but I was allowed to snap a few pics.

It's called a lathe and it looks like it's chambering a barrel !

That lathe was old when Christ was in diapers.

you mean thats not one of them CNC thingys I read about?

Allen

Not to disparage the guy's work, but indicating the outside of the barrel is useless. For that kind of precision, why bother using a spider at all?

quote:

Originally posted by Westpac:
Not to disparage the guy's work, but indicating the outside of the barrel is useless. For that kind of precision, why bother using a spider at all?

There you go again, being rational.

From that picture, I find it very difficult to determine, with any degree of certainty, how the barrel was indicated. Am I missing something?

The short threads on the barrel shank suggest that the barrel is going on a Mauser.
One doesn't need to get too fussy about barrels going on Mausers. Now, if it were going on a BAT, Nesika, Kelbly's, Stiller, Hart, or other custom action or a blueprinted Remingtion, a much higher level of machining expertise would be called for.

OMJ, you're probably right. It's just a new barrel possibly going on a Mauser. How good does it have to be...

Eddie, I was going by the presence of the dial and stand at the back end of the machine, along with the barrel extending beyond the table, putting the bore out of reach for that particular set up, along with the use of a spider. I just assumed that's how he had set up that end.

I don't fault the guy for not spending much time dialing in that end of the barrel as I pretty much ignore the muzzle end myself when chambering through the head stock. I just thought it odd that someone who isn't using some type of a floating reamer holder would be indicating that end of the barrel in the first place and the O.D. at that. That's all I was commenting on.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by OMJ:
The short threads on the barrel shank suggest that the barrel is going on a Mauser.
One doesn't need to get too fussy about barrels going on Mausers.

Maybe in your shop. When I'm working on somebody else's stuff they all get the same attention to detail.

Westpac, I dial'em in like you do when in the headstock. The chamber end gets dialed in dead nuts perfect and sometimes the muzzle is waving at you. I try not to let customers see that as it's sometimes hard to explain to their satisfaction.
I use one of Greg Tannels holders. What do you use? Jim

Some of what I was told was over my head. I did hear that the chamber end was indicated on the bore not the outside of the barrel.

Rich

Looks to me as if the indicator is just sitting there and not on the barrel--

Jim, I use the PT&G Bald Eagle. I worry more about the first 8 or so inches than anything else. Yes Dustoffer, it's just sitting there. Usual practice is to remove the indicator when chambering.

Sorry, I had to. . . .

This is one of those CNC Thingys

Jim White and Westpac, what is deadnuts? How do you indicate and how do you hold it in the lathe?
Butch

That lathe is so old...

it was reaming barrels before gunpowder was invented.

Old doesn't mean squat. Worn out does. One nice thing about that older lathe unlike so mnay of its counterparts is that it has a short headstock and apparently a large spindle bore. You can actually chamber through the headstock.

It's more about the operator than the equipment. The best equipment in the hands of an idiot is worthless.

And to be fair, I can't tell from the pic if he is really indicating off the OD. If so, bad choice.

I find it odd that no one has commented on the fact that the gear-train cover has been removed. This is a REAL nasty accident waiting to happen. My South Bend never gets operated with the cover open. Particularly in back-gear drive, those gears will slice off a finger like it was butter!

i wish i had a clue how to do work like this. i love this forum, i learn something new every day.
james

He probably removed the cover so he could install the spider. Some lathes have the hole in the cover only slightly larger than the spindle hole. I enlarged the cover hole on my 13x40 so I could leave the cover and spider both in place. Saves a lot of work and time. Bill

quote:

Originally posted by dustoffer:
Looks to me as if the indicator is just sitting there and not on the barrel--

That's what I was thinking, it was just placed there to get it out of the way when not in use.

It doesn't look like there's any other place in that shop to store it.

OMJ, Mauser not fussy ?? In gunsmithing school they told us that properly the barrel is machined to have a snug thread and index on both shoulders !....Rusty , where does the barrel go in that THING ??

He is using a JGS floating reamer holder. The old Southbend lathe with good and properly fitted headstock bushings can do an excellent barrel job. You can chamber in the headstock with worn out ways with no effect on the chamber job.
That being said, I do not chamber that way.
Butch

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
Jim White and Westpac, what is deadnuts? How do you indicate and how do you hold it in the lathe?
Butch

An indicator rod is inserted into the chamber end of the barrel which is held in a 4 jaw chuck. 6 or 8 inches of the rod sticks out and I put two indicators against the rod that read to .0005. When there is no movement on the dial when the barrel is rotated it is deemed to be "dead nuts" It doesn't much matter what the muzzle end is doing as the chamber will be perfect with this method. Jim

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
Jim White and Westpac, what is deadnuts? How do you indicate and how do you hold it in the lathe?
Butch

Butch, I never use the term "deadnuts", but, it is a good one to define a 0.000 reading.

