reloading Forums
katiesguns
03 August 2010, 04:43
katiesgunskatiesguns
I need help with Blackburn bottom metal. I have been trying to communicate with Maggie about products paid for and not delivered. I have sent numerous e-mails with no response. I have had a very good relationship with Ted for 20 years and now nothing. Who can provide a phone # and advice on handling this situation. I advised Maggie last week that if I did not hear from her I was going to ar and report to paypal that she received payment. Did no good. Still no communication.
Darrell Ragar
417 353 0747
03 August 2010, 08:53
22WRFIt has been my experience that your continued patience, while frustrating, will be rewarded. They might be having trouble getting tooling, or they might be having trouble getting steel. Or they might be having trouble with their CNC machines.
Wait a few more weeks and see what happens. If you don't hear from them by then send me a PM and I will make a phone inquiry for you.
Are you still making Scope Rings??? Making anything else?
03 August 2010, 10:20
dempseyIt will never cease to amaze me how little some business people totally neglect and fail to understand the importance of communication.
______________________
Always remember you're
unique, just like everyone else.
03 August 2010, 16:17
Mark RI have to agree with dempsey here.... Waited too damn long and couldn't get info for around 2 long years. Maggie is most probably real nice....just no info and sad promises don't cut it.
Cheers'
Mark.
03 August 2010, 16:38
DannyHquote:
It will never cease to amaze me how little some business people totally neglect and fail to understand the importance of communication
You got that right sir!I can just imagine what would have happened to my business had I neglected to return customer calls
03 August 2010, 17:10
jsl3170you'd be out of business, danny boy!
03 August 2010, 20:38
Mike_Dettorrequote:
They might be having trouble getting tooling, or they might be having trouble getting steel. Or they might be having trouble with their CNC machines.
Yes, they might...and last time I checked the above had nothing to do with their phones, their email, their PCs, their internet connection, the US mail, carrier pigeons or smoke signals.
MikeLegistine actu quod scripsi?
Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.
What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
03 August 2010, 21:02
congomikeWhen it comes time to promote their products it seems that Maggie always has time to post on this forum, but apparently no time to deal with a paying customer.
04 August 2010, 02:28
Howardquote:
Originally posted by 22WRF:
Well, I guess that is why it is such a good thing to have competition. If you don't like the way Ted and Maggie operate, then order one from Duane.
Except in this case they have already taken the customer's money.
Howard
Moses Lake, Washington USA
hwhomes@outlook.com
04 August 2010, 02:35
22WRFYeah Howard, that is a problem. But I have purchased many items from Blackburns, and some of them came months after they were supposed to come. Hence the reason why I stated above that while difficult, patience would probably be a good thing here.
04 August 2010, 02:51
butchlambertKevin, some of us are getting long in the tooth.
Butch
04 August 2010, 03:03
Boss Hossquote:
Originally posted by 22WRF:
Butch
I understand that. Believe me I do. But let me ask you this. When your friends are being attacked do you just sit there on your ass and say nothing.
I just talked to Maggie. She says Darrell got his stuff.
Why is it that I NEVER EVER have trouble getting ahold of Maggie but others do. I sometimes think that its because people enjoy coming on here with bullshit.
I could tell you stories that involve people you would not believe. Will discuss them with you under Attorney Client Privilege only. The stories are not BS.
04 August 2010, 03:05
22WRFAnd I could make a list of a whole bunch of folks who have f___ed Ted and Maggie by not paying them. But you don't see Maggie coming on here and saying anything, in spite of the fact that there are a few deadbeats who post here on AR regularly.
04 August 2010, 03:14
MKane160quote:
Originally posted by 22WRF:
And I could make a list of a whole bunch of folks who have f___ed Ted and Maggie by not paying them. But you don't see Maggie coming on here and saying anything, in spite of the fact that there are a few deadbeats who post here on AR regularly.
So, Counselor, you have first hand knowledge of people who have shafted the Blackburns, or is this just heresay?
MKane160
You can always make more money, you can never make more time...........LLYWD. Have you signed your donor card yet?
04 August 2010, 03:26
22WRFSome first hand knowledge talking to a few deadbeats on the phone. Some paperwork. Some investigation through the post office. Some pms here on AR.
