They have a great gun design. Unfortunaley the last 4 or 5 years, quality has suffered and they priced themselves out of the average guy market, which is what they based their name on for the last 70 years.

They just cant produce enough mid range guns to compete. time to fold up camp (I say with a tear in my eye)

By the way,,,, I own 4 Ithacas

Rumor is Remington has bought them in a fire sale, with probable motive to assest strip the distribution network, for the Sparta line of shotguns.

I was doing some searching on details of this but I have come up with zip.

If the above is true, Ithaca is down for the count, and the best we might expect is a limited production RemIthaca.

The reason that I am posting is the local papers are saying that the latest buyer (Ithaca Outdoors???) backed out and Ithaca shut their doors. It wasn't until the articles came out that I found that one of my acquaintances was part of the ownership group. Just wanted to find out from others if they thought a company like this was worth saving.

Thanks for the quick responses.

I hope they can come back. Otherwise the only 37 being made will be CHINESE. That is downright depressing.

quote:

Originally posted by swampfox:
I hope they can come back. Otherwise the only 37 being made will be CHINESE. That is downright depressing.

John Browning design made by the Chinese, yeah doesn't sound too good to me either.

Aint this the second or third time that they failed?My second shotgun was a model 37.Like a dumdass I sold it when I bought my S.B.E..Then again I regret selling my Winchester single shot model 37 when I got the Ithaca.

Poor management and poor market research has been the downfall of allot of companies.

Other than a fairly decent pump shotgun what did Ithaca ever make that anyone remembers or points to and says: “Boy, now there’s a great...â€

I was never a real fan of the Model 37, but that could be because the first one I ever handled belonged to a guy that deserved to get lost forever in the swamp. I did have an Ithaca Flues Model SXS that was nice, a cut above the hardware store guns of the time.

Found this article on the current difficulties:

Subject: Ithaca Gun loses buyer, closes its doors

http://www.auburnpub.com/articles/2005/06/23/news/news02.txt

It was late May and Ithaca Gun Co.'s future finally looked promising.

Andrew Gibson, the company's potential new owner, met with David
Miller, Cayuga County's director of planning and economic
development. Gibson, of Scituate, R.I., told Miller how the
historically important firearms company was working to resolve some
of its financial issues. He said there was new management in place
and he showed Miller a new marketing plan, an extensive analysis of
costs and a new labor structure. Gibson said he would be investing a
significant amount of his own money.

"He had great enthusiasm and he seemed to understand the business,"
Miller said. "I was very impressed. I don't know what happened to
change his mind. It was a complete shock to me."

Gibson decided not to go through with the purchase. The group of
investors that owns the company - which moved from King Ferry to the
city of Auburn technology park at the end of April - shut it down and
is now looking for another buyer, Miller said.


"He was interested, but things just didn't work out," said Gibson's
wife, Katherine, who is also one of his business partners.

As the Gibsons learned more about the 124-year-old company and delved
deeper into its financials, they realized the numbers weren't going
to add up, she said.

"He's a sportsman, and he wanted it to work," she said. "But it just
didn't."

When Gibson backed out, Andrew Sciarabba, the major investor of the
seven partners who bought the company in 1995 out of a bankruptcy,
decided to close, Miller said.

The company is several hundred thousand dollars in debt. Part of that
is most of a $150,000 loan from Cayuga County's revolving loan fund.
Miller said Ithaca Gun has missed the May and June payments that
total just less than $1,000. The money was loaned for equipment while
the business was still in King Ferry.

As collateral, the company put up existing manufacturing equipment,
as well as the Ithaca Gun trademark. The company was founded in 1880
in Ithaca and became world renown for manufacturing high-quality,
affordable guns such as the Deerslayer and Deerslayer II.

It went out of business for a time, and then was re-established in
the 1980s, when it came to King Ferry. When the company again fell on
hard times, Sciarabba and his partners bought it.

