hi
i wonder if a muzzle brake will bring my brno 602 in 375H&H to the 3006 level with 300 grain loads? i am getting old and like it with less recoil.
regards
YES

From what I understand the Vais system (and others) ought to do it, as long as you can put up with the muzzle blast and noise.

thanks for reply
I am partially deaf ( i hear what I want to hear and don't hear the rest) then the noise woulden't be a problem, but i get horrible headache from heavy loads.. have you any picture or more info about the brake that you mentioned?,
regards
YES

I've had good luck with the Shrewd sold by Brownells. They come in four sizes and in either chrome-moly steel (you blue it) or stainless. I have a 300WSM with the Shrewd on it. With it on, the gun kicks like a .243 Winchester. I can shoot it all day. With it off, the gun will jump up off the front bag about four inches and kick my shoulder like no tomorrow. My gun weighs 18 pounds, so I know the brake is doing its job. I like the Shrewd because it can be machined to exactly match the taper of your barrel. It doesn't look like an added-on afterthought when it's contoured-in and either bead-blasted or blued to match the finish of your barrel. The machining and finish on them is quite nice. Cheap, too, at about sixty bucks...

Search "shrewd muzzle brake brownells" and you should find it. I found it to be the first reference in the listings. I clicked on it and it went right to that page in the Brownells catalog. You'll love it...

My son got a model 70 in 375 Mag. He is a big guy but he found the recoil to be unaceptable! He had a brake installed(can't recall the make) and we drilled a hole into the stock and installed an inertia recoil reducer. I have fired that rifle while laying on my back in the bottom of an 8 foot Zodiac boat. Very mild recoil,certainly no worse than my 30-06. We load it with 300 grain Noslers.

There are at least 7 of my rifles that have Home Brewed Muzzle Breaks on them. All do a good job.

The one on the .358 X .404 IMP is a little more intricate than the rest and reduces the recoil to that of an 06 or less. The muzzle velocity of the 250gr. bullet is OVER 3100 fps.w/ between 92gr and 98gr.of powder depending on which powder is used.

You're not going to make any friends at a crowded range. roger

Yes, a 375 ends up about like a 30/06. It really tames them down. I breaked a 416 Rem a while back for a customer and and it ended up about like a 300 Win mag. A huge difference.

I install a lot of the Shrewd brakes and only one has come back to the shop...due to excess noise, that I clearly warned them of. I recommend that people who have muzzle brakes wear ear protection, not just at the range but in the field too.

To me, this is an iteresting thread. You see, I'm just not a fan of muzzle brakes...I THINK the magna port system seems to reduce muzzle climb. that may be reason enough!

While I worked a Gander Mountain, we installed at least ten a day and I've shot hundreds with and without...a 460 comes to mind that I think saved damage to the social finger when installed..but the point of impact also changed a whopping 8" at 50 yards...no...the bullet was not hitting the brake...I saw this same thing happen,,,mostly to a lesser extent on other smaller calibers...but the tendency seemed to remain.

Pesonally I would rather take the recoil than the ear splitting noise and blast..but does anyone have scientific and I stress SCIENTIFIC tables of recoil reduction??

quote:

Originally posted by Toomany Tools:
I recommend that people who have muzzle brakes wear ear protection, not just at the range but in the field too.

Everybody ought to do that anyway. Once you're ears are screwed up, its real hard to get them fixed!

I have installed quite a few muzzle brakes in my shop over the years. Each year I see an increase in requests for brakes in direct correlation to people buying bigger and bigger magnum rifles. The beginning of this trend seems to have started about the time the 7MM STW was introduced. I had a lot of requests to rechamber 7 MM Rem Mags to that cartridge, then they would return a short time later requesting a muzzle brake.

When I first started installing muzzle brakes probably about 1992 there was not a lot of commercialy made brakes to choose from. I used a number of KDF brakes. They recomended very little bullet clearance from .016 to .012 in some cases. They did a very good job of reducing recoil but the muzzle blast was horrendous. Probably due to the ports exiting at 90 degrees and close tolerance on bullet clearance. Most brakes now have the ports angled forward 7 degrees which comprimises the efficiency of the brake some in order to push some of the noise and concussion forward of the shooter. It does help. The Vais brake uses a differant method to decrease noise and blast and they are the quitest brake that I have test fired.

