As many of you are aware, I stuck up for Stuart on a recent thread here on AR that was very similar to the thread that is currently underway concerning Hein Actions.

Since what I had to say was based upon my dealings with Stuart well over a year ago, along with a visit I had with him at his shop well over a year ago, and because I was going through SD on my way to Cody Days in Cody Wyoming, I decided to "drop in" unannounced at Stuart's Shop to see how things are going.

I may not be a Riflesmith, but I know quality work when I see it and feel it, and I can report that after spending a considerable amount of time in Stuart's shop, I feel confident in stating that the shop is building what could argueably be some of the finest mauser type actions in the world.

The fit and finish on these actions is incredible. There is no wobble, and there is no slop. Everything on every action I looked at is, for lack of a better word, "CRISP". One of the large actions was filled with a full magazine of 416 Rigby Cartriges and shucked as fast as possible upside down, sideways, etc. No problems noted.

The trigger mechanisms are much like those of the Model 70 Winchester, but with absolutely no slop whatsoever.

No only did I see quite a few actions in progress, but I also saw some of Stuart's other work as well. Many probably do not know of him as a stockmaker, but he does an absolutely gorgeous job with a stick of Walnut.

And I took a real close look at one of his Titanium Actions barreled in 6.5-.284 expertly fitted to a lightweight synthetic stock. Anyone who wants a high quality, controlled feed ,lightweight rifle for sheep hunting could not go wrong with one.

Not only that, but Stuart remains, as I remembered him, an extremely pleasant man. He was very generous with his time, and was willing to show me around the shop. Additionally, Stuart's lovely wife Jacqi was very generous with her time as well, and we had a very nice visit. She is a wonderful lady, and Stuart is lucky to have her.

Based on what I saw, and what I heard, and what I know to be true, Stuart Saterlee is a hard working riflesmith who wants to produce mauser type actions of very very high quality, and he is doing that.

There is no doubt in my mind that Stuart never had any intention to defraud anyone. He just is not that type of guy. I don't think he would kick his worst enemy out of his shop if the guy was truly interested in fine guns.

What I really believe happened is that Stuart is a Riflesmith first and foremost, and a businessman second. He really did have problems with equipment that took an inordinate amount of time to correct, and he just didn't do enough studying concerning the amount of time and money it takes to build an inventory of very high grade custom rifle actions.

Yes, yes, yes, there probably should have been a bit more communication with the customers who ordered actions.
I agree with that. But I think that any of those folks who are bitter over their experience with Stuart ought to go and meet the guy and talk to him personally about it rather than making attacks on the internet. There isn't one guy on this forum whose sh_t doesn't stink! As a former CPA I think that these folks who start these action companies should go out and find an investor to handle thier inventory. Leave the selling and the finances to somebody else, and just stick to building actions. That is what large corporations do, and I don't see where it should be any different for smaller companies. Nevertheless, I don't think anyone is really aware of the tremendous amount of work that goes into building one of these custom actions until one actually goes to the shop and studies them very closely in their various stages of production.

After looking at one of those big Rigby ations for a hour or so, I couldn't resist, and ordered one. I didn't even ask how long it would take. All I said was make sure and get everyone else ahead of me taken care of before you get to mine. If it takes two or three years to take delivery it will be worth the wait, although from what I saw, based on all of the machines now working, it isn't going to take near that long.

If anyone thought about ordering a Saterlee action before and then got turned off to the idea after the thread here on AR, I would suggest that you take a few days to take a drive to Deadwood SD. Go visit Stuart at his shop. Go see the work that is going on there.
Sit down and let Stuart show you his actions, his other metalwork, and his beautiful stock work. Take the opportunity to visit with Stuart's wife Jacqi if you get a chance. I have a feeling that if you do these things you will reconsider your decision and order an action.

Finally, for anyone looking for one of Stuart's 3 position safeties, it looked like he had a good supply on hand if you were considering ordering one. Those ones with the lever on the left hand are really neat.

Don't want to rain on your parade but what you have stated are things that were never in dispute. Heck why do you think so many people on AR had orders placed with him.

If Satterlee has actions in stock and ready to be shipped I am a customer. If its pay now and then build no thanks. Stuart has earned that attitude.