04 August 2010, 04:45
katiesgunsI did not intend to start a pissing match. 22WRF I suspect you are the author of e-mail that Maggie forwarded to me. If she hasn't send you my reply--kiss my old tired butt. All I want is what I paid for. You have always been a champion for her and Ted as well as I have. I told her in an e-mail that if she didn't communicate with me that I was going on AR, Fair warned is fair warned. I for one owe no one in this world one red cent and you can feal free to run my credit report.
04 August 2010, 05:30
butchlambertkatiesguns,
You are right. I always paid them up front. Yes I will back my friends all the way until they are not doing what they say time after time. This has been discussed many times. People have hard times, it is about truthful communication and followup. You know the vast majority of the fellows on this forum would back anybody if they had communication that was the way that it really was. It kinda reminds me of Williams never introduced receivers, Hein, MRC, and others. Where are they now?
Butch
04 August 2010, 05:40
dempseyquote:
When your friends are being attacked do you just sit there on your ass and say nothing, or do you jump to their aid?
Depends if they're wrong. I expect more from friends/family than I do the average Joe not less..........
______________________
Always remember you're
unique, just like everyone else.
04 August 2010, 07:26
Boss Hossquote:
Originally posted by 22WRF:
quote:
Originally posted by butchlambert:
katiesguns,
You are right. I always paid them up front. Yes I will back my friends all the way until they are not doing what they say time after time. This has been discussed many times. People have hard times, it is about truthful communication and followup. You know the vast majority of the fellows on this forum would back anybody if they had communication that was the way that it really was. It kinda reminds me of Williams never introduced receivers, Hein, MRC, and others. Where are they now?
Butch
Like I said, I never have trouble communicating with them. Never. So I have trouble believing anyone who says they do.
Katiesguns.
If you want your butt kissed, have Butch do it.
22WRF---got your PM but I will go ahead and post it here because one of the pieces in question was going to be used on one of my rifles. Will tell you the entire story face to face at the Show next year.
My builders are known here and Butch knows who I am as well as a few others but the Smith in question paid in advance for several pieces of bottom metal. Bottom line calls not returned, phone was even disconnected for a while, well over a year wait but ultimately the parts did ship but it suffices to say that fewer and fewer people are willing to business with Ted. I know I won’t.
04 August 2010, 07:43
butchlambertKevin,
So if I agree with some one that says something that you don't like, I'm kissing their ass. I really think that you have not a clue what kind of ass that you are making out of yourself.
Nobody has complained about their products, just their business practices and refusal to be available for contact, or giving truthful statements for delivery. Have your clerk research all the Blackburn post for the last 3 yrs or so. Tell us what they say.
Butch
04 August 2010, 08:13
lovebugI have talked to Kevin and Darrell, I was gone for a while and they know why. I did not have my computer and I do not have blackberry. I may not handily all of my business affairs in the best way possible. But I am an honest person that stands but her word. I cannot say that I do not owe people money, but there are a lot of people out there that owe me money. I have not been at the shop as much as I should; I have gone back to school. But my customers can get a hold of me 24/7 at 801-691-8152.
Maggie Baum
CNC Specialty Products
P.O. Box 369 / 50 East 100 North
Levan, UT 84639
Phone: 801-691-8152
Email: maggie@cncspecialtyproducts.com
http://cncspecialtyproducts.com/ 04 August 2010, 17:26
katiesgunsMaggie and 22WRF
Lets get our facts straight--if you can't be reached by e-mail--don't list it. And I absolutly have not received by products as you have stated. I said no delivery and that is the truth. Kevin if you are so dman holy, send me some of yours and let Maggie replace it. And by the way it has been months. I was sent a message that I could get delivery if I paid by paypal. I did and no delivery.
04 August 2010, 18:39
Jim Kobequote:
Originally posted by 22WRF:
I have a 17 and an 18 here. If you need either, let me know and they will be on their way.
that is how confident I am of the Blackburns.
Moreover, I have never had trouble getting ahold of Maggie by email or phone. Never.
"Why is everybody always picking on me"
Jim Kobe
10841 Oxborough Ave So
Bloomington MN 55437
952.884.6031
Former Professional member American Custom Gunmakers Guild
04 August 2010, 19:30
katiesguns22WRF---EVERYONE KNOWS HOW SPECIAL YOU ARE. YOU NEED TO CHECK YOUR FACTS ABOUT MY DELIVERY.