I agree with homebrewer that the Shrewd is a very good brake. Inexpensive, works very well, not as loud as some, good machine work and sizes available that allow you to blend the brake to the same contour as the barrel, after bluing or bead blasting the seam disappears and looks like it is an integral part of the barrel. My customers really like that.

For the last couple of years I have been installing about 80% Shrewd and 20% Vais.

I only have one personal rifle that I fitted with a muzzle brake. A Rem 700 Mountain Rifle in .280 Rem. I fitted a Banser lite weight stock. Total weight around 6 1/2 pounds. The rifle would torque severly to the right trying to twist out of left hand. I own several big bores that I can manage just fine but this little rascall was a hand full. I fitted a Shrewd brake, blended it with the barrel contour and re bead blasted the barrel. Accuracy remained the same, sub moa and the point of impact remained constant. Other than this one rifle I do not like a brake on my personal guns.

My son had me fit a brake on his AR-15 heavy barrel rifle. Now he can see the bullet strike when shooting prarie dogs.

Thank you for the referral, Craftsman. You speak the truth: The seam between the brake and the barrel "disappears" from sight when the eye is just inches from the barrel. Even up close (very close), most inexperienced shooters will never see it. I sent my brake to Krieger to have it put on the barrel they were making for me. I sent a drawing, showing exactly how I wanted it done. I wanted the brake left a cylinder, to match the diameter of the barrel at the muzzle. I figured trying to blend the countour to the brake would be too much of a problem. When I got the barrel I saw that there was indeed a brake on it, but that the brake was not cylindrical. It was tapered. There was no visible seam at all. I thought they had essentially "magna-ported" the barrel and thrown my Shrewd into the trash. I called them and asked "Dude, where's my muzzle brake?" I felt like a fool when they said I should grab the brake portion of the barrel and twist it. Krieger does very good work...

quote:

Originally https://forums.accuratereloading.com/groupee_common/plat...ages/blank.gifposted by craigster:
From what I understand the Vais system (and others) ought to do it, as long as you can put up with the muzzle blast and noise.

Before you refer some one for Vais mazzlebrake take a look this site. www.vaismuzzlebrakes.com

It will be a good idea to read this site.www.vaismuzzlebrakes.com

quote:

Originally posted by craigster:

quote:

Originally posted by yes:
thanks for reply
I am partially deaf ( i hear what I want to hear and don't hear the rest) then the noise woulden't be a problem, but i get horrible headache from heavy loads.. have you any picture or more info about the brake that you mentioned?,
regards
YES

http://www.muzzlebrakes.com/

quote:

Originally posted by Tex21:

quote:

Originally posted by Toomany Tools:
I recommend that people who have muzzle brakes wear ear protection, not just at the range but in the field too.

Everybody ought to do that anyway. Once you're ears are screwed up, its real hard to get them fixed!

Absolutely correct. Anything including a .22 Hornet upwards will permanently damage your hearing if used without ear protection. You don't have to be in serious pain territory for it to be happening.
Believe me, I fit enough hearing aids to guys who've wrecked their hearing from unprotected shooting.

Chris, NZ

quote:

Originally posted by real Vais:

quote:

Originally https://forums.accuratereloading.com/groupee_common/plat...ages/blank.gifposted by craigster:
From what I understand the Vais system (and others) ought to do it, as long as you can put up with the muzzle blast and noise.

Before you refer some one for Vais mazzlebrake take a look this site. www.vaismuzzlebrakes.com

I take it you must be George. I heard that you were no longer in the muzzlebreak business and that you had returned to Greece. I was not aware of situation that arose between you and Bartlett. Thank you for the information.

Some time back we discussed fitting muzzle brakes so they blended in pleasingly with the existing barrel contour.

I installed this one last week on a Remington Sendero 300 Rem Ultra Mag. I always test fire a factory round and mark the case with job ticket and rifle data. This one felt about like a light 25-06.