It has struggled recently. Ithaca Gun earlier this year had a $12,000
judgment filed against it by a Watertown educational television
station because the gun manufacturer had agreed to underwrite a
hunting show, but never paid. Several other judgments were filed
against the company for unpaid bills as well and there were problems
with the state Department of Labor regarding unemployment benefits.
The labor department judgment was satisfied earlier this month.

While they were still in King Ferry, Miller said, Sciarabba and his
partners pointed out one of the company's greatest difficulties was
operating in an antiquated former school building that was
energy-inefficient.

Miller said he helped connect Ithaca Gun officials with
representatives of Johnston Paper, the firm that owns the Allen
Street property in the technology park. Johnston Paper moved to a new
facility in Aurelius in 2004.

On May 5, at an Auburn City Council meeting, Katrinka Ryan, Ithaca
Gun's finance manager, announced the company was under new
management, was in Auburn and was working with the city's Office of
Planning and Economic Development. Eventually, the company, which had
employed 26 people in King Ferry, would have 50 workers, Ryan said.

Miller said he and Sciarabba talk weekly and he's convinced Ithaca
Gun is actively working to find a buyer. He said the county won't
foreclose on the loan yet.

"It would be premature to call it in and foreclose," Miller said. "We
desire to see the company survive and prosper, but we're not going to
let this go on indefinitely."

Miller is confident the county will get its money. He said if it does
foreclose, it will "be in the first position" to own the gun
manufacturing equipment, worth about $183,000, that the company put
up as collateral. Subject to legal interpretation, Cayuga County will
also likely own the company's famous trademark, an intangible that
was also offered as loan security.

The county would contract with experts in the firearms manufacturing
field to help sell the equipment and trademark.

Sciarabba could not be reached for comment Wednesday.

When Gibson and his business partners looked like they would step in
and save the company, Miller said there was a great degree of optimism.

The purpose of the meeting with Miller was to see if the revolving
loan could be transferred from Sciarabba's group to Gibson's. Miller
said he was prepared to arrange a meeting with Gibson and the loan
committee for further investigation.

"That's why this is such a surprise," Miller said.

"It wasn't like they were this moribund company that we hadn't heard
anything about for a long time. And the new people coming in were all
young, in their late 20s and early 30s. That's why this one is kind
of disappointing. We thought it was on the right track."

quote:

Originally posted by Rick 0311:

Other than a fairly decent pump shotgun what did Ithaca ever make that anyone remembers or points to and says: “Boy, now there’s a great...â€

The Ithaca/SKB line of O/U's and SxS's were some nice shotguns. I've got a M500 Magnum with 30" barrels was was an awesome duck gun back in the lead shot days (I keep thinking about getting tubes installed in it now, as it is choked Full and Improved Modified, pretty tight stuff...), and a M600 Skeet that is real nice. They both just hit everything that they are pointed at.

Besides those, I've got a M37 Deerslayer that has killed well over 100 deer. Toss in my dad's with an equal record, and I kinda like my Ithacas.

Cold Bore,

Like I said, Ithaca made a pretty decent shotgun.

Maybe all yours will be collectors item’s now that they’ve gone belly up.

It is a shame that a well made gun has gone down the tubes. I sure would like to see some of the old guns that were made before manufacturing cost was such an issue make a comeback! I would also like to see this done by an American company and not Japanese or Chinese! If Remington starts making the Ithaca maybe I'll by Remington again!

John D,

Thanks for the local update on this. I know it doesn't sound good right now but I would rather see them in their current dire straits than see Remington get a hold of them. There is a better chance of them coming back, although it might take a couple of years.

Ithaca has had a foot in the grave for years on and off. When I was younger every police car in America had a WInchester or Ithaca pump shotgun in the dashboard rack. Remington pretty much replaced them both with the 870. The old model 37's made pretty neat trench guns, one of the few models that can be slam fired. They made a big mistake when they disabled the slam fire feature on the 87's ( another era of bankcrupcy ), and a sizeable portion of their customer base forgot about Ithaca. Fast forward a few years later they reintroduced the 37, but I really think it was too little too late, and the police versions were hard to get and discontinued they were availble for a couple of years only, and the trench versions were history.