Howard

I don't speak for Saterlee, and I don't know if he has any actions for immediately delivery. I had to order mine.

You state that Suart has "earned" an attitude.
I suppose you could say that, but I think its more that circumstances, many of which were beyond his control, earned an attitude for him.
I doubt very very much that Stuart wanted any of the delays in delivery of his actions to take place, and It appeared to me that he is doing everything he possibly can to take care of those folks who stuck by him. He has in fact even hired some help to get things out a bit faster. That being said, I don't blame you for wanting something right away. I know you are trying to get a matched pair of rifles for yourself and your Son, and that you kind of want them to be finished before he's grown up and married!!!!!

I suggest you call Stuart yourself and ask him what he can and can't do. Better yet, go visit him and talk to him in person so you can form your own attitude about him.

Well guys I don't know about the actions but I had ordered a safety from him last year. Knowing the problems he had, according to posts on this web site, I did not know when I would get it.
Stuart called me a couple of weeks ago and said he would be ready to ship soon as they were being polished and did I want one.
My safety arrived yesterday accompanied by an invoice and reasonable discount, open account I did not ask for.
It looks really good, nicely made left hand lever for right hand gun. Now to get it fitted
During our conversation he seems to be a very personable, and knowledgeable guy.
Not trying to justify any thing on the problems with the actions just my experinces doing business with him.

quote:

Originally posted by 22WRF:
Howard

I don't speak for Saterlee, and I don't know if he has any actions for immediately delivery. I had to order mine.

You state that Suart has "earned" an attitude.
I suppose you could say that, but I think its more that circumstances, many of which were beyond his control, earned an attitude for him.
I doubt very very much that Stuart wanted any of the delays in delivery of his actions to take place, and It appeared to me that he is doing everything he possibly can to take care of those folks who stuck by him. He has in fact even hired some help to get things out a bit faster. That being said, I don't blame you for wanting something right away. I know you are trying to get a matched pair of rifles for yourself and your Son, and that you kind of want them to be finished before he's grown up and married!!!!!

I suggest you call Stuart yourself and ask him what he can and can't do. Better yet, go visit him and talk to him in person so you can form your own attitude about him.

Attitude is prehaps the wrong word I suppose I should have said skeptisim. Taking orders and under estimating production capability is totally under ones control. So is communication.

Doing everything he possible can is what he should be doing. I am sorry but that is basic business not service above and beyond.

I am not attacking Stuart as a person. I said if he has product I will order Monday but facts are facts and his potential customers have every right to be skeptical. That is just good business.

And you are right........I am honest enough to realize I have a jaded view. Satterlee is one I considered before I went with Hein. Looks like I would have been burned either way. People who order custom guns or parts thereof only ask for one thing in each and every case. Simply do what you say you will do for our money.

quote:

Simply do what you say you will do for our money.

For reasons yet unknown to me this doesn't always apply to gunsmiths/custom manufacturers by a unusually large number of people.


Being a nice guy at best may buy a little time but in the end makes it worse if it doesn't work out because the customer feels more burned after cutting the guy a break because he was a "nice guy". I'll take a grumpy ass who gets the work done any day over the nice guy who doesn't.

How many promised actions have been shipped since the last thread? We've seen lots of pictures of a bunch of unfinished actions. No pictures or numerous reports from members of action completed or recieved?

Perhaps you could speak to the number of completed actions you saw?

TC1 is absolutely right. I didn't start this thread so as to start bashing Stuart Saterlee again. And I don't speak for Stuart.

My intention was to see first hand how things were going there, and to look at the work becasue I was interested in purchasing an actions. The way I see it, when I go to buy car, or any other large purchase, I go and meet the person who I am dealing with. I go to look at the product.

That being said, I don't know how many have been shipped out. Its none of my business. I think there were about 4 or 5 actions that were basically completed, and at least a dozen or more that needed only one or two more operations, plus at least 10 that were profiled and had the hole driled and the barrel threads installed, but needing further shaping. The one that I played with for awhile, the .416 Rigby, just needed a bit more outside polishing, as did a couple more.

And it appeared that there was at least a couple dozen safeties for those who need to order one.