They certainly work..blast is a little more but all big bore rifles are loud and will damage hearing, but I shot rifles for years without brakes and they damaged my hearing also..Loud noises hurt the ears...

The best way to use a brake is at the range, sighting in, testing loads, etc. and my guns all shoot to the same POI with or without the brake on as opposed to common belief around here?????????

Take it off to hunt with if you wish..or be sure and tell folks around you that your shooting a braked rifle..

Hearing protection is always a good idea except when hunting IMO.

I believe the first muzzle brake I ever built and installed was on a 6.5x54 FN Mauser based sporter I built in 1954. It was basically just an experiment with muzzle jump and was absolutely perfect in that respect. I have had and installed numerous ones since then mostly on big bores with what I would call differing success. I do know I have had several MagNaPorted and I can say conclusively (but not scientifically) they reduce muzzle jump and don't SEEM to be as hard on the ears. My sons 44Mag S&W 3" is MagNaPorted and except for the erosion of the front sight insert it performs as it should. It had the barrel shortened and was roundbutted for a DEA agent and he wanted it for quick recovery on a second shot. It did that but will blow your hat off if you are wearing one. The last MagNaPort I had was on a Ruger RSM in 416Rigby. I shot it along side my CZ550 416Rigby with the same ammo and the Ruger was definitely less punishing to shoot. I regularly use mercury reducers and feel they work as advertised.

A good supressor can accomplish similar results; aren't they legal in Sweden?

Craftsman, you indeed a craftsman! Beauty

quote:

A good supressor can accomplish similar results;

Just how 'quiet' can a suppressor make a full bore rifle? I have seen figures for the recoil reduction and for noise reduction which is significant but still high. I have a reflex suppressor on my hornet (it has only three baffles and protrudes by 50mm) and it reduces the noise to that of a 17 HMR. I still wear ear plugs with it. It reduces muzzle lift significantly - crazy to think of muzzle lift with a hornet but it used to move enough to lose the sight picture for observing hits. Now it doesn't. (It is an experimental one with replacable baffles).

I am planning something similar for my 303 for the same reason - muzzle lift and noise. Not to mention eyebrow knocks when shooting from a rest or prone. For the 50mm overhang, I will just have to live with the limited effectiveness I will get. But if I can quieten it enough to just use earplugs, it will be good. And save my eyebrow.

There are two things that supressors provide and there seems to some competition amonmg which is best. A supressor can be built for the maximum decibel reduction or the maximum attenuation of specific frequencies. Either way the redirection of gases should reduce recoil.

Focusing on attenuation of specific frequencies can provide greater hearing protecion if it is done right. Either can reduce recoil depending on the volume of gas that is redirected.

But your question is a good one. It seems that the larger the bore less effective the supression in either case.

I had a custom designed brake installed on my .30-338WM and it will clear my sinuses and blow my hat off too. A freind has a Vais brake that is much better. The problem is my muzzle is cut to 1/2-32 and the vais doesn't come with those threads.

quote:

Originally posted by yes:
thanks for reply
I am partially deaf ( i hear what I want to hear and don't hear the rest) then the noise woulden't be a problem, but i get horrible headache from heavy loads.. have you any picture or more info about the brake that you mentioned?,
regards
YES

YES - I'll not comment on muzzle brakes so far as their claimed and actual accomplishments are concerned.

The comments I would make to you are these:

1. If you get horrible headaches from shooting any of your rifles, you need to have a talk with your physician about them. Hopefully he will explain to you why they are occuring and what the down side of repeating that experience is in the long run.

2. If you are middle-aged or older, you need to start being conscious of the increased tendency for retinas to tear as humans age. Heavy recoil can definitely vcontribute to the likelihood of that happening.

3. Depending on what your personal "take" is on the above two subjects, you MIGHT want to give a serious priority to finding and using ways to experience less recoil. Muzzle-brakes, rifles of heavier weight, advanced recoil pad technology or less powerful calibers are all options which can help. Sometimes all may be called for.

Best wishes,

AC