I like old brno rifles, I was wondering what is the tell tale way of indentifying a true brno 21 or 22, saw a full stock 8x60 the other day at cabelas, but don't remember it being labeled anything different that most czech mausers, it just had the knurled reciever ring with the CZ circle on it. but the rest of the action didn't look any different than a vz 24, just at glance of course. also can the butterknife bolt handle be moded to clear a low scope?? aside from just changing out the handle??

As to the bolt handles both of the 21/22's that I have were modified. One was cut and welded and the other was ground down. The one that was ground down is still quite high and a compact scope was required to clear the bolt. The stock is really too low also.

There is another thread going where some praise these guns as "the finest sporters" I don't agree at all. I have two of them for the fun of it but they are just cute and hard to use.

The argument that they are the finest sporters infers, to me at least, that that means factory sporters. If thats the case it should be useable as it came from the factory once it was drilled and tappped as some rifles from that era were not.

Those guns have clumsy double set triggers that throw the LOP way off. So called safeties that don't lock the bolt close and if they did you cant reach them under a scope anyway.

There is way more. I am just getting warmed up.

The M70 pre 64 M70 is a far superior rifle.

On the postive side they are cute as I said. Thats more than enough reason to buy one.

i don't care about the saftey locking the bolt, and I actually prefer a low stock combined with a low mounted scope, not great for bench work, but it fits me just great for off hand and hunting use. why is the saftey hard to use?? what else do you not like??I guess you could prolly put on a win style saftey if you hated it that much

Pre-war commercial Brno's are large ring with stripper clip guide. They are known as a model A (half stock) or model B (full stock).

1942-48 are small ring with clip guide. Models 21 and 22 (721 and 722).

1949-54 are small ring with square bridges. Same models.

None have the model number marked anywhere. Besides having the CZ logo on the receiver ring, they all have a solid left wall (no thumb cut) and they will have a 2-digit number on the left side, indicating the year of proof.

I am an avid fan of the 8x60 and would like to know more about this rifle.

Never owned a 22, but the 21 is a small ring with square bridges. It's unmistakable. I like the safety, I put it about 3/4 of the way up and it works just like a F.N. The one I own has had the bolt handle modified so it can use low mounts. These rifles are a little awkward off the bench, but from any other position they work just fine. The whole rifle is very trim and beautiful to look at.

If both rifles were in the same caliber and same condition, I'd opt for the BRNO every time over an M70 (pre-64, push feed or classic).

Terry

Here is a closeup of a 21H action. You'll know it when you find one.

I stand corrected. Thanks Kurt.

Terry

quote:

don't care about the saftey locking the bolt, and I actually prefer a low stock combined with a low mounted scope, not great for bench work, but it fits me just great for off hand and hunting use.

cummins,

The problem is that the bolt just works open. If you carry a rifle on your left side with a sling like I do sometimes the bolt will touch your body from time to time. One old timer here quotes someone as saying that 21/22 bolts have been lost?

The ones I have are not made/designed right and there is no small detent to hold the bolt closed at all like other Mausers and m70s have.

If the bolt is not cut then there will be no low mounted scope unless its a scout scope on the barrel.

More later.

kurt,The 8x60 was in cabelas gun library, it had more of a round reviever ring that was knurled all around with a CZ logo on top, the back of the reciever ring was notched flat to mount a scope. so it look different than that 21h above, it was also a full stock, which I hate. they wanted $1600 for it

It's been pretty quiet on this topic since I made some critisims of the Brno 21/22's.

Another defect in the design/mfg. of these rifles is that the left bolt lug and therefore the actions left recess is too large in height and a cartridge can get temporarily stuck there. The M70 does not do this at all and it's left lug is about .045" smaller in height which eliminates this problem in 30-06 head size cartridges. One FN Mauser measures less than the Brno and it's much less of a problem.

Cummins Cowboy,

Thanks for the info. I sent them an e-mail to see if they have taken any pics of it yet, as I don't see it listed on the web site.

I'd like to find another a little more original than the one I own.

Terry

I have owned a dozen or so Mod 21 and 22 Brnos...you have the rare round receiver, most are double square bridge small ring actions and as far as I know the only double square bridge small ring actions every made by a factory????

They have the butter knife bolt handle, double sq. bridges on most, the safty is on the left side opposite the bolt and is a drop down to fire type...the rails and inside to the action are polished...The stocks are slim and have the rifle (21) has a simi schenable forend..the trigger guard is of the shotgun type and houses double triggers....rear sight is a rather long sleeve with an integral ramp that houses one standing and one flip up sight...the front sight is a barrel band, but you have to look real close as its melted into the barrel, in good light from the front or crown you can see the barrel band line on the crown....

Thats the best way to identify them, they so are marked on the left rail with the lots of unpronounceable words that I don't recall but have the Podnik address...

Approximately 40,000 Brno 21/22s were manufactured by Zbrojovka Brno from 1946-1954. The first 20,000 were made with round top receivers, from 1946-1948. The subsequent 20,000 were made with integral "square bridge" receivers for scope mounting, from 1949-1954. Most of the round top versions do not have bolt guide ribs, as do the later versions.

Fla3006,

These Brnos made without the bolt guide rib, is the receiver still machined for the slot?

Thx,

Mike

All of the commercial Brno receivers had the slot in the receiver for the bolt guide rib. I have seen the rib on wartime 42-43 bolts, and on the later 49-54 bolts. I have not seen the rib on postwar 45-48 bolts.

Kurt,

Thanks, that's what I thought.