I have one of these I picked up a while ago. I'm trying to figure out what manner of Mauser it was intended for. I'd really like to know what kind of sights were on it - I'm assuming some type of band front sight like a K-98 or M-48, but what about the rear sight? The part of the barrel machined for the rear sight base is way too small for a VZ-24 sized band. Maybe a hint of where to buy the correct parts?

Todd

[ 06-17-2003, 02:19: Message edited by: Todd Getzen ]

It might be for a 95 Mauser.

I had thought of a non-98 origin, but it's a large ring barrel.

Todd

Tod if you're referring to the 19.5" 7x57 barrels memory serves me that those were made by FN as replacement barrels for the Steyr Model 1912s.

[ 06-17-2003, 21:40: Message edited by: D Humbarger ]

I built a sporter some years ago with one of these barrels and have been well pleased with it. With the fast twist rifling you will need to keep velocity around 2,600 fps to get accuracy with bullets lighter than 154 grains. The 19.5 inch barrel I bought from Numrich was manufactured by DWM. There should be a script letter B enclosed by a circle stamped on the chamber end. I believe this stands for Brazil. DWM made a Model 1907 for Brazil that had a 19.5 inch barrel. It is likely these barrels were intended as replacements. A picture of this rifle appears on page 145 of Mauser Bolt Rifles, 3rd Edition. The barrel is contoured to take old stlye Mauser band sights with a smaller diameter band than is found on VZ-24, K-98, etc. Rear sights were once available through Sprigfield Sporters. Numrich may have some. Specify 1907 Carbine.

[ 06-18-2003, 17:01: Message edited by: Bobster ]

Thanks for the replies everyone. I will pursue the Brazilian angle, it should not be hard to track down a nice Brazilian receiver. It might say 1908 on the ring instead of 1907, but that's ok. It will be easier than finding a Steyr -- I can't even find a whole one for my Mauser collection.

Bobster, any ideas re: the proper stock for that carbine? I was thinking of using a VZ-24 stock cut down and reshaped, with an M-48 spring securing the bands -- the only problem would be the slightly large barrel channel, but that would not show and might even help accuracy . I'm sure the swivels would be all wrong too; I'm not super picky, and don't intend to pass this off as the 'real deal' but it might as well be historically accurate.

I know working backwards from a barrel is silly and likely twice as many $$ as just buying a 1907 carbine, but, well, that ain't the point if you know what I mean.

Thanks,
Todd

At one point there were new 30" infantry rifle 7mm barrels available too, I got one but sold it off without every using it.

A second stocking option occurred to me -- I could use a 98/22 stock and cut it down. It would probably be more correct in terms of stock hardware, with a bolt-takedown donut in the stock and sling attachment in the toeline. I may try that tonight; I'm betting a VZ-24 handguard would cut down about right also.

I located a Brazilian 1908 receiver in my garage but I'm hoping I can track down one in like new condition also.

Todd

Todd,

The 98/22 angle will work as you described as will a 1908 Brazilian long rifle stockset. SARCO was advertising complete 1908's with rotten barrels recently. This might get you a good action and wood for a donor and have correct markings for a Brazilian reproduction project. Numrich has a "South American" stock they are selling for around $50 which might work. Springfield Sporters imported the carbines about 9 years ago and if you are lucky they may have a stock laying around.You will need to obtain a carbine/short rifle handguard to fit the shorter base rear sight. Last time I checked, Numrich had these. As you pointed out, the lower band cut will be the problem. Moving the band back to match the barrel contour will leave and unsightly mortise where the band spring used to be.If you are handy though, a patch could be cut and glued in to hide it. You may also have to shorten the handguard to match. In this case the VZ-24 stock may be your answer.You can move the rear band anywhere and only leave a small hole. If you can't find an original rear sight, a 1909 Argentine rear sight will work. The 1907 used a forend cap similar to a Swedish Mauser and these may be hard to find. A nice compromise might be using your barrel to produce a Model 1908 Brazilian Short Rifle look-alike(p.147, Mauser Bolt Rifles). It had a longer barrel, but used all of the same furniture as the 1908 long rifle. All You would have to do is use the 1908 long rifle or 98/22 stockset and shoten it appropriately.

Bobster

[ 06-20-2003, 18:15: Message edited by: Bobster ]

Bobster,

I haven't seen a complete 1908 or 1907 carbine in the flesh. Was the lower band secured with a stock spring like the 98/22, a screw like the VZ-24, or a single spring bridging upper and lower bands like M-48? The latter would be the easiest option for hiding the existing spring cut in the stock. I was planning on setting it up to look like a VZ-24 or one of the Persian carbines, instead of stocked to the muzzle like a 94 Swede.

This should be lots of fun.

One more question, bent bolt or straight bolt is proper?

Todd

Todd,

The 1907 lower band appears to be retained in a manner similar to the Swedish Mauser-with a spring clip on the underside of the stock. The 1908 used a single spring retainer. Bolt was bent in both models. There was no stock relief cut.

I like your idea of the Iranian carbine. I'm looking at a picture of one now made by CZ. Stock appears to be standard VZ-24 type , just shortened with a turned down bolt and stock relief cut. The VZ-24 stockset and hardware should work. SAMCO may have the front sights since they have been using the long rifles to make sporters. A standard 1908 rear sight could be used with the VZ-24 handguard and look correct.

Bobster

Some pics of the 'bastard carbine' as I have named it, so far. The action is just for modeling purposes (a sported 1909). The front end of the stock still needs some major re-shaping (trimming down).

I have found a fourth option for securing the bands, seen on Dutch police FN carbines -- a 98/22 style stock spring on EACH side of the stock, one holding each band. This cuts in half the space you would need if on the same side, as in the 98/22. This is probably what I will use, with a standard 98/22 "H" band and rear/lower with a sling attachment at the bottom only.





I was able to retain bayonet functionality!

Todd

A little further work today -- shaping the end of the forearm for the lower band, and cutting back the handguard to fit. I'm just shaping the handguard for practice, as I'm ordering a carbine one from Numrich. Still trying to decide if I want a handguard that runs up to the upper band, as in the VZ-24, or ends just after the lower band like the 98/22 -- probably will go with the latter.

By my measurements, and M-48 front sight will work (both .610 at the muzzle), and I will use the 1909 rear sight as Bobster suggested. \

I will keep you posted, if anyone is interested. If you have a spare crested South American (or other) standard length 98 action with intact charger hump just lying around, see my post in 'Classifieds' or e-mail me.

Todd

Todd,

I like it! If you are getting the carbine handguard, make sure the 1909 rear is carbine also. The opening and the sight base are shorter than the long rifle. Minumum elevation is 200m. Also, make sure your front sight base is high enough. The Model 48 base may not give you enough even with the highest M-98 blade available due to the short barrel. I have a Columbian .30-06 front base thats about 25% higher than the standard M48. In lieu of a spring, the upper band can be secured with a screw through the pin hole in the band. This was done in several models. You might be able to use a narrow lower band (98/22) and a K-98 type single spring retainer.

Bobster

[ 06-23-2003, 15:06: Message edited by: Bobster ]