04 August 2010, 21:10
katiesgunsyOU ARE CORRECT---NOT HOW SPECIAL YOU ARE BUT HOW SPECIAL YOU THINK YOU ARE
04 August 2010, 21:51
22WRFquote:
Originally posted by katiesguns:
yOU ARE CORRECT---NOT HOW SPECIAL YOU ARE BUT HOW SPECIAL YOU THINK YOU ARE
I don't think I am "special". Rather, I know I am a friend.
04 August 2010, 22:09
Jim Kobequote:
Originally posted by 22WRF:
quote:
Originally posted by katiesguns:
yOU ARE CORRECT---NOT HOW SPECIAL YOU ARE BUT HOW SPECIAL YOU THINK YOU ARE
I don't think I am "special". Rather, I know I am a friend.
And I repeat, "why is everyone always picking on me?"
Jim Kobe
10841 Oxborough Ave So
Bloomington MN 55437
952.884.6031
Former Professional member American Custom Gunmakers Guild
04 August 2010, 22:14
Boss Hossquote:
Originally posted by 22WRF:
quote:
Originally posted by katiesguns:
yOU ARE CORRECT---NOT HOW SPECIAL YOU ARE BUT HOW SPECIAL YOU THINK YOU ARE
I don't think I am "special". Rather, I know I am a friend.
04 August 2010, 22:15
Dago RedNot to take sides one way or another, I just want to call BS on a couple of things that got said on here.
1. It's bullshit to tell people to just keep waiting for things that have been promised. This is something that amazes me about the gunsmithing community and their clients. I don't think there is any other industry where the constant missing of deadlines would be accepted. Sure, we all deal with it, BUT IT DOESN'T MAKE IT RIGHT and it's an asshole thing to tell people that have paid money that they should just keep waiting, and waiting, and....!!!
2. It's also bullshit to say that because one person always gets in touch with people everybody else can just as easily. email is a no brainer, you can see who sent it and decide whether to respond. And I think pretty much every phone now has caller id, or the option of it. I have specific people who's numbers I've programmed in my phone just so I know it's them calling and can decide whether to answer it. 90% of the time I look at the name/number BEFORE picking it up.
Red
04 August 2010, 22:22
22WRFmy, my, my.
Boss
1. When one considers himself/herself to be a friend to someone, that means that person is making the decision to be a friend. Therefore, in order for your statement (BS) to be correct, you would have to prove that I do not consider myself to be a friend to Ted and Maggie. You would have to prove my subjective intent (or lack thereof). You cannot do it. Therefore, your statement is:
Red
Your points are well taken and I respect your opinions. They are well reasoned and the way you wrote them signifies an interest in the subject rather than an attack on the person of someone making an opinion.
Nevertheless, none of this discourse is going to solve the alleged problem that this thread was started for. I know what will.
Bye.
04 August 2010, 22:28
Boss Hossquote:
Originally posted by 22WRF:
my, my, my.
Boss
1. When one considers himself/herself to be a friend to someone, that means that person is making the decision to be a friend. Therefore, in order for your statement (BS) to be correct, you would have to prove that I do not consider myself to be a friend to Ted and Maggie. You would have to prove my subjective intent (or lack thereof). You cannot do it. Therefore, your statement is:
Red
Your points are well taken and I respect your opinions. They are well reasoned and the way you wrote them signifies an interest in the subject rather than an attack on the person of someone making an opinion.
Good day!
Most likely an uninformed, unintentional lackey who is in the weeds about what has been going on for several years.
Have A Nice Day!
04 August 2010, 22:31
22WRFBoss
Sorry, it is you who is the uninformed, unintentional lackey who is in the weeds about what has been going on for several years now. You and quite a few others around here.
LOL.
You have a nice day as well.
04 August 2010, 22:57
J.D.Steelequote:
Originally posted by 22WRF:
Boss
You and quite a few others around here.
I think I SEE why everybody's always picking on him!
Around here we refer to those folks as being 'special' - as in 'Special Olympics'.
Regards, Joe
__________________________
You can lead a human to logic but you can't make him think.
NRA Life since 1976. God bless America!
04 August 2010, 22:59
jimmyd264This is sorta like buying a 2009 Duramax in 2009 and getting it in 2011 if at all.
If you can't produce the product and ship it in a timely manner, well maybe you should get out of the business,just an idea!!!!!
