Hello All,
The Savage 99 I just inherited has at least 40 years of copper fouling in the bore that is proving difficult to remove. I have Hoppes #9 and Sweets 7.62 Solvent on hand. I have treated the barrel twice tonight, leaving the Sweets in the barrel for 15 minutes each time. Some of the fouling is coming out, but there is a lot more to go.

How long can Sweets be safely left in the bore to soak?

Any other suggestions?
Thanks in advance
ZM

Zeke,

I do not think Sweet's will damage the barrel if left over night, despite some reports to the contrary.

I have cut open a barrel, and left Sweet's in it for weeks, and was unable to detect any damage to the steel.

Having said that, I think you will find that leaving it in for about 15-20 minutes each time will more beneficial.

That is what I do when someone brings rifle like yours here. Sometimes it takes several days to clean it.

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saeed@ emirates.net.ae

www.accuratereloading.com

Perhaps one or two treatments a day until the copper is out? I'll give that a try.
Fortunately all the fouling has not affected accuracy. The gun still shoots good even after 15 years of gun cabinet purgatory.
Thank You
ZM

Zeke,

You might need to do more than two passes a day through that barrel if you want to get all the copper out - assuming it is very bad from the beginning.

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saeed@ emirates.net.ae

www.accuratereloading.com

Zeke.

Go for a abrasive compound like USP bore paste, JB:S or Rem clean for ex. This will get the copper out a lot faster than the usual "cemical" metods. If you use a good rod guide that keep the cleaning rod away from the throat this will not in my opinion harm the barrel at all. Use a bronze brush with a patch wrapped around it. The scrubbing is effective only if there is a considerable amount of recistanse obtained. Place the barrel between soft covers in a vise during the cleaning. Don�t let the brush/patch pass the mussle during this action. Short stroke the barrel and pay some extra attention to the area in front of the chamber.

I have not seen that sweets do any harm just like Saeed points out. I have heard that there is some risk when mixing Sweets and Shooters Choise so i clean by barrels inbetween using theese two solvents. But this is only by hearsay, i don�t really know if there is any risk when the two different solvents mix.

Good luck in the fight against the copper

Stefan.

Hey"
You can also try this.When I get a barrel that has lots of copper fouling,I take it to the range,along with my cleaning equipment.I shoot the gun until the barre get exstemely hot.The copper will be in a state of flux,at this point.I clean the barrel at this point.Works for me.
1geejay
www.shooting-hunting.com

Zeke,
Get a chamber plug for the rifle (available from Midway, Sinclair, and others), place it in the chamber, and close the lever.
Secure the rifle in an upright position and fill the bore with Shooters Choice or Hoppe's Benchrest. Place some electrical tape over the muzzle, and let it sit for 12-24 hours.
Pour out the solvent, and run dry patches through the bore until dry.
If there is still copper fouling, repeat the process. I've found no easier procedure for cleaning badly fouled bores.

George

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Shoot straight, shoot often, but by all means, use enough gun!

Zeke, George,
Without a chamber plug, take the stock off and turn the rifle up and stick the muzzle in a block of parafin and pour in Barnes CR-10, leave overnight and then run a brush and then dry patches through it. Works for me.

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To be old and wise.....first you have to be young and stupid!

I use Hoppe's Benchrest and run a single wet patch through it every morning and evening until clean. They all eventually come around.

I have used the chamber plugs with good success, I just lay Saran wrap over the muzzle instead of tape.

Don

I'd run some abrasive through long before I'd fill up the barrel. When a barrel gets neglected like that, there will be layering going on that is hard to get through unless you use J.B.'s, Iosso, USP, Flitz, Rem clean, etc.

Shooting it first is a good idea, too. Makes a big difference in my experience. HTH, Dutch.

I have a small tube of Flitz somewhere in my reloading room. What is the best way to apply the Flitz to the barrel?

Thanks
ZM

Some people use a worn out or undersize brush and then apply the Flitz/ J.B.'s to a patch wrapped around the brush. I prefer to use an undersized jag with two patches, which gives me more control; a better feel. Others just put the Flitz on the brush. I really can't find fault with that, other than it would make for a messy brush, which goes against my "Dutch" sense of neatness.

I put a little on, move the patch through the barrel a couple of times, and then poke the patch barely out of the front of the barrel for a "recharge". Probably recharge twice or so before I replace the patch after the equivalent of 50 or so barrel passes --- but most of my strokes are short, 5 or 8 inches, back and forth. HTH, Dutch.

This will make you all squirm. I use Flitz or Semichrome on a bore brush wrapped with steel wool and wetted with some solvent. It sure makes the bore shine!! Don't do this on a match grade barrel. : )
Hey, on the M-99. You are going to do more harm than good agressively cleaning it. If you don't have a good muzzle guide the rod will wear the muzzle. Try the foul out system, or make a home made version. A little fouling will do no harm. If it shoots, leave it alone!