I was looking at these a couple of years ago, and was going to pick up a new 37, but I wanted a trench gun and they had quit making them or the police versions. I went so far to see if the parts were avaiable to convert a new gun into one of these. I even called into the factory with no sucess. I started loosing interest when I couldn't get a straight answer on the new 37's and the slam fire feature, was this disabled like the 87's? None were stocked anywhere anymore which didn't allow me to pick one up and check it out. The current model they had their marketing eye on was slug rifles. Which I think was one of the companies first tacticle errors, slug rifles have a limited geographic area of interest, pretty much east coast and some in the south, not much interest in the west. That was coupled with the loss of models for upland game, where the did have national interest.

In hind sight I wish I had bought one a couple of years ago I would have helped this underdog, but my sole purchase wouldn't have saved anything. I still think they should have concentrated on the police version done some minor upgrades. I have used both the 870 and a older 37 and the Ithaca was much prefered by me, 870's don't slam fire.

For those who don't remember Ithaca did make a pretty decent double shotgun back in the day, but stopped production right after WWII. It wasn't the who-ha snooty English double, but it was a decent field gun, and I could make room in my safe for a pre war Ithaca double in a 16 or 20 guage.

Really a damn shame, I admit I am not a shotgun guy, my budget for them is usaually zero, and most times I am annoyed by the fish and game regs that restrict me to bird hunting with a shotgun, I would rather use a 22 LR with a scope, but I liked the Ithaca guns.

Ithaca going belly up certainly doesn’t have any effect on the availability of their “older†models if someone still wants one.

If it is profitable I’m sure some enterprising company out there will snatch Ithaca up and start producing products again.

I certainly think that Ithaca is worth saving. I totally agree that part of their problem was that the only thing they were manufacturing was the model 37. I'm not much of a shotgun fan myself and just absolutely HATE pumps! I don't think there's one anywhere that fits me. The forearm always seems like I'm stretching a mile and a half to reach it on them. Those old SxS doubles where fantastic guns!!!! My grandfather owns 3 and I've picked up one and those critters just feel PERFECT!!!! They point like a natural extension to your arm! I also like the 22 rimfires they built in the late 50's and 60's although from what I've read their lever action repeater was a POS. Something about poor design trying to convert their single shot to a repeater in house on the cheap and was very sensitive to sloppy tolerances which apparently were COMMON, I've got one that works GREAT but I hear that's a rarity. Something like my 100% factory Ruger Ranch Rifle that's an honest sub-MOA. Someone upstairs must be looking out for me!

Sure hope Ithaca makes it back from the dead again!

Don't forget the Mag-10. Remember the Roadblocker? A Mag-10 with rifled slug barrel. I still want one of those.

Ithaca also made a pretty nice 1911A1 for the military during WW2.

But the 37 is all time. I have a 20" cylinder bore parkerized riot gun. Killed a pile of deer with it, including my biggest point. Just set a red dot on it in a B-square mount. Works wonderfully.

Ithaca made some lovely single and double shotguns in the old days. I have seen one single abrrel trap gun that was exquisite. Something to suggest that they should be revived.

Tom Wylie article

Swampfox, you're absolutely right.

Good hunting gentlemen!

No great loss. The 37 being a Browning design is a loss, but their doubles were all butt ugly. The NID was strong, butt ugly. The Flues was weak, butt Ugly. Maybe 10% of the small frame Flues will crack their frames. The Minier & Lewis were ugly, too. The Crass wasn't too bad. When they bought the Lefever Co in the early 1920's, they turned that magnificent gun into the "Lefever" Nitro Special. It was a carbon copy of the NID. May the Ithica name rot in hell for that atrosity. The Mag Ten was too heavy and had problems. No great loss. Another fellow made some high end NID's recently, but went belly up. He made the gun less BU, but should have copied the Lefever, which he had started to do before the end. Let it die.

