I just bought a pre-war J.P. Sauer 98 Mauser in 7.9x57J. It's a beautiful old rifle, half octagon - half round, full ribbed barrel, etc. But it is a J-bore (.318 diameter, I believe). Is it possible to rebore to S-bore (.323)? Thanks!

Gee, you have my rifle! Last year I got a preWWI Sauer in .318 8x57, nice light schnabel stock, half octogon barrel with 1 standing, 1 folding sight. It unfortunately also had excess headspace. I sent it to Cliff LaBounty. He told me he needed to go to .338 minimum to clean up. Apparently to rebore, he drills out the old bore then starts over. He did a great job on mine, now in 35 Whelan. Origanally, he was going to do it in 9x57 (bored to take .358 bullets) but found the extra headspaace. If you want to keep it in 8x57 you may need to find .318 bullets. I think Woodleigh, Hawk, and Buffalo Bullets (?) have .318's.

Some of us Houston posters have gotten together to shoot on occasion. We ought to do it again. Bob

Thanks, Bob. I haven't gotten through to Cliff but I'm afraid he will confirm what you said. Probably the smartest thing to do is find some .318 bullets. A 338-06 could be another option if I also have headspace.

fla3006
I have one that Cliff opened up to .338 and Maurice Ottmar chambered it for me to .338-06. It worked out quite well and I know Cliff said the same thing then.

I have a similar problem ... a lovely old, light, set triggered, jaeger style rifle in 8 x 57 (I think). Was given to a friend by Les Hemingway (Ernest's brother) with the indication that it had once been owned by Ernest. My friend left it to me when he passed away some years ago.

Any contact information for the smith?

Any source of 0.318 projectiles?

Thank you all VERY much!

mike

Sounds like it's begging to become a 9.3x62.

There's not enough meat on the barrel to go to 9.3. 338 is probably max.

http://www.ows-ammunition.com/cgi-bin/catalog25/scan/MM=bade6e ad32155673d8f433546a7e1c4b:20:39:20:?Evib6vUC;;322

http://www.ows-ammunition.com/cgi-bin/catalog25/search

Put .318 in the search field. You will get dies and ammo.

Old western scrounger has bullets and dies, see links. How much would you really shoot it? 8x 57 is pleanty of rifle for anything we shoot in the US. I would leave it alone and enjoy it as is.

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Originally posted by fla3006:
Thanks, Bob. I haven't gotten through to Cliff but I'm afraid he will confirm what you said. Probably the smartest thing to do is find some .318 bullets. A 338-06 could be another option if I also have headspace.

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[ 10-22-2002, 22:10: Message edited by: scot ]

I think that if the headspace is safe on these fine old rifles that they should be preserved and fed .318 bullets. The one with the Hemingway history would be especially damned hard for me to alter.

Fireplug

I talked to Cliff Labounty. He says it is not possible to rebore a 318 to 323. Guess I'll leave it as is and locate some 318 bullets and be happy.

I would think that swaging down .323's to .318 wouldn't be too hard and would result in a useful bullet. Not sure where to get the proper die and punch, but any machine shop worth it's salt could make them for you.

Hello fla3006 - Congrats on the Sauer - I have it's bigger brother - a 9.3x62 - also half-octagon, schnabel foreend. Made in 1935. It'll be the last rifle that I ever get rid of.

Anyway to bullets....

I swage 0.308" heads down to 0.300" in my Rockchucker - no great sweat. Use a synthetic oil and be surprised at how easily it goes.

I made the die 0.308" for bullet length and a half, through a 2.5 degree "forcing cone" to exit through a 0.297" hole. Due to elasticity the head recovers back to 0.300".

The punch is made to 0.2965" works OK. Gives a dead flat base - accuracy is also just fine.

Going from 0.323" to 0.318" is a smaller step so - go for it.

I also made a die to "bump up" heads from 0.284" to 0.288 for use in my Ross rifle. Got too enthusiastic about polishing out the die and ended up with 0.291" heads. They shoot just fine too.

Keep it original and add bullet "rolling" to your repertoire.

cheers edi

StoneCreek

Here is the die you are looking for

http://www.z-hat.com/Ring.htm

I don't have one of these but I have had work done by Fred Zeglin and he does goes good work.

fla3006,
Have you measured the actual groove diameter of it yet ? They sometimes run wide at .320 or .321 If so you could use the 32 Win. Special (.321) bullet. If not you can find .318 bullets here.
http://www.hawkbullets.com/P-LIST.htm
Another souce for bullet sizing dies.
http://www.rceco.com/bulletmetal.htm
Good Luck

If you are interested in swaging down bullets for this rifle but not in going into bullet making, you might want to go with the CH4d die that works with any sturdy standard reloading press rather than dies that require bullet presses.

Fireplug

"I would think that swaging down .323's to .318 wouldn't be too hard and would result in a useful bullet".

Seems logical, but the idea is wrong. If you swage a jacket bullet down the result is a ruined bullet. Lead does not spring back and guilding metal does. That results in loose cores. You could bump up 308 bullets. If you just want some plinking ammo cast some bullets. If you want to hunt, use good factory bullets. The swage idea makes expensive plinking bullets.

Or.......better yet, slug your bore, and call up The old western scrounger, and buy some decent bullets. You will have a bunch of money in swages and dies. You could have $500 in dies and a press real easy. $500 buys a lot of bullets!

http://www.corbins.com/index.htm

If you really want to persue it, these guy have what you need. Dies are about 175 each, you need several. Press is about 300. Interesting reading though, check them out. Oh! the link above, in another post, is for pistol bullet swages. Not helpfull with this project.

[ 10-25-2002, 00:24: Message edited by: scot ]

You can always rebarrel with a Lothar Walter. They offer the same barrel that is on your rifle now but in your choice of calibers.

There is a reputable gunsmith in Montana that will "reline" a barrel for $250. I plan to have a 30/40 Krag done. I have heard that these "relined" barrells will often shoot better than monlithic barrels as the epoxy used to bond the liner in acts as vibration isolater or damper or something on that order.

e-mail me and I will send you his phone #.

Thanks for all the good advice, guys. I think I'll take K-Boom's advice and buy some Hawk bullets; didn't know about those. They offer all kinds of obsolete bullets in odd ball sizes. By the way, I just got off the phone with someone at Lothar Walther and a half octagon-half round, ribbed barrel costs between $1500-$2000, uninstalled or blued, depending on specs!

[ 11-01-2002, 22:27: Message edited by: fla3006 ]

A good source for swaged down bullets in several weights is Buffalo Arms at www.buffaloarms.com