I don't speak for Saterlee, and I don't know his production schedules, but there was a lot of work going on there.

Once again, my suggestion would be that if you have any interest at all the best thing to do is speak directly with Stuart rather than relying on what has been said on the internet.
That is what I did, and I am confident that I will be extremely happy with my action, whenever I receive it.

quote:

Originally posted by TC1:

TC1, You took the words right outta my mouth.

So, you're the cause of all these delays? Popping in on all the smiths while on your cross country journey taking up their valuable time.

I'll have a lot more confidence in a recommendation of someone who's actually received an action from Satterlee anytime in recent memory. MHC-TX has bent over backwards to accomodate Stuart's many delays. On the last Satterlee thread, they publicly agreed on a delivery date that has come and gone yet again. It seems the least we could do before sounding the "all's clear" call is see someone, anyone actually get the Satterlee action they paid for.

FORREST
i think MHC and Webie will be getting there actions sent out as we talk so to speak...the finishing touches are just getting attended to.
i hope those guys come on board and give AR posters an critical unbiased review
Daniel

I called Satterlee a couple of months back for the first time since I sent the deposit for a complete rifle a year ago.Stuart called me back the next day and told me that my action was finished and the walnut he has is really nice.I was pleased to recieve his call.I am really looking forward to having a 458 Lott built by him.

well folks, I have not ordered an action from Stuart but......the 2 98's that he has performed work on was done well. Certainly he had "other" great jobs that would create more money but he certainly had time for my requests.

what little I know of Stuart and our many conversations-he is a working man for your money and business nonetheless.

wish him great success.

Guys,
He may eventually deliver, but I am 66 yrs old and afraid if I ordered one my widow might get it.
Butch

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
Guys,
He may eventually deliver, but I am 66 yrs old and afraid if I ordered one my widow might get it.Butch

I'm a good bit older than that , Butch. Really a consideration , now that you mention it. roger

quote:

Originally posted by rem721:
So, you're the cause of all these delays? Popping in on all the smiths while on your cross country journey taking up their valuable time.

I don't know. I did stop in and visit for a few minutes with Gunmaker. Let me tell you what. I saw some absolutely incredible work being done there as well. Anybody that is thinking about having some stock work done by somebody they have not tried yet ought to give James a holler. His stock work is impecable, to say the least. Moreover, his metal work is impecable as well. There is great gunwork being done in the State of South Dakota!!!!!

I write this from Cody. Let's see, who is here that I could go and bug for awhile???

Don't know any gunsmith's in Cody but I think they have a very nice museum.


Terry

TC1

I know they have a great museum because I have been there at least 7 times before, and I am going back again. Actually, it is 5 museums in one. Buffalo Bill, Plains Indian, Art, Natural History, and my favorite, which is the gun museum.

Never been there but I've heard them talk about it on the History channel.

Have fun,
Terry

what matters is not how nice, or how expensive Satterlee actions are; but if and when one ordered actually arrives. Someone at Stuart's shop needs to buy a notebook and write down what a customer orders, and when the order was promised. When Stuart can't recite the book, from front to rear; he needs to answer the phone and say "I can't fill the orders I have deposits on and guaranteed delivery dates in the next twelve months! Call me in nine months!". Coulda, Shoulda, and Woulda are not like fulfilling a contract.

Did I tell you guys I almost made love to Salma Hyak and Kate Beckinsale both last night? Yessir, had an erection, but I couldn't get either one of them to answer their phones.

If the custom smiths couldn't get a dime until the rifle was completed and delivered, they'd all have 100% positive feedback on delivery times.

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...

quote:

If the custom smiths couldn't get a dime until the rifle was completed and delivered, they'd all have 100% positive feedback on delivery times.

They'd all be workin' at the mall........

The only thing I find disturbing about these type threads are that a lot of the people posting I bet don't have any money invested and probably have never even spoke with the guy. But, they will get on these threads and assume they have some God given right to tell the man how to run his business and participate in ruining his reputation.



Now I'm not saying that some don't have every right to be upset, trust me, I've been there and I know what's it's like. It just seems like there are a lot of "sidewalk commando's" around here.


Terry

M98, you might want to re-read my post. If you have dealings with the man then it obviously doesn't apply to you.


