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Will the 1909 Argie hold 4 or 5 9.3x62 down in mag? Can it lengthened a little for a slightly longer COL with out moving front wall forward & tigging it? Allen | ||
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I have a 9.3x57 on a M98 and it holds 5 down with the standard magazine. "Evil is powerless if the good are unafraid" -- Ronald Reagan "Ignorance of The People gives strength to totalitarians." Want to make just about anything work better? Keep the government as far away from it as possible, then step back and behold the wonderment and goodness. | |||
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I've used the 1909 for my PDK wildcat. Which is similar to a Gibbs. I can get 5 down can't remember if I needed a touch of file work on the box sides or not. If so it wasn't much. Yep you can lengthen the box. You will need to alter the feed ramp as well. As usual just my $.02 Paul K | |||
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More than one gunmaker has told me that the 1909 argie will only hold 4 9.3x62's down, and some file work can give you a little extra length. Matt FISH!! Heed the words of Winston Smith in Orwell's 1984: "Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right." | |||
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Four; I just did it with Matt's brass. Can it be lengthened? Not by very much without altering the box, but with the reamer I have, you can[t seat the bullets out any more than at the crimp groove, for Hornadys 286s. I chambered two of them today. | |||
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Even if it was only 4, do you really need more in a hunting rifle? Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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4 is 3 more than I ever use. usually. | |||
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Well you can't argue with that. My case has the shoulder start at 2.17" and is .46" in dia. I would have bet you several that I'm getting 5 down in a 1909. Going to have to check tomorrow. Several possibilities. My memory sucks again. It wasn't a 1909 bottom metal. I know it was smaller than 9.3 so maybe the bullet is the limit not the case shoulder dia and location. As usual just my $.02 Paul K | |||
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Well it bugged me enough to go pull it from the safe. The answer is. My answer was in error through a combination. My memory stinks and it wasn't a 1909. As usual just my $.02 Paul K | |||
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The 1909 bottom metal is pretty cramped. I had one in 30-06 and the unaltered 1909 bottom metal would barely hold 4 in the mag. I remember that the bolt had to really force the top round down when loading a 5th round into the chamber. As I recall the box was too narrow at the cartridge's shoulder, forcing them to stack "taller" than a correct width box. I would think that some file work would allow the 1909 bottom metal to hold 4 9.3x62 rounds without any problem. Jason "You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core." _______________________ Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt. Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure. -Jason Brown | |||
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That's good. 4 down & one in the chamber is perfect. It will get a bit of file work by someone who knows what they are doing. Certainly not by me! Lol Allen | |||
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Since the mauser feeds from the box you have issues getting 4 down and one in the chamber. You either have to alter the extractor so it will slip over the rim or load the mag box from the bottom (always a pain to me) or probably both. As usual just my $.02 Paul K | |||
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I will bet you a truck load of beer that in the 1909 I tried it in it would only hold 4. I have several more I will try today. Bullet dia is not the limiter and neither is the shoulder. The base is the limiting factor. Just tried it again in another one; 4 in the 1909. Tried a 98k; it will hold 5 but you can't close the bolt at all over #5. Now, of course they all will hold 5 8mms; remember that the 9.3x62 is a teeny bit bigger in the head than the cartridges that these actions were designed for. I mean for which these actions were designed. Now, if you are using converted 30-06 brass, you are back to 5 down with no problem. And yes, getting #5 under the extractor is a challenge; you can snap in in but it takes dexterity. 4 rounds is plenty anyway. As I said, it is 3 more than I ever use on one animal. | |||
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I'm glad I didn't bet because I was incorrect (hate to say "wrong" ) I was confusing two of my rifles. I have a 340PDK (basically a 338 Gibbs) built on a 1909 but it is built blind with a altered sheet metal 98 box. Since it is built blind it will only take 4 down. I can get 5 down in an FN or 98 box with a touch of work if I stay 358 and smaller. I get 5 down with 375s and 400s in a MKX with some file work. But it is so the 5th will load not allow the bolt to close over it. All this shows me is time to stop TRUSTING my memory and check the details. As usual just my $.02 Paul K | |||
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I hate it when that happens. I am trying to avoid getting old and so far my plan to live forever is working. | |||
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Make sure you try it first... 3/4 of my Mauser 98s pop over the rim no problem without any mods. | |||
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Anyone having difficulty with OAL and the original 09 box? | |||
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No. As for the mag allowing the extractor to pop over a round so you can get one into the chamber; don't forget that the 9.3 is larger at the base than other standard Mauser cartridges; and that extra brass adds up. I have not been able to make 5 fit into any Mauser yet. Now, if you inlet your mag box so there is some clearance between it and the mag, then yes, it will feed 5. Won't take much. | |||
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JonP, Are you having difficulty? There is plenty of length in an 09 magazine for the 9.3x62. CIP for 9.3x62 is 3.29", but OAL in most reloading manuals is just under 3.23". You'll have a few thousands to play with seating depth, but you will want to leave .002" to .003" clearance for cartridge cant to ensure flawless feeding. Filing a few thousandths from the front of the box will give you a little more room, but I wouldn't bother. The 9.3x62 earned its reputation at standard velocities, but being a low pressure round, you can juice it up a bit without seating out very far or without seating out at all. The bore diameter to case capacity ratio is very similar to the 308 Win, and you should find it about as easy to develop minute of dear and elk loads as the 308. Matt FISH!! Heed the words of Winston Smith in Orwell's 1984: "Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right." | |||
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Not only would I not bother with lengthening the box for longer OAL, with the PTG reamer, you can't chamber a cartridge with more oal than factory. It has no freebore; the throat starts immediately at the case mouth and tapers from there. | |||
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