As for old Ithaca products, I still have and will not part with, my Martini actioned Model 49, 22LR SS. I burned up many a brick of 22 through it. This was my first rifle,(@ 8 yrs old) later I bought their lever action Model 66 20ga SS for my first shotgun.(@ 13) Still have it too.

As for an old gun co. coming back, there are lots of great old makers I would put in front of Ithaca, like: Parker Bro., L.C. Smith, Lefever, Fox, Baker, etc.

Hog Killer

Hog Killer

ithaca suffered what many companies suffer. they made products that were well made to start and then were cheapened as time went on to maintain a price point. the 37 of old was all steel and weighed less than the 870. you would think there would be no competition but other guns had features others could live with for the price. ithaca went the way of the old high standard. they couldn't sell enough of their limited product line to make a profit. when they tried to expand the product line, their marketing people and designers were wrong in what the people would buy .

Ithaca is a grand old U.S. firearms trademark - it deserves to be saved as much as any of the oldies: Win., Rem., Savage, Colt, or S&W!!

Besides, there is always a place in the market for a gun like the M37, if it is priced competitively.

Besides, we can never have TOO MANY outfits making GUNS!!

Another update:

http://www.auburnpub.com/articles/2005/06/30/news/news02.txt

Arivilla Peerboom wants her gun back.

It's actually her husband's gun, and was his father's before that,
and they want to pass it on to their grandson. The Goodrich, N.D.,
couple sent the weapon, made by the Ithaca Gun Co., to the
manufacturer in March for repair.

The Peerbooms are hoping that New York State Attorney General Eliot
Spitzer's office will help them, and dozens of other families, get
their guns from the now-closed company on Allen Street in Auburn.
After an anticipated sale fell through in early June, the group of
investors that owns Ithaca Gun shut it down.

Paul Larabee, a spokesman for Spitzer, said the attorney general's
satellite offices in Binghamton, Rochester and Syracuse have received
more than a dozen phone calls from people who have unsuccessfully
tried to contact Ithaca Gun. The company's Web site was shut down.
Phones, except for one connected to a fax machine, have been
disconnected.

Meanwhile, the principal investor, Andy Sciarabba of Ithaca, said he
has every intention of returning all of the guns that have been
entrusted to the company.

One of his two remaining staff members has been working to compile a
list of customers who have inventory with the company. He encouraged
anyone trying to contact the company to send an e-mail to Katrinka
Ryan at kryan@ithacagun.com. He said letters may also be sent to the
company.

"We want to get the stuff back as quickly as possible," Sciarabba
said. "We're not going to be able to repair anything. We don't have
the staff. But we do want to get the guns back to people. We know
that they all have sentimental value."

Larabee said Spitzer's office's goal is to be helpful at this point.

"We will identify the facts and issues," Larabee said. "We've had
sufficient contacts from customers, and we will be reaching out to
Ithaca Gun."

Peerboom said she is out not only the gun, but the $75 the company
charged to assess what was wrong with it and the $535.50 that was put
on a credit card in anticipation that the gun would be repaired.
Several other people who contacted Spitzer's office also complained
they had put deposits down on new guns, or had paid for them and they
were never received.

"That, I can't help with," Sciarabba said.

He said it's impossible for him to refund anyone their money because
when the company closed, the investors, in essence, foreclosed on the
assets. He said there is no cash left and the company is selling
machine parts to meet payroll of its remaining employees.

It also owes most of a $150,000 revolving loan to Cayuga County.
Sciarabba said the investors had put $2 million into the company
since 1995 and "never realized one dime."

He said he and the other investors bought the company out of
bankruptcy because they wanted to rescue the reputation of the
company, which was founded in the 1880s in Ithaca. It moved to King
Ferry in the mid-1980s, where it continued to manufacture
inexpensive, high-quality guns. Ithaca Gun moved to Allen Street in
late April, but when a Rhode Island man backed out of purchasing the
company, Sciarabba said he was left with no other option but to close.

"We tried," he said. "No one can say we didn't try."