I have one of the M96 conversions that Kimber was selling some years back, it's in the original 6.5x55 chambering, aleways shot with factory ammo.

I used this gun several times without a problem, 4 years ago lent it to a friend, he put several boxes through it, no problems.

I went to sight in today and the first round, didn't discharge. Waited a minute and removed it, shallow firing pin (FP) depresion. The next round did discharge, the third didn't, the fourth didn't. All rounds showed too shallow a FP depression.

What should I be looking for? Is there a way to dry-fire the gun and then remove the bolt without recocking so I can measure the FP protrusion or see if the tip has broken?

If this is the case can I simply remove a firing pin from one of my other M96's and swap it out?


Thanks, Rob

it's possible you have a broken firing pin.

among a dozen other things....

Ignoring ammo & headspace problems, there are two things to check before you replace the firing pin spring;

First remove the bolt. Assuming it is still cock on close & therefore in fired position, measure the firing pin protrusion from the face of the bolt. It should be anywhere from .050" to 0.065" for reliable ignition.

Second, dis-assemble & clean the firing pin shaft, spring, bolt sleeve, and cocking piece real well. Then get a 38 bore brush & clean inside bolt very well. Re-assemble without a spring and check for firing pin or safety ledge binding before putting it back together.

If it still misfires, then you'll need to replace the spring. That's a pretty good service life for a 110 year old spring!

Hope this helps,
Hotshot

The spring was replaced with a Wolf spring when I got it so I doubt it's that, I did have two rounds go off. I can't check the protrusion bec because even with the origianl cock on close, the pin recocks as soon as the handle is lifted.

Rob

Perfect, Wolff makes great Mauser replacement springs.

OK, then "fire" the pin by catching the sear ledge on a counter top in the shop (not the wife's good table), pull back, and simultaneously spin the bolt sleeve CW facing the butt end of the bolt. There's no bolt sleeve catch pin to depress like on the later 98s.

Recock it the opposite way before you re-install it.

I should keep better track of the books and tools I buy. Turns out I have Jerry Kuhnhausens Mauser Book and a bolt disassembly tool.

Kuhnhausen states that bolt protrusion should be anywhere from .055 - .065". The one in question measures .045. I pulled out two other high condition M96's I have and the both measured .045-.050. This is with the cocking piece pushed forward.

I took the firing pin assembly apart, cleaned it inside and out, pin head looks fine, not chips or cracks, put it togetehr, same measurement.

Tomorow I go back to the range with a milsurp and some different ammo.

Story at 11.

RecoilRob, I sent you a PM.

A classic problem on the m-96 is that people take the bolt apart and when thy put the fiereing pin and shroud back in the bolt body they stop a turn short. It looks like the shroud is snug against the body but there is still a full turn to go

Check if the shroud will go in another turn!

Stefan

even before you go all the new spring work, Just try cleaning out the bolt. I've seen several things like this where it was just a collection of crude in the bolt that gummed up the works

Went back to the range today, put the cartridges that didn't fire in the first gun into a second gun ad they fired so it's not the ammo.

Then I pulled apart both bolts and switched pins. The pins weren't identical, the second one from the gun that fires has a thicker collar. Same results, gun No.1 wouldn't fire, in fact it left a shallower indent. Also, both pins protrude much more when dropped into the sleeve w/o the spring.

So the problem is not ammo or the pin but something else. Seems to me that only leaves the shroud, sleeve or the headspace. I have two empty's that the gun did manage to fire. What are the signs of excessive headspace on a fired cartridge?


Thanks, Rob

Difficult to judge without a cartridge gauge (Wilson). If you have micrometer eyeballs or the headspace is rediculously excessive, you can set an unfired case next to a fired one and look to see if there are any obvious differences in the location of the shoulder. You can take a piece of rigid wire (coat hanger) and make a 90 Deg. bend in one end about an 1/8" to 3/16" long and grind a sharp point on it. Insert it into the case bottom and slowly, without a lot of pressure, drag the sharp point up trying to feel a groove on the interior, usually about 1/4" or more up from the base. If there is one, you're getting a lot of case stretching, which is indicative of excessive headspace. Of course, an incipient head separation, indicated by a split in the case just up from the solid head is also a good indication of excessive headspace. If these are handloads, make sure your sizing die is not pushing the shoulder back from SAAMI specs. Again, a Wilson Caselength/Headspace gauge will be a big help.

Rob,
This is a simple fix, but finding the faulty piece is not.

Are those the original parts, thus serialized to the bolt with the last two or three digits?

If you want to fire factory loads reliably, you should get another cocking piece (CP) & firing pin (FP), then fit them to this bolt for 0.060" protrusion.

You may have to slighlty mill the spare CP face off to get 0.060" protrusion, as I remember that is the FP stop.

Last resort...check to CP cam nose when in the "fired" position, it should clear the bolt cam notch by 0.005", not hit it, as the CP face is designed to be the FP stop, not the CP cam nose.

Even if the headspace is too long, you can reload the fired cartriges for just that rifle too.

Hotshot

Hotshot
All the number match, bolt, pin, shroud, and , I assume, the CP rhough Kimber cut this down to install the swing safety.
I appreciate the above suggestion but I may be out of my league here in trying to see how this all works together.

The pin, when dropped into the sleeve by itself protrudes about .120" so it's obvious that the pin is OK. I have examined the CP face and cleaned it. There is sufficient clearance at the notch, the CP face is the pin's stop. If the face has to be milled is there a reason I can't just mill the existing one to allow the pin to protrude further.

Also I have noticed that on this bolt, when screwing the shroud on, it will go past the CP sear engagement/sleeve half notch, others stop at the notch.

Lastly, any reason why this would happen to a rifle that was shooting fine last time out?

Rob,
You'll always have plenty of tip protrusion from the bolt face w/o the sleeve & CP installed on the FP. You can't really tell if parts are going to work until "mock" assembled without the spring...

I've never seen a Kimber conversion of the M96 cocking piece, but I agree that's where the extra pin protrusion length needs to come from (be taken from the CP face). I usuallly swap the CP out with a shorter one, or measure a dozen or so FPs until I get the longest one.

Just remember to recheck the cam nose, as it may hit & need clearanced after the CP is cut back.

Speedlocking P-14/17 Enfields and Model 30's with Traister or Numrich CPs will also always require a little face removal to get the pin back to 0.065".

Not sure why this problem didn't crop up before.