Hello All,
I think I discovered some rifling under all that copper. I first used Flitz, then cleaned. This is where most of the crud came out.
Used Sweets next, then cleaned again. The patches were a lovely shade of blue. Finally I cleaned with Hoppes #9. Eventually I got clean patches. Didn't have to get too aggressive, just repetitive.
There is still some copper in the bore. Not enough to get worried about. I think that my usual regimen of periodic cleaning will take care of the rest of the fouling.
Thanks again
ZM

[This message has been edited by Zeke (edited 09-19-2001).]

Zeke,
Go buy a bottle of BarnesX copper remover and you can end that struggle in about an hour or maybe 30 minutes...Be sure and dry the barrel and oil it when finished...

Why worry with all that other stuff....

On a real bad bore I will use "blue goop" that being a quart of 20% Commercial Ammonia ( from your pharmacist ) and a cup of Hydrogen Peroxide....do not leave in barrel, just swab, wait 10 minutes and dry, then repeat until patch is clean....the clean with Sweets or whatever, dry and liberally oil with WD-40

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

Ray, I am very fond of CR10, but when you have a neglected bore, it doesn't quite cut "it", whatever "it" is.

My father-in-law handed me his 240WBY the other day, asking me if I could figure out why it quit shooting (after 10 years and 300 rounds, "like DUH" as the younger crowd would say). CR10 alone did not cut it, but a round with Butch's, J.B.'s and CR10 to follow sure did! For some reason, there is something going on in layered barrels that CR10 doesn't get through.

I've gotten to the point now that even in my Shilen, I'll go to Butch's first, and then go to CR10 to make sure it is clean. FWIW, Dutch.

Dutch,
I think you were confronted with sandwiched layers of carbon and copper. The former has to be removed before copper dissolvers (which do not work on carbon) can get to copper fouling.

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Andr�

I have had great luck on carbon with Ed's Red. That is transmission fluid, kerosene and acetone. Maybe mix some with the copper remover??? I will play with the idea on the next really dirty rifle.

[/B][/QUOTE]

I'd advise against mixing ammonia based chemicals with other solvents. Some nasty reactions can happen and you risk ruining the bore in a couple of hours.

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Andr�

ADD 50% KROIL to your cleaning solvent.

Apply. Let sit 20 minutes or so.

Clean as usual. Use the kroil/solvent mixture and you'll never have a major fouling problem again.

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Don't tread on me!
Pennsylvania Frank

Frank, I'm sure it works, but there is something in me that prohibits me from mixing a couple of solvents "to see if it works". Maybe having a chemist for a wife has something to do with that trepidation....... Dutch.

Outers makes a electro-chemical bore cleaner. It works on copper and lead. http://www.blount.com/Sportng.html
Try this web sight. I have recovered some good shooters from guns people thought were shot out.
Good Luck

On a badly fouled barrel here's what I do. All with a good bore-guide.

(1) Butch's Bore Shine to get the powder and crud out.

(2)Dry patch the Butch's out.

(3) Take a loose patch and load it up with Sweet's and short stroke it thru the barrel..push the patch half way out the muzzle and add more Sweet's and run it back and forth thru the barrel a few more times.
Clean the rod and put on a new bronze brush and run the brush back and forth thru the barrel WITH THE SWEET'S STILL IN IT. The Sweet's will, of course, slowly "eat" the brush but the bristle will really loosen up the copper. Take the brush off and throw it away. Wipe off the rod and wait about 10 minutes and push a dry patch thru the bore. You will be amazed at how much copper comes out. Do another dry patch. Clean the rod. Repeat the process one more time and that should do it for even the nastiest copper plated barrel you can imagine. If it doesn't, now is the time to get out the JB Bore Paste and start strokin'. When you think the barrel is clean dry patch it a few times and then run 2 patches saturated with Butch's Bore Shine thru it and let it soak overnite. Next day run a dry patch thru and see how it looks. I had a Rem 700 .350 mag that had a barrel so rough that it would plate enough copper in 10 rounds to cause increases in pressure....nothing worked until I used a brush in conjuntion with the Sweet's. If you're the stingy type you can simply rinse off the bronze brush afterward and use it when you use the JB's but I tend to just toss them as they can give you a "trace" reading of copper.

(4) When the barrel is finally clean I run a patch of Butch's Gun Oil thru in and put it away....when I want to shoot it again I run one dry patch thru it before I shoot....if you bore is super dry on this first shot it will plate copper easier.

GEEJAY's method is a good way to clean your neglected barrel.

Out of fustration, I have cleaned one of my barrels by using a brush with sweets in the bore. The same way DB Bill has described. It worked great!

Daryl