Terry

TC1
have re-read my post and deleted it...my apolagies
Daniel

No problems here.

Terry

IMG]http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c112/dakota11/IMG_0610.jpg[/IMG]

MHC-TX,
This is your action. 416 Rigby 4+1 capacity, m-70 trigger design, 3 position safety. It is all polished out and the feed and function work has been completed,everything works and works very well. Thank you for sticking with this project. You've been a gratious, and patient boss. Your action will ship out this week.
Thanks again MHC-TX
Stuart

I'll give that photo another try. I've fouled something up with it. There we go. I think thats right.
Thanks agian MHC-TX.
Stuart

Better?

The photobucket got spilled.

TIMAN

"It seems the least we could do before sounding the "all's clear" call is see someone, anyone actually get the Satterlee action they paid for."

It was not my intention to sound an "all clear call". Rather, the intent of my post was to report what I actually saw at Stuart's actual shop after actually talking with Stuart.

As I have stated, those who ordered and didn't receive their actions yet probably have a right to be privately upset. But I agree with TC1. There have been a lot of folks who either have never ordered one single thing from Stuart, or have never even met the guy or visited his shop, who have come on here and made uncalled for comments.

Anyway, enough of that bullshit.

Stuart, that action looks great. I am jealous of MHC-TX, and of the other folks who are going to be receiving their actions in the very near future.

Timan,

Thank you!

Can you please email me the tracking number when you ship it to Duane Wiebe.

Update on the last thread. Stuart was not able to meet our orginal agreed upon April date. He called me and informed me of what he had left to do on the action and told me he needed another 3-4 weeks to finish it. He told me he would refund my deposit if this wasn't acceptable to me. I agreed to the extension and I appreciated the phone call. There was a small delay with the floorplate design, but it was fixed to my satisfaction. Stuart also emailed me some photo's of the action, which I appreciated and we talked a couple times on the phone during this last month with him calling me to give me up-dates. During one of these phone calls I could hear the excitement in Stuart's voice and I could tell he was really proud of "his" action.

I really hope Satterlee Arms gets everything clicking on all eight-cylinders and gets any production issues worked out. Hopefully, we all learned something here. Honest and up-front communication is all most customers ask for, plus a few emails (pictures) now and then are also nice.

I think we should all get behind Satterlee Arms and support him, after all it's in all of our interest to have such a resource for mauser actions and it's in Stuart's interest, because he can earn a living doing what he enjoys doing.

quote:

Honest and up-front communication is all most customers ask for, plus a few emails (pictures) now and then are also nice.

I think we should all get behind Satterlee Arms and support him, after all it's in all of our interest to have such a resource for mauser actions and it's in Stuart's interest, because he can earn a living doing what he enjoys doing.

I think that is a fair statement.

I would wish Stuart every success!

10-4

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:

quote:

Honest and up-front communication is all most customers ask for, plus a few emails (pictures) now and then are also nice.

I think we should all get behind Satterlee Arms and support him, after all it's in all of our interest to have such a resource for mauser actions and it's in Stuart's interest, because he can earn a living doing what he enjoys doing.

I think that is a fair statement.

I would wish Stuart every success!

I would echo that as well. Communication is KEY but so hard for most to understand. I own a business in the service industry and my people come to me with job issues or problems and my first question is, What does the customer want? It really is that simple. Communicate the issues to the customer and they become part of your solution not part of the problem. Again it really is that simple. People by and large are understanding and WANT to HELP!

Salma didn't answer because I told her not to, sorry about that man.

I for one am very glad that Stuart's work is getting out there, not just for his reputation but because it is good work from pics and reports and if he had to close shop that would be one less thing for me to get to fantasize about.

I am also glad that 22wrf does not know my gunsmith or come far enough west to visit his shop. (and no, I won't tell you).

Red

quote:

Originally posted by Dago Red:
I am also glad that 22wrf does not know my gunsmith or come far enough west to visit his shop. (and no, I won't tell you).

Red

Howard, I would be more than willing to pay the bill for a deep sea fishing trip if we could include WRF and swamp.

I am glad, mostly for Stuart! We need this sort of craftsmanship today, just work on talking to the customers and all will be good for all of us.

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...