Oh yeah almost forgot, if I have to use the headstock for chambering, I put a 1/4 round wire ring between the jaws of my 4 jaw chuck and the cylinder portion of the barrel. That ring being round, contacts a very small portion of the barrel which makes it a breeze to adjust the spider to correct the lateral alignment at the chamber end without the full length of the chucks jaw to contend with. Like gripping the barrel with the tips of your fingers instead of the whole hand. Works really slick.

My preferred way to do the job is with the roller bearing steady rest, using the 4 jaw, and ring, at the muzzle, to set lateral alignment.

th desk is messy, too... anything else, guys?

quote:

Originally posted by tin can:
th desk is messy, too... anything else, guys?

What desk?

At least he has one, I don't.

If you think that is messy you must have OCD

look at the photo, guys. It is a 6-jaw chuck used with a floating reamer holder. You cannot indicate anything in on a 6-jaw chuck. Normally a good one runs very true -- close to collet accuracy. It is not possible, however, to indicate the breech with this setup.

That is not to say that you cannot do excellent work in a setup like this. I personally prefer to hold the muzzle in the chuck and the breech in the steady rest, but, as I say, that is just my personal preference.

Clemson

quote:

Originally posted by Clemson:
look at the photo, guys. It is a 6-jaw chuck used with a floating reamer holder. You cannot indicate anything in on a 6-jaw chuck. Normally a good one runs very true -- close to collet accuracy. It is not possible, however, to indicate the breech with this setup.

That is not to say that you cannot do excellent work in a setup like this. I personally prefer to hold the muzzle in the chuck and the breech in the steady rest, but, as I say, that is just my personal preference.

Clemson

There were/are several makers of 6 jaw chucks that allow fine adjustment. Buck still makes one and Burnerd used to, are they still around?

Yep. Those are the "Set-True" type. I think the one pictured is a conventional scroll chuck without the set-true feature.

Clemson

I don't have that chuck in hand, but it sure looks to be a "set-tru" type to me. Buck, Bison and a host of imports sell both 3 and 6 jaw scroll chucks with this adjustable feature.

If you look at the chuck, you can see the backplate is smaller than the chuck, and the chuck body has two parts. The front part holds the jaws and the scroll, the back part has the 4 adjustment screws for moving the body on the backplate. The pinion is not visible, but sits between the back and body of the chuck and would be at least twice as large as those visible adjustiing screws. The pinion drives the scroll to close all jaws evenly around the work, then the 4 screws can be adjusted to "center" the work to get as close to zero runout as you can measure.

I don't understand why the 6 jaw chuck? The major advantage of these is with thin walled tubing. They are no more or less accurate, they just spread the clamping force over a larger area to grip delicate tubing better.

That lathe is capable of very acurate work, and while old, is newer than any of the 4 I currently have. The only question I have is why the drill chuck in the floating holder? Why not set up the reamer directly in the holder, maybe with a small brass collar if not the correct size?

Taht shop looks like it was "cleaned up" for a picture; much neater than mine. No chips in the lathe pan, nice orderly workbench. Maybe OCD or just plain neatnick! (actually I am jealous of what I consider the luxtury of taking the time to clean and organize).

Roger

Because I'd eventually like to learn to do this...

Is there anything actually wrong with using three jaws in a six jaw buck chuck, indicating off the breech bore, and a floating reamer?

Thanks,

flaco

If you look at JGS catalog, you will see a chuck in their floating reamer holder.
Butch

Mr Lambert and others

Help me out here, I get the feeling I am missing something simple. I don't understand how one can hold a reamer in what looks to be a three jaw drill chuck? The reamers I have either have a square or two flats. I have seen reamers driven with a center or "contained" and floating in a loose drill chuck, but then you would not be using the floating holder.

I am sure JGS and others know what they are doing, I just don't understand.

To me a fitted bushing or collar would be needed for the jaws to grab. If so, why not fit that bushing to the holder?

I know there are always many ways to "correctly" do machine work. I am not trying to be arguementative or difficult, I just trying to understand and learn. I appreciate your patients with my lack of understanding. I haven't bought any reamers for several years, and I don't have the curent catalogs to search. I was not able to find a picture of the reamer holder on the web site for the JRS catalog, but I do note they sell it with and without the chuck.

Thanks in advance for any help with this.

Roger

Roger,
My catalog shows the pic. The chuck as shown above is on the end of the floating reamer holder. My reamers are round and would fit in a check. I do not use a JGS or any other other floating reamer holder. My home made setup is similar to the Bald Eagle pusher. I have an anodized piece of round aluminum that slides over the reamer with a set screw in the side that works on one of the flats on the reamer. It has a short handle coming off of it to hold to. I turned a piece that looks like a car valve that fits in the chuck in the tailstock as a pusher. I have and do not use a Clymer floating holder. I just like what I'm using at the present.
Butch

Is that George B's shop?

Yes. I had no ideal is was such a big deal. It's gonna be a 7x57.. Installed on a Polish Radom? small ring large thread. Not the best of choices so I'm told. George has a Logan for sale if anyone wants to pick it up

quote:

Originally posted by yeti:
Is that George B's shop?