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We got a number of Sako rifles, and I was trying to install scopes on them. I have some of the old Sako and Leupold mounts with split rings. The ones one clamps the bottom of the ring onto the in built bases on the rifle, put the scope in and tighten the top. Very simple, and the system worked. I have rifles with this system on that have worked for years, going all over the place for hunting, and never required any attention. Then someone brought in the new Sako mounts. That come in two separate pieces. A base that mounts onto the base, and rings that mount onto those. Why they have changed a working design is beyond me! | ||
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For lack of a better word, It is idiotic, I have wondered what they thought they were accomplishing when they redesigned the rings. BB | |||
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I agree to idiotic. But I think it goes a bit deeper. Now that I am an old fart, I see things that have served VERY well over the years being abandoned in favor of "new, big, fast, better, " and so on. I think this comes from a younger Cadre of "engineers" who just "know it all" and convince management that their stuff is better. "Old is bad and new is good." And for no particular reason. Just kick out the old stuff and get on with it. And if management needs more convincing, they are told "Well, if we build this new design and nothing else fits it, then everybody will have to buy the one we make and we will make more money...." So there's probably an economic component at work too. Of course if all this were not to have gone on over time, we would still be shooting with 3- foot long scopes mounted on the barrel, and the "latest thing" would be the B&L Balvar 8 with its weird mount with external adjustments. Or maybe flintlocks, who knows. But it does seem these days that a lot of things are designed by people with no "soul" and perhaps little common sense... And jeeez, right after I wrote that last sentence I realized that I had just perfectly described lawyers, accountants, and a lot of engineers....  A good job is sometimes just a series of expertly fixed fark-ups. Let's see.... is it 20 years experience or is it 1 years experience 20 times? And I will have you know that I am not an old fart. I am a curmudgeon. A curmudgeon is an old fart with an extensive vocabulary and a really bad attitude. | |||
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Most of it is driven to save money if a new design saves a few pennies per part during production or in use. The company gains overall in costs. One sees it in the vehicle industry all the time replace metal with plastic ect. If one save two cents per part for a couple million of parts your talking real money. So what if they don't last as long as long as they last long enough. | |||
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Because engineers like to engineer. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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The two-piece Sako Optilock rings are a puzzling anomaly. Saeed is right, why would you make a separate base for a rifle which already has a base machined into its receiver? I believe they have since been replaced with a one-piece Optilock ringmount. Still, either type Optilock mount is WAY unnecessarily high for most scopes with normal (sub-40mm) objectives. And, either Optilock is WAY heavier than necessary. I guess that's why you see the original Sako split rings keep going up in price. | |||
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Mike , we engineers also had a saying, "If it works don't mess with it " !! Today people buy only if it has the "cool factor " . I'm still working with the "does it work ? " factor !  | |||
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The old engineers thought that way...you should live in the high tech world...where engineers are promoted based on the number of new things they can implement as opposed to actual value delivered. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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The other reason not mentioned is that in many cases it forces the buyer to purchase proprietary mounts from the manufacturer at a premium. This creates a separate profit stream. The rifle can be sold at a lower margin (to gain share) then accessories at a high margin to maximize profit. Gun manufacturing is a business. Profit is king. If you made a gun that was efficient and made sense you'd go broke. Originally posted by <Quote> Saeed: We got a number of Sako rifles, and I was trying to install scopes on them. I have some of the old Sako and Leupold mounts with split rings. The ones one clamps the bottom of the ring onto the in built bases on the rifle, put the scope in and tighten the top. Very simple, and the system worked. I have rifles with this system on that have worked for years, going all over the place for hunting, and never required any attention. Then someone brought in the new Sako mounts. That come in two separate pieces. A base that mounts onto the base, and rings that mount onto those. Why they have changed a working design is beyond me![/QUOTE] | |||
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I agree, Saeed. I have never liked or used the Optilocks. I have used Talleys on my Sakos for many years. They are better than the Optilocks, and by the way, less expensive, by far. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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