04 August 2010, 23:16
jeffeossoJimmy,
its a starcrossed day, as I totally agree with you
04 August 2010, 23:36
dempseyquote:
Not to take sides one way or another, I just want to call BS on a couple of things that got said on here.
1. It's bullshit to tell people to just keep waiting for things that have been promised. This is something that amazes me about the gunsmithing community and their clients. I don't think there is any other industry where the constant missing of deadlines would be accepted. Sure, we all deal with it, BUT IT DOESN'T MAKE IT RIGHT and it's an asshole thing to tell people that have paid money that they should just keep waiting, and waiting, and....!!!
2. It's also bullshit to say that because one person always gets in touch with people everybody else can just as easily. email is a no brainer, you can see who sent it and decide whether to respond. And I think pretty much every phone now has caller id, or the option of it. I have specific people who's numbers I've programmed in my phone just so I know it's them calling and can decide whether to answer it. 90% of the time I look at the name/number BEFORE picking it up.
Red
+1
22wrf, you're in a hole, quit digging. You're making a fool of yourself.
______________________
Always remember you're
unique, just like everyone else.
05 August 2010, 01:15
Howardquote:
Originally posted by jimmyd264:
This is sorta like buying a 2009 Duramax in 2009 and getting it in 2011 if at all.
If you can't produce the product and ship it in a timely manner, well maybe you should get out of the business,just an idea!!!!!
of course the sales tax is due now!
Howard
Moses Lake, Washington USA
hwhomes@outlook.com
05 August 2010, 02:10
ramrod340quote:
22wrf, you're in a hole, quit digging
Will never happen
As usual just my $.02
Paul K
05 August 2010, 02:57
22WRFquote:
Will never happen
Thats right. Because I am not the one in the hole.
I agree that it is poor business to book prepaid orders and then take an inordinate amount of time to fill those orders. I get that. I was a CPA before an attorney. I understand business. But one doesn't have to have any education at all to understand that.
Nevertheless, this isn't about me.
Its about CNC Machine Specialties and Katiesguns.
Having known Ted for a long time, and Maggie a bit less, and having actually visited with them at two of their shops on many occasions, I know
1. some of the business issues they face
2. some of their financial constraints
3. the overall business climate
4. that Ted is approaching 82 years of age
5. they are facing increasing competition
6. They are honest people.
Ted isn't going to change the way he does business at age 82 because he cannot physically do so. He, and only he, runs his machines. I do business with them because in spite of their less than stellar business practices I like their product. If I have to wait, I wait.
You guys can strut around here trying to convince everyone you have a big dick by hurling personal insults and and other mindless words at me, but the reality is that I offered to help, and in fact did help by making a call to inquire. I got a response, and I got it quickly.
Just as with Roland and Cane Rat, whom I helped, this issue can be laid to rest as well, with a little investigation, a little time, and a little discourse.
In the end, if Katiesguns paid for stuff and didn't get it, I am willing to assist until he gets his stuff or gets his money back. Anybody else? If not, then shut the f_ck up, or else look in the mirror to see who is making a fool of theirself.
05 August 2010, 04:52
ForrestBThe only thing worse than a liar is a liar that's also a hypocrite!
Tennessee Williams
quote:
Originally posted by 22WRF:
This post is distasteful for me to write. I do it not so much for myself, but for others who should know about dishonesty here on AR.
This will not apply to most of you, because most of you are smart enough to get paid for an item before you send it. Call me stupid if you want to. Many have before, and many will again.
But for those who are somewhat like me in that they like to trust a person until the person gives them some reason not to trust them,
BE AWARE OF Bill Ujhazy, AKA IRON BUCK.
On March 26th he contacted me via pm and advised me that he wished to purchase an item from me, and could I wait a week or two for payment. Since he had posted on here and had shown photos of his custom rifles, I felt he was trustworthy and shipped the part. He acknowledged receipt on April 4th, indicating payment was forthcoming in a week or so.
Then he advised me he had lost his checkbook, and then advised me he had to pay taxes. That was in the middle of April, and I thought that was a legitimate excuse.
However, since the 19th of May he has not contacted me. Two PMs and numerous phone messages have gone unanswered.
For your financial safety, do not send him anything unless you get paid for it first. Do not buy anything from him unless he sends it first.
http://forums.accuratereloadin...351034531#2351034531
______________________________
"Truth is the daughter of time."
Francis Bacon