Hello all,

Looking at a Springfield action for $200. Can someone give me a general rundown of what needs to be done to them to then rebarrel to the classic 35 whelen including bottom metal issues, if any, safety, hardening, etc.

does someone make an original contour barrel is such a thing exists? any pics would be helpful.

thanks,

jeff

Make sure it is above SN800,000 if a SA and above 285000 if a RIA. Otherwise, it does not need any heat treatment, and if below those numbers, do not shoot it at all; it can't be fixed. Bottom metal; milled TGs need nothing. No on the barrel; you have to make it yourself. What is the SN of the action you are looking at? Is it a n 03 or A3? If an A3, those are rougher made and have the dovetail bridge, but are very strong. 03s from 800K to about 1..27million serial number ranges are double heat treated; above that they are nickel steel. The double heat treat ones are hard but strong and the nickel steel ones are soft but strong; A3s are case hardened 8620 and are very hard and strong. You will need to alter the feel rails to feed; Dremel or carbide end mill.

03-A3:



03:



For the barrel contour , find an original and have it rebored.

Original 03s will have the rear sight locating pin drilled into it which is hard to hide. Original A3 barrels are easy to find and cheap. But are rough (usually have a steady rest cut in the middle) and will have to be draw filed, which is easy to do.

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
You will need to alter the feel rails to feed; Dremel or carbide end mill.

I'm not sure I understand your reasoning on this statement. The only difference between the 30-06 and the 35 Whelen is the part that doesn't touch the feed rails. Were you perhaps thinking of another cartridge?

No change in the feed rails is needed. It is
the Magnums and such that needs it. The
03 is a 120 year old design being based on the
93 Mauser (not the 98). The low number actions
which are rare today are probably safe to shoot
as most of the bad ones (not many at that) have
failed by now.

Why not just buy a Winchester model 70 and you won't have to do all those things to it.

quote:

Originally posted by srose:
Why not just buy a Winchester model 70 and you won't have to do all those things to it.

For the same reason that some people would rather customize a vintage Mustang than buy a factory new Kia. After all this is a gunsmithing forum, not a "buy new rifles" forum.

Sorry, nothing personal, I just get tired of seeing this kind of "advice"... Most people who tinker with old rifles do so for enjoyment and other complex personal reasons that cannot be satisfied by simply shelling out dollars for a modern factory offering at the local store.

Damn right! My philosophy is if you want a different gun, build it yourself. Any nitwit can save up money to buy a gun, but if it breaks, he's screwed. If you built it, you can fix it.

I fully agree; if someone wants to work with old stuff, why not? Anyone can go out and buy a new product but it takes patience and creativity to make something out of a vintage thing. I have done come wild things on Mosin Nagants and have a lot of fun doing it.
As for the 35 whelen feeding; have you ever built one (for hawkins and montea6b? I have. Here is a pic of a 35 in an 03; the neck is bigger so won't sit in the feed rails correctly. The bolt will override teh base of the cartridge if you don't relieve teh neck bearing area on the receiver. You need to grind or mill that surface a bit. It does touch the feed rails in the neck area. You might be thinking of more modern actions. You are welcome.

Sorry didn't mean to piss you off. I meant to say buy a Winchester model 70 to build your gun on. If you like doing all that stuff to a Springfield or Mauser have at it, no skin off my back.

Sam

SROSE: No worries, you didn't piss me off. Just a mini-rant...

DPCD: Thanks for the additional information. I'll admit I have not built a Whelen, but have one in work. I was going off conventional wisdom that if a parent case is used generally feed rails don't need work. True enough if you are necking down, but I hadn't thought of going the other way. That is why I asked for clarification. I have a couple Mausers and Springfields, I will have to check them out tonight for what you describe and show above. Thanks again.

Addendum: OK, I don't know what to say except that I am unable to duplicate the condition you describe and picture above. I got home tonight and popped a couple 35 Whelen cartridges in two different Mausers, a Springfield 1903, and a P-17. None of them had any issues whatsoever. The cartridges stacked like cordwood, and fed slick as a whistle until the bullet got to the throat of the barrel that was too narrow at .308 or 8mm. No problems with the neck contacting the feed rails at all. Here are a couple photos with the Springfield:

One Cartridge



Two Cartridges



You've definitely got something going on there, but it's not the neck interfering with the feed rails. In fact in your photos you can clearly see that the neck is NOT contacting the rails.

I take that back, the bottom part of the neck is contacting, but only because the cartridge is cocked at an angle. When they are sitting straight the neck does not contact the rails as you can see in my photos. (How can it? the rails are straight, but the neck is narrower than the body...)

Even if the neck was hitting the rails, that might prevent the neck from sliding up and forward but it shouldn't prevent the back end of the cartridge from rising up to engage the bolt. It seems that any interference in the stacking would actually push the neck down, leveling and raising the back end.

To put it another way, it seems that the neck is touching the rails because the back end is getting hung up, not that the back is getting hung up because the neck is touching the rails.

Cause and effect.

I'm puzzled by what you have going on there but I don't think opening the feed rails at the neck will fix it...

No problem here converting a Sedgley 03 in 30-06 to 35 Whelen. Other than the re-bore and chamber alteration (sent out), nothing further needed to be done to the rifle by me. Works fine with the mag and rails as-is.
..and a Low# '03 too.

A 1909 Steyr I have was originally made in 9x57 It's now in 35 Whelen and was that when I got it.
The 1909 uses the 98 Mauser style magazine. It doesn't appear that any rail or other alterations were done comparing it to the other 1909 I have still in 9x57.
Both work as smooth as an Steyr split bridge bolt rifle.

No set rules in any of this of course but just my meager experience.

My 35 Whenen is on a 98 Mauser. I am confused
as the case neck never touches the feed rails??.

If some one is interested I know where a high number 03 drill rifle is for sale. Barrel was leaded and drilled, stock is cracked sight parts are missing. Action is in very good shape and complete.

I believe the guy wants 250.00 plus shipping basically priced for the action.

My experience with converting the oldies but goodies(98M, 03 etc.) is this. Many actions reqire no work to feed cartridges based off the parent cartridge the action was designed to use, sometimes you can even use an Ackley version of the case and not have issues, but if you do enough different actions problems will appear such as dpcd is pointing out. If you are doing a conversion without issues, that is great. Just be prepared that sooner or later you will find an action that is going to need enough extra work to make up for all of the previous non issues. I find it is best when giving advice, based on experience, it is better to error on the side of caution.

Just tried it on another 03; fed perfectly. Case necks do touch the feed